66fan Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 12 minutes ago, PackFan4Life said: I mentioned this in another thread, Tonyan has the most to gain this offseason and even moreso now in this offense. Going to be interesting how he looks in the next camp on the LOS. I really do not know what they have in Baylis right now. I loved the Lewis and Kendricks fit- when they could run. I think those two are simply not worth moving forward anymore IMO. I do not think just releasing Graham is a good idea either- he has more value on this team then off it considering the contract in hand- but it sure is not in the base running plays unless you get something from him he hasn't shown his entire career. Maybe he applies himself diligently to stay relevant in the league now that he cannot run as well as he used to. I think you start with Graham and Tonyan and given the depth of this year's draft at TE, you do as Ray mentioned and seriously think about doubling up this year at this position. Another potential developmental Tight End is Allen Lazard. Last year at this time he was being mock drafted as someone that could grow into a receiving tight end. 6'5"- 227 lbs. Iowa State University's all time leading receiver. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PackFan4Life Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 12 minutes ago, Green19 said: I’d look at Kyle Shanahan’s offense and when it’s working at its best. If you want to see what the top end of what the packers offense could be... Titans offense is an outlier for LaFleur. They brought him in to be Kyle. The positive thing about that situation is LaFleur saw what he had there and called the game around that... TEs and RBs. So he wasn’t trying to force a system on his players. He had his players talents force a system on him. Marcus had he best year rushing with LaFleur. They were the 7th best rushing offense even when teams lined up to stop it because the passing game was bad. Those are all positives. Agreed, I looked at Shanahan much more than what he had with TN because that offense is a work in progress with a limited throwing attack. I still cannot get past the glaring need for an upgrade on the oline and TE to make this a run game that is respected enough to draw defenses into a 1 high look. The improvement of the oline and TE inline will make Jones special with 15 touches and Williams a viable grinder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 1 hour ago, PackFan4Life said: Based on what I have seen of the offenses that LeFleur wants to run, we really need to make investments in the oline and TE positions to make this work. Maybe even RB since we have seen that Jones does have durability issues. Even if Williams looks better behind an improved oline, I think a third horse is needed there as well. I saw one of the mocks in here with Coleman in it, that is not a bad looking fit with the right contract. At the WR positions, you just wonder if J-mon Moore is ever going to be able to digest the playbook. I think this offense may end up being easier for him to execute on the field because he is not reading as many things post snap as the previous system. If you can get that player to explode the way he did in college you have a very dangerous group of young WRs for this fit IMO. I don't want to go off track too much but why would Coleman want to come here with two young backs and why would we be near top money with them here already. We might draft a back but I can't see us signing any named running back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PackFan4Life Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 I am not even trying to address whether a player wants to come here - I said that is the right fit with the right contract. In no way am I stating it has to be Coleman or speculating what kind of contract he is going to get, because really I could care not about Coleman unless he is a Packer. I am saying that mold - for the most certain eventuality of missed snaps by Jones given his history and how much of just a true plodder/grinder type Williams has shown to be- having that third horse with the Coleman traits is a good idea. Replace Coleman with Edgar Bennet if it makes you feel good- the name is rarely the point of my thread unless I specifically mention someone already blessed in Titletown colors. Sorry if that is the way you digested that point because the name was not the focus, it was the mold/fit that I am trying to steer the discussion towards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 Just now, PackFan4Life said: I am not even trying to address whether a player wants to come here - I said that is the right fit with the right contract. In no way am I stating it has to be Coleman or speculating what kind of contract he is going to get, because really I could care not about Coleman unless he is a Packer. I am saying that mold - for the most certain eventuality of missed snaps by Jones given his history and how much of just a true plodder/grinder type Williams has shown to be- having that third horse with the Coleman traits is a good idea. Replace Coleman with Edgar Bennet if it makes you feel good- the name is rarely the point of my thread unless I specifically mention someone already blessed in Titletown colors. Sorry if that is the way you digested that point because the name was not the focus, it was the mold/fit that I am trying to steer the discussion towards. Oh I know it wasn't your main point. I just don't think we're signing a back, that's all I was saying. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 Delanie Walker is 34, ladies and gentlemen. If LaFleur was going to use him as a centerpiece to their offense before he got injured, Jimmy Graham at 32 will do just fine for LaFleur this coming season. Unless anybody honestly believes Walker at 34 this year is that much more physically capable at 2 years older than Graham will be at the start of next season, which I wouldn't doubt. People around here act like Graham was literally using a walker this year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikebpackfan Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 2 hours ago, cannondale said: MM is pretty well embedded to Green Bay. His wife is from here and a pretty high profile person not likely to leave. So, MM for OC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PackFan4Life Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 1 minute ago, Outpost31 said: Delanie Walker is 34, ladies and gentlemen. If LaFleur was going to use him as a centerpiece to their offense before he got injured, Jimmy Graham at 32 will do just fine for LaFleur this coming season. Unless anybody honestly believes Walker at 34 this year is that much more physically capable at 2 years older than Graham will be at the start of next season, which I wouldn't doubt. People around here act like Graham was literally using a walker this year. I am not down on Graham because I think he needs a walker, I am down on Graham in this offense because he is not going to garner respect in the run game for this offense. I think Graham certainly offers more to this team on the roster then cut based on his contract next year. There are ways we can envision where LeFleur can use Graham, it is just not as ideal given the action a lot of the more base plays come off the run threat. When you see Graham on the field, you defend pass and really do not need to respect anything he is going to attempt to do blocking for a runner other then getting in the way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 10 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: Delanie Walker is 34, ladies and gentlemen. If LaFleur was going to use him as a centerpiece to their offense before he got injured, Jimmy Graham at 32 will do just fine for LaFleur this coming season. Unless anybody honestly believes Walker at 34 this year is that much more physically capable at 2 years older than Graham will be at the start of next season, which I wouldn't doubt. People around here act like Graham was literally using a walker this year. This made me laugh. His legs did seem rather heavy at times tho. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyecatcher Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 Graham is going to have a big year next year. MM's offense was not very TE-centric. I think MLF will utilize what talents he has better than we've seen in a few years. This new coaching regime will breathe new life into the players and they will have a top 5 offense and a top 5 defense next year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyecatcher Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 The Packers had both forms last year. Arrogance with Rodgers and Inflexibility with MM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cannondale Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 (edited) I think the argument was why Graham wouldn't use the walker instead of dragging it behind him. In his defense, it's hard to see anything with a piano on your back. Did Delanie block ? Because we know Graham won't Edited January 10, 2019 by cannondale Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gopackgo247 Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 nothing wrong with Graham being slow, lots of slow TEs out there. there is everything wrong with Graham and his ability to break tackles. i feel like he is tackled by the first defender on seemingly every play. and that defender is usually a much much smaller DB. its crazy to me how he doesn't break more tackles or at least fall forward for a few yards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sasquatch Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 With regard to the "complacency" issue, it was nice to see Murphy acknowledge this yesterday, but in reality, he's just as much responsible for allowing complacency to fester. His hands were off the wheel for too long. Acknowledgment is a good first step, and now we're seeing the rubber-band effect on full display. I might recommend "Good to Great" by Jim Collins as some light reading for Murphy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craig Posted January 10, 2019 Share Posted January 10, 2019 50 minutes ago, PackFan4Life said: ...I am down on Graham in this offense because he is not going to garner respect in the run game for this offense. I think Graham certainly offers more to this team on the roster then cut based on his contract next year. There are ways we can envision where LeFleur can use Graham, it is just not as ideal given the action a lot of the more base plays come off the run threat. When you see Graham on the field, you defend pass and really do not need to respect anything he is going to attempt to do blocking for a runner other then getting in the way. Yeah, what LaFleur will want to do with Graham and the run game is really interesting. Simplistically I'd think some new ideas that love to use TE's and maybe are more creative for getting guys open *might* seem really productive for Graham, and he might get more targets and catches. I also suspect that like a lot of guys, more touches can also result in more energy and reduced % of drops. (Everything slows down a little the more touches you get....) Whereas this year he had a lot of drops, after the hand injury but also before. But his blocking issues certainly don't seem to facilitate the emphasis on running and keeping defenses uncertain on run-vs-pass. . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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