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Draft Discussion 2019

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On 2/15/2019 at 11:48 AM, TheKillerNacho said:

Hes not even going to be there at 13...........

Daniel Jones is a QB that reminds me of Josh Freeman coming out of Kansas State. Big, athletic guy that has some mechanical issues with accuracy but has a big arm and can make plays with his legs. I wouldn't touch him in the first round but 2nd round would be nice. 

Murray is the only QB going round 1 in my opinion, if he was three inches taller, he would be going #1 no questions asked. If Miami can somehow pull off a trade to move ahead and not give up so much draft assets (maybe pick 13th with next years 1st rounder to Bucs #5 pick) Miami would have the 2nd most talented QB in the AFC East (behind Brady) and he is only a rookie. 

If any team makes Miami trade significant assets of picks to move up, I would pass and go BPA and try next year. We're in a full rebuild mode, trading away draft picks is not good business, even if you're drafting a stud QB. HE NEEDS HELP.

#Finsup

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I'd take Haskins but I think there's no way he'd get past NYG. I'd take Murray only if we were a QB away from being a serious contender. He's the only other QB I'd take in R1, but I think he's too risky to forgo surer options in the trenches.

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On 2/18/2019 at 9:28 PM, finsfan47 said:

Daniel Jones is a QB that reminds me of Josh Freeman coming out of Kansas State. Big, athletic guy that has some mechanical issues with accuracy but has a big arm and can make plays with his legs. I wouldn't touch him in the first round but 2nd round would be nice. 

Murray is the only QB going round 1 in my opinion, if he was three inches taller, he would be going #1 no questions asked. If Miami can somehow pull off a trade to move ahead and not give up so much draft assets (maybe pick 13th with next years 1st rounder to Bucs #5 pick) Miami would have the 2nd most talented QB in the AFC East (behind Brady) and he is only a rookie. 

If any team makes Miami trade significant assets of picks to move up, I would pass and go BPA and try next year. We're in a full rebuild mode, trading away draft picks is not good business, even if you're drafting a stud QB. HE NEEDS HELP.

#Finsup

Daniel Jones reminds me more of Carson Wentz, personally - but meh.

I'm really not attached to a QB in R1. If we do go QB, I hope it's Jones. I really can't get over Murray's frame (the height doesn't worry me as much), but I feel like he's just not going to be durable enough at the NFL level

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On 2/16/2019 at 12:59 AM, Emerica said:

That's crazy to me. He's the one guy I want this team to steer clear from. He is Tannehill 2.0. 

Like freak of nature said, I wouldn't touch him until late 2nd. Obviously not going to last until then but just saying.

I’m interested in Haskins and Murray ( if Murray is indeed over 200lbs at the combine, runs sub 4.5 and is 5’10” or taller )........Jones over either of those guys is crazy IMO.  I don’t expect to see Jones as a top 10 pick like some experts are claiming.......Maybe late first if a team really likes him they could trade back into round 1 giving up a pick for next year.

No way I even start looking at him until round 2 personally.  While he is an above average athlete for the position, has great measurables at 6’5” 225lbs, and can throw the ball to the outside deep routes with nice touch........He has timing issues that come from shaky footwork and body positioning......He makes some routine decisions look shaky ( even when running a simple option scheme ).....His accuracy has been far from elite and his production has been below average for a QB that is being considered in the top tier of the 2019 draft class.  I would draft Stidham and Grier before Jones ( personally ).

IMO his NFL comparison is Blake Bortles.  Great measurables, inconsistent accuracy, low passing yardage production, can hit open receivers deep outside and underneath in soft coverage, best plays come from running the ball, cannot throw a player open.

Edited by Swampbilly

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2 hours ago, Swampbilly said:

I’m interested in Haskins and Murray ( if Murray is indeed over 200lbs at the combine, runs sub 4.5 and is 5’10” or taller )........Jones over either of those guys is crazy IMO.  I don’t expect to see Jones as a top 10 pick like some experts are claiming.......Maybe late first if a team really likes him they could trade back into round 1 giving up a pick for next year.

No way I even start looking at him until round 2 personally.  While he is an above average athlete for the position, has great measurables at 6’5” 225lbs, and can throw the ball to the outside deep routes with nice touch........He has timing issues that come from shaky footwork and body positioning......He makes some routine decisions look shaky ( even when running a simple option scheme ).....His accuracy has been far from elite and his production has been below average for a QB that is being considered in the top tier of the 2019 draft class.  I would draft Stidham and Grier before Jones ( personally ).

IMO his NFL comparison is Blake Bortles.  Great measurables, inconsistent accuracy, low passing yardage production, can hit open receivers deep outside and underneath in soft coverage, best plays come from running the ball, cannot throw a player open.

I couldn't agree more with Daniel Jones. If he was even close to Carson Wentz he would be #1 QB no questions asked. I have my QB rankings as

1. Murray

2. Haskins

3. Lock

4. Grier

5. Jones

I do believe Murray will be over 200lbs, he will be under 5'10 however but with that weight on such a short stature, he's rock solid. I am ALL IN in trading future picks for the shot of drafting Murray.

We have never seen a QB that is super athletic that does not rely on hit feet as he does his arm. He has a cannon of an arm, super accurate, and can make people miss in open field. HE HAS TO BE OUR GUY. Short statures in my opinion are bogus. Aaron Donald is the 2 time defensive player of the year, yet he is 6'0 285lbs which is small for D-linemen.

Another example is Antonio Brown; he is 5'10, 180 lbs yet he has been the most consistent WR in the NFL since Jerry Rice. Another guy who's height and weight has not stopped him from being dominate. 

And my favorite example, our own All-Pro LB Zack Thomas. He was "too slow, too short, not big enough" to play in the NFL and got drafted in the 5th round (what a steal). The rest is history as he has been arguably the best LB Miami has had in the past 30 years.

My point is forget his height and weight, can the guy play? In Murray's sake, he dominated NCAA football like no one we have ever seen. He is top QB and should be top priority to FINALLY have a legit QB.

Image result for kyler murray miami

GO DRAFT MURRAY GRIER!

#FinsUp

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17 hours ago, finsfan47 said:

I couldn't agree more with Daniel Jones. If he was even close to Carson Wentz he would be #1 QB no questions asked. I have my QB rankings as

1. Murray

2. Haskins

3. Lock

4. Grier

5. Jones

I do believe Murray will be over 200lbs, he will be under 5'10 however but with that weight on such a short stature, he's rock solid. I am ALL IN in trading future picks for the shot of drafting Murray.

We have never seen a QB that is super athletic that does not rely on hit feet as he does his arm. He has a cannon of an arm, super accurate, and can make people miss in open field. HE HAS TO BE OUR GUY. Short statures in my opinion are bogus. Aaron Donald is the 2 time defensive player of the year, yet he is 6'0 285lbs which is small for D-linemen.

Another example is Antonio Brown; he is 5'10, 180 lbs yet he has been the most consistent WR in the NFL since Jerry Rice. Another guy who's height and weight has not stopped him from being dominate. 

And my favorite example, our own All-Pro LB Zack Thomas. He was "too slow, too short, not big enough" to play in the NFL and got drafted in the 5th round (what a steal). The rest is history as he has been arguably the best LB Miami has had in the past 30 years.

My point is forget his height and weight, can the guy play? In Murray's sake, he dominated NCAA football like no one we have ever seen. He is top QB and should be top priority to FINALLY have a legit QB.

Image result for kyler murray miami

GO DRAFT MURRAY GRIER!

#FinsUp

Lock and Grier over Jones is crazy to me. Just crazy. Lock has accuracy issues (and very few QBs with accuracy issues coming out have been able to fix it). Grier seems pretty pedestrian.

Jones meanwhile is getting 1st QB buzz and has some incredible upside. Rumors are the Redskins are absolutely in love with him though.

We'll see, I guess. QBs all have flaws this year - I'd much rather improve at the trenches with this draft. But IF we take a QB, I'd like it to be Jones or Haskins (Haskins definitely won't be available though).

No one has said those of small frames can't be successful in the NFL - but its definitely more the exception than the rule. Size matters. Some players are great enough to overcome it. I think it hurts a QB more than most positions  - need to see over the OL and the lower point of release leads to batted balls.  But  I'm much more concerned about how his frame will hold up behind our horrible interior OL.

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11 hours ago, TheKillerNacho said:

Lock and Grier over Jones is crazy to me. Just crazy. Lock has accuracy issues (and very few QBs with accuracy issues coming out have been able to fix it). Grier seems pretty pedestrian.

Jones meanwhile is getting 1st QB buzz and has some incredible upside. Rumors are the Redskins are absolutely in love with him though.

We'll see, I guess. QBs all have flaws this year - I'd much rather improve at the trenches with this draft. But IF we take a QB, I'd like it to be Jones or Haskins (Haskins definitely won't be available though).

No one has said those of small frames can't be successful in the NFL - but its definitely more the exception than the rule. Size matters. Some players are great enough to overcome it. I think it hurts a QB more than most positions  - need to see over the OL and the lower point of release leads to batted balls.  But  I'm much more concerned about how his frame will hold up behind our horrible interior OL.

I find it hard to believe you like Jones that much to spend the #13 pick on him. Lock had tougher competition and recorded better numbers than Jones.

STATS
2018
2017
2016
2015
 
CMP ATT CMP% YDS AVG TD INT LNG RTG
275 437 62.9 3,498 8.0 28 8 86 147.7

 

Daniel Jones meanwhile:

Career Stats

STATS
2018
2017
2016
 
CMP ATT CMP% YDS AVG TD INT LNG RTG
237 392 60.5 2,674 6.8 22 9 85 131.7

 

Lock had fewer picks, more yards, and better completion %. Its not hard to see why I have Lock over Jones. He will go top 10 to either Jags or Broncos. Grier meanwhile:

Career Stats

STATS
2018
2017
2015
 
CMP ATT CMP% YDS AVG TD INT LNG RTG
266 397 67.0 3,864 9.7 37 8 82 175.5

Grier reminds me of a better version of Andy Dalton. If we can't draft Murray, I would not be upset using a 2nd or 3rd round on Will Grier. 

Jones looks the part but something about him scares me off using a 1st or 2nd round pick on him.

This is just my opinion, not trying to bash you. Everyone has different rankings, to each its own.

I can't wait to see the combine and find out which free agents we're going after.

 

#Finsup

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On 2/20/2019 at 2:45 PM, finsfan47 said:

I couldn't agree more with Daniel Jones. If he was even close to Carson Wentz he would be #1 QB no questions asked. I have my QB rankings as

1. Murray

2. Haskins

3. Lock

4. Grier

5. Jones

I do believe Murray will be over 200lbs, he will be under 5'10 however but with that weight on such a short stature, he's rock solid. I am ALL IN in trading future picks for the shot of drafting Murray.

We have never seen a QB that is super athletic that does not rely on hit feet as he does his arm. He has a cannon of an arm, super accurate, and can make people miss in open field. HE HAS TO BE OUR GUY. Short statures in my opinion are bogus. Aaron Donald is the 2 time defensive player of the year, yet he is 6'0 285lbs which is small for D-linemen.

Another example is Antonio Brown; he is 5'10, 180 lbs yet he has been the most consistent WR in the NFL since Jerry Rice. Another guy who's height and weight has not stopped him from being dominate. 

And my favorite example, our own All-Pro LB Zack Thomas. He was "too slow, too short, not big enough" to play in the NFL and got drafted in the 5th round (what a steal). The rest is history as he has been arguably the best LB Miami has had in the past 30 years.

My point is forget his height and weight, can the guy play? In Murray's sake, he dominated NCAA football like no one we have ever seen. He is top QB and should be top priority to FINALLY have a legit QB.

Image result for kyler murray miami

GO DRAFT MURRAY GRIER!

#FinsUp

Only issue I have is Murray over Haskins.  I see Haskins as the clear #1 QB this draft and probably the #1 overall pick.  Not only does he have near ideal measurables for the position but he even out produced Murray in; completion percentage, completions, attempts, yards, and TD's.........All while playing against better Defenses.

Additionally, I would also spend a 2nd round pick on Grier.

Edited by Swampbilly

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Hey guys im gonna do a mock and nobody knows their team better than their fans own fans who watch all the games and oay attention to all the players, off season news, needs, etc. Can you guys shoot me a list of the Top 5 draft prospects you would want with your 1st and 2nd Round picks? Or at least 1st Round. Thank you!

Also any chance you guys pick Murray at 13? Seems he is going to you guys in 85% of mocks. 

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1 hour ago, BayRaider said:

Hey guys im gonna do a mock and nobody knows their team better than their fans own fans who watch all the games and oay attention to all the players, off season news, needs, etc. Can you guys shoot me a list of the Top 5 draft prospects you would want with your 1st and 2nd Round picks? Or at least 1st Round. Thank you!

Also any chance you guys pick Murray at 13? Seems he is going to you guys in 85% of mocks. 

We don't know what the Miami FO is thinking with regards to Murray. I think the fanbase is split.

As far as mocking goes, I'm saying the BPA at DL in the 1st (with a preference to the DE) and the BPA from DL/OL in the 2nd. I' be cool with DL in R1 and R2 if the value is there. Ideally, I'd love to trade down and have 4 picks in the first 3 rounds. That would really help the rebuilding process. I anticipate Quinn and Branch cut, and Wake might not return.

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On 2/23/2019 at 9:18 AM, Swampbilly said:

Only issue I have is Murray over Haskins.  I see Haskins as the clear #1 QB this draft and probably the #1 overall pick.  Not only does he have near ideal measurables for the position but he even out produced Murray in; completion percentage, completions, attempts, yards, and TD's.........All while playing against better Defenses.

Additionally, I would also spend a 2nd round pick on Grier.

This is what I find funny.  You're right.  Haskins IS the clear #1 QB in this draft.  Let's be clear... "IN THIS DRAFT".  Just because you need a QB, doesn't mean you should settle for whats available in THIS PARTICULAR DRAFT!  The media hypes these QBs because it drives ratings.  

2011 - Christian Ponder and Blaine Gabbert went in the first because teams chased need.

2012 - RGIII, Ryan Tannehill (Luke Kuechly was taken with the next pick) and Brandon Weeden all went in the 1st because teams chased a QB

2013 - EJ Manuel was the only QB taken in the 1st round.  This was the year everyone thought Geno Smith was a can't miss prospect and he slid to second round.  I guess GM's started to get smart....

2014 - Blake Bortles, Johnny Manziel and Teddy Bridgewater all went in the 1st round.  I guess all those teams wish they would have taken Derek Carr.....

2015 - Jamies Winston and Marcus Mariota were "clear cut can't miss prospects".  Of everyone in the thread these are the best two so far, but I wouldn't say either are Top 20 in the NFL.

If you are a true fan, let this draft class go and take your lumps in 2019.  Miami has failed in the first round sooooo many times.  They have a need at every single position.  Take the best player on your board each time you're on the clock.

I'm hoping for Oliver, Sweat or trade back for more picks.

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1 hour ago, Rgossett07 said:

This is what I find funny.  You're right.  Haskins IS the clear #1 QB in this draft.  Let's be clear... "IN THIS DRAFT".  Just because you need a QB, doesn't mean you should settle for whats available in THIS PARTICULAR DRAFT!  The media hypes these QBs because it drives ratings.  

 

I think Haskins is legit, and Murray is a huge wildcard. I don't like anyone else at QB.

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1 hour ago, freak_of_nature said:

I think Haskins is legit, and Murray is a huge wildcard. I don't like anyone else at QB.

I completely Agree.  Haskins is legit.......he would be a top 5 pick in almost any draft since 2010....even in 2012 IMO.  Near prototype size, can make every throw.  Athletic enough to extend plays but primarily a pocket passer, high collegiate production in a conference with formidable defense.  Only draw back is somewhat small sample size comparatively, being he missed some time to injury and has about 1 season as a full time starter........

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3 hours ago, Rgossett07 said:

This is what I find funny.  You're right.  Haskins IS the clear #1 QB in this draft.  Let's be clear... "IN THIS DRAFT".  Just because you need a QB, doesn't mean you should settle for whats available in THIS PARTICULAR DRAFT!  The media hypes these QBs because it drives ratings.  

2011 - Christian Ponder and Blaine Gabbert went in the first because teams chased need.

2012 - RGIII, Ryan Tannehill (Luke Kuechly was taken with the next pick) and Brandon Weeden all went in the 1st because teams chased a QB

2013 - EJ Manuel was the only QB taken in the 1st round.  This was the year everyone thought Geno Smith was a can't miss prospect and he slid to second round.  I guess GM's started to get smart....

2014 - Blake Bortles, Johnny Manziel and Teddy Bridgewater all went in the 1st round.  I guess all those teams wish they would have taken Derek Carr.....

2015 - Jamies Winston and Marcus Mariota were "clear cut can't miss prospects".  Of everyone in the thread these are the best two so far, but I wouldn't say either are Top 20 in the NFL.

If you are a true fan, let this draft class go and take your lumps in 2019.  Miami has failed in the first round sooooo many times.  They have a need at every single position.  Take the best player on your board each time you're on the clock.

I'm hoping for Oliver, Sweat or trade back for more picks.

I’m aware that the league has a drastic inflation on QB’s and I’ve mentioned it frequently. I’ve been a frequent poster on this site since 2005 ( green4gulf )when I posted that we would be bringing in Dante Culpepper as our QB and got roasted for it LOL.  Nevertheless the market is what it is and if you want a QB in today’s draft then you better make moves to go get him, he isn’t going to fall to you.  

I was born and raised in South FL and currently reside in South FL.  I am a true fan of South FL Football, Canes and Fins and area HS teams.

Waiting until 2020 to draft a QB is a big risk if we have the chance to draft one we believe in during the 2019 draft.  Wouldn’t you want to start the rebuild a year sooner?  Sure you would.  Can you rebuild the entire Offense without having a franchise QB in place?  Nope, you really can’t.  You have to build around  a player and ideally it’s the QB.

If we limit ourselves to only QBs that are draft eligible in 2020 then we will fail.  I know what our Front Office has put out but I’m absolutely sure that this isn’t the case......there’s too many variables between now and 2020 to hinge a plan on getting the player you want in a class that’s 2 drafts and 1 entire football season away.

 

Edited by Swampbilly

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1 hour ago, Swampbilly said:

I completely Agree.  Haskins is legit.......he would be a top 5 pick in almost any draft since 2010....even in 2012 IMO.  Near prototype size, can make every throw.  Athletic enough to extend plays but primarily a pocket passer, high collegiate production in a conference with formidable defense.  Only draw back is somewhat small sample size comparatively, being he missed some time to injury and has about 1 season as a full time starter........

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/news/nfl-draft-2019-comprehensive-primer-on-dwayne-haskins-drew-lock-and-the-rest-of-the-quarterback-class/

read this article....  Its one of many that state these QBs are not 1st round talent.

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