NFC Championship Game - @ Saints

[dll2000]

16 minutes ago, NVRamsFan said:

Yeah, Whitworth in that post from the Rich Eisen show explain how Rams fans feel. If it was the only bad call of the game I'd feel bad. It wasn't though, couple that with how we were treated before the game mentioning this official is bad and sorry the sympathy meter is empty. 

Saints had a huge advantage and still lost.  Rams literally couldn't hear anything while on offense unless QB was speaking directly into their ear.

You don't even know the play has started unless you look.  

 

 

[stl4life07]

Saints fans want their cake and eat it too. If that call was so horrendous to the point where lawsuits are being filed, how come the every Saints fan didnt leave the stadium right after that call in protest? How come every Saints fan across the world just didnt walk away from the game in protest after that call?

See Saints fans still cared about the game AFTER that bad call and when they didnt get the results they wanted which was a Saints win, only then did they point to that call. Back in 2009 when the Vikings got screwed over and over and over again in the Superdome in the NFCCG, the Saints fans didnt care about none of that. They only cared about their team winning and going to the Superbowl. If you approached them about it, they will felt offended saying the Saints deserved to win the Superbowl and not the league handing them a trophy because of everything to happen to New Orleans because of Katrina. I know for a fact because I live in Louisiana and Im surrounded by Saints fans everywhere.

So for the Saints fans to feel like the NFL owe them something because of a bad call that was happening to both teams not just one and the fact that they couldnt overcome that bad call after the fact, thats just ridiculous. The better team won because they overcame bad calls, the tough environment and made the adjustments and the plays to beat the Saints team. Tough break for the Saints on that call but in the words of the late Dennis Green famously said, they had us and they let us off the hook. The Saints had the Rams overwhelmed in the 1st quarter and didnt take advantage of it. They let the Rams hang around and they knew from Week 9 that the Rams is a resilient team that will fight back. So when you dont drive the stake through the heart when you have the chance, it can come back to bite you and thats what happen. 

[iothar]

11 hours ago, stl4life07 said:

Saints fans want their cake and eat it too. If that call was so horrendous to the point where lawsuits are being filed, how come the every Saints fan didnt leave the stadium right after that call in protest? How come every Saints fan across the world just didnt walk away from the game in protest after that call?

See Saints fans still cared about the game AFTER that bad call and when they didnt get the results they wanted which was a Saints win, only then did they point to that call. Back in 2009 when the Vikings got screwed over and over and over again in the Superdome in the NFCCG, the Saints fans didnt care about none of that. They only cared about their team winning and going to the Superbowl. If you approached them about it, they will felt offended saying the Saints deserved to win the Superbowl and not the league handing them a trophy because of everything to happen to New Orleans because of Katrina. I know for a fact because I live in Louisiana and Im surrounded by Saints fans everywhere.

So for the Saints fans to feel like the NFL owe them something because of a bad call that was happening to both teams not just one and the fact that they couldnt overcome that bad call after the fact, thats just ridiculous. The better team won because they overcame bad calls, the tough environment and made the adjustments and the plays to beat the Saints team. Tough break for the Saints on that call but in the words of the late Dennis Green famously said, they had us and they let us off the hook. The Saints had the Rams overwhelmed in the 1st quarter and didnt take advantage of it. They let the Rams hang around and they knew from Week 9 that the Rams is a resilient team that will fight back. So when you dont drive the stake through the heart when you have the chance, it can come back to bite you and thats what happen. 

That's a straw man argument. The call is the worst call (in my opinion based on the magnitude of the call) in history. The Rams got lucky with that one call. 99/100 if thats a PI call the rams lose.

Having said that, the call is what it is. Don't fight the fact as this argument won't go away. Admit it was a horrendous call. After that discussion can ensue on other bad calls in the game.

The Rams are supremely talented and played that game well enough to deserve the game to go either way with how close the game was. 

Just because fans that paid thousands of dollars for seats witnessed a terrible call doesn't mean they should walk out in order for the league to take action or someone to sue. I don't think this warrants extraordinary circumstances for external action but the reaction of the fans is not relevant to the game or the fallout.

[JonStark]

7 minutes ago, iothar said:

That's a straw man argument. The call is the worst call (in my opinion based on the magnitude of the call) in history. The Rams got lucky with that one call. 99/100 if thats a PI call the rams lose.

Having said that, the call is what it is. Don't fight the fact as this argument won't go away. Admit it was a horrendous call. After that discussion can ensue on other bad calls in the game.

The Rams are supremely talented and played that game well enough to deserve the game to go either way with how close the game was. 

Just because fans that paid thousands of dollars for seats witnessed a terrible call doesn't mean they should walk out in order for the league to take action or someone to sue. I don't think this warrants extraordinary circumstances for external action but the reaction of the fans is not relevant to the game or the fallout.

You're right, it was an atrocious call, but you can't cherry pick which missed calls you think should have happened. If a penalty is a penalty, a flag should be thrown whether it's blatant like the DPI or just obvious like the facemask. 

If the facemask gets called, there most likely is no DPI. The Rams go up by 4 and the Saints need a touchdown to save their season on the last drive. Do you think the Rams would be running cover 2, leaving Joyner alone deep on that pass play to Ginn? No, they wouldn't have. If you want to cherry pick ONLY the missed DPI call out of an entire game of missed calls, sure, it cost the Saints the game, but that view is extremely hypocritical. 

[iothar]

My point is that the call is what it is. Taking the high road and admitting the Ram's got a huge break in that one moment isn't wrong. 

Basing the validity of the arguments on fans reaction is the worst argument I have read yet.

And you have to cherry pick that call because its all anyone is talking about. No one cares that another call was missed as it wasn't as egregious. The facemask happens a million times a game. It happened multiple times in the Pats Chiefs game and no one says anything nationally for a reason. 

[stl4life07]

23 minutes ago, iothar said:

That's a straw man argument. The call is the worst call (in my opinion based on the magnitude of the call) in history. The Rams got lucky with that one call. 99/100 if thats a PI call the rams lose.

Having said that, the call is what it is. Don't fight the fact as this argument won't go away. Admit it was a horrendous call. After that discussion can ensue on other bad calls in the game.

The Rams are supremely talented and played that game well enough to deserve the game to go either way with how close the game was. 

Just because fans that paid thousands of dollars for seats witnessed a terrible call doesn't mean they should walk out in order for the league to take action or someone to sue. I don't think this warrants extraordinary circumstances for external action but the reaction of the fans is not relevant to the game or the fallout.

Ive never disputed anything about the call. It was horrible in the worst way. All Im saying is I feel as though Saints are looking at it two ways. 1) Mad at the call but still was cheering, hoping, and believing the Saints would still find a way to win because afterall they still was up 23-20 after that call. Had the Saints won no lawsuits would be filling. Yes the call wouldve been discussed but everything that happened after that call wouldve been relevant because the Saints won. 2) Mad at the call but still was cheering, hoping, and believing the Saints would find a way to win because afterall they still was up 23-20 after that call. The Saints did lose so now lawsuits are being filed. Everything after that one call is irrelevant in plenty of people minds because the Saints didnt end up winning that game. 

Thats why I say Saints fans cant have it both ways. The call was horrendous but if nothing else matters other than the call and Saints fans want to show everyone their frustration, then walk away. Its not turning you back on the team its showing the league I dont want a part of a game that I feel has screwed us. Im a huge fan of wrestling and the wrestling community loves to complain about how bad the WWE is. Back in the Attitude Era it was so great but now its not even watchable. I tell fans all the time, if you want to show McMahon that you arent please with the product, dont go to the events. Dont buy the WWE Network. Dont watch the daily WWE shows. Thats what you do. Saints fans the quickest way of showing your disgust with the call was to walk away as soon as that call happened. Thats if Saints fans believed that one call costed them the Superbowl. By them sticking around still believing the Saints would pull through and still win and overcome that bad call just means that no that one call didnt cost them. They still had chances to overcome adversity. Again Im not saying Saints fans shouldnt be mad but Saints fans cant decide wants relevant and not relevant. Had the Saints still won the game then the game would be relevant. The fact that they didnt now its not relevant. I dont like it because it sends the wrong massage and It takes away from how great Goff was down the stretch. It takes away from those two big kicks by Zeurlein AFTER that bad call.

[JonStark]

1 minute ago, iothar said:

My point is that the call is what it is. Taking the high road and admitting the Ram's got a huge break in that one moment isn't wrong. 

Basing the validity of the arguments on fans reaction is the worst argument I have read yet.

And you have to cherry pick that call because its all anyone is talking about. No one cares that another call was missed as it wasn't as egregious. The facemask happens a million times a game. It happened multiple times in the Pats Chiefs game and no one says anything nationally for a reason. 

You're right, and I don't think any Rams fans aren't admitting that we got a huge break on that one play. But that's exactly what it was. One play.

Cherry picking one play doesn't tell the whole story. It just doesn't. Just because everyone is talking about it doesn't mean it's the correct/logical thing to do. Honestly, picking one play out of an entire game of football and determining a winner that way is one of the craziest things I've ever heard. It just doesn't make any sense. It doesn't matter if one penalty is more egregious than another penalty, they are both penalties. You can't say one should have been called and the other shouldn't have.

[iothar]

6 minutes ago, stl4life07 said:

Ive never disputed anything about the call. It was horrible in the worst way. All Im saying is I feel as though Saints are looking at it two ways. 1) Mad at the call but still was cheering, hoping, and believing the Saints would still find a way to win because afterall they still was up 23-20 after that call. Had the Saints won no lawsuits would be filling. Yes the call wouldve been discussed but everything that happened after that call wouldve been relevant because the Saints won. 2) Mad at the call but still was cheering, hoping, and believing the Saints would find a way to win because afterall they still was up 23-20 after that call. The Saints did lose so now lawsuits are being filed. Everything after that one call is irrelevant in plenty of people minds because the Saints didnt end up winning that game. 

Thats why I say Saints fans cant have it both ways. The call was horrendous but if nothing else matters other than the call and Saints fans want to show everyone their frustration, then walk away. Its not turning you back on the team its showing the league I dont want a part of a game that I feel has screwed us. Im a huge fan of wrestling and the wrestling community loves to complain about how bad the WWE is. Back in the Attitude Era it was so great but now its not even watchable. I tell fans all the time, if you want to show McMahon that you arent please with the product, dont go to the events. Dont buy the WWE Network. Dont watch the daily WWE shows. Thats what you do. Saints fans the quickest way of showing your disgust with the call was to walk away as soon as that call happened. Thats if Saints fans believed that one call costed them the Superbowl. By them sticking around still believing the Saints would pull through and still win and overcome that bad call just means that no that one call didnt cost them. They still had chances to overcome adversity. Again Im not saying Saints fans shouldnt be mad but Saints fans cant decide wants relevant and not relevant. Had the Saints still won the game then the game would be relevant. The fact that they didnt now its not relevant. I dont like it because it sends the wrong massage and It takes away from how great Goff was down the stretch. It takes away from those two big kicks by Zeurlein AFTER that bad call.

You can't judge the fallout of the play based on fans who paid money to be somewhere still sticking around. They have the right to hope it still works out and take action as they see fit. They do get it both ways. I don't agree with the suits on merit of the situation, not the right to do so. The validity of an argument based on the body language. 

The lawsuits are to replay the game. Of course no Saints fans would lobby for a new result from the worst call ever. Its akin to saying "They wouldn't file this lawsuit if I hadn't hit their car when I cut them off". It's such a dumb argument.

The Saints lost on more than just the play. Rams deserve to be in the super bowl. The Saints fans deserve to be livid and are justified in protesting the game. You can cherry pick one call. It was that bad. The nfl doesnt apologize for missing holds. Hell the refs missed the illegal formation in the eagles pats superbowl for Foles touchdown. That illegal formation pales in comparison and this wasn't in the superbowl. It was that bad of a call.

 

[stl4life07]

1 hour ago, iothar said:

You can't judge the fallout of the play based on fans who paid money to be somewhere still sticking around. They have the right to hope it still works out and take action as they see fit. They do get it both ways. I don't agree with the suits on merit of the situation, not the right to do so. The validity of an argument based on the body language. 

The lawsuits are to replay the game. Of course no Saints fans would lobby for a new result from the worst call ever. Its akin to saying "They wouldn't file this lawsuit if I hadn't hit their car when I cut them off". It's such a dumb argument.

The Saints lost on more than just the play. Rams deserve to be in the super bowl. The Saints fans deserve to be livid and are justified in protesting the game. You can cherry pick one call. It was that bad. The nfl doesnt apologize for missing holds. Hell the refs missed the illegal formation in the eagles pats superbowl for Foles touchdown. That illegal formation pales in comparison and this wasn't in the superbowl. It was that bad of a call.

 

I respectfully disagree. Getting it both ways is whats wrong with society. A guy can trespass on another person property trying to commit a crime and if that person falls and gets hurt the owner is liable. I know of cases like that happening. So you mean to tell me that person had it both ways? He got hurt the owner was liable. If he didnt fall and get hurt he more than likely was going to take something that didnt belong to him and if he doesnt get caught he gets away with it.

Ill give you a more simple illustration. Ive witness this a ton. Playing Madden and your friend suspects that you are cheating to win. As long as your friend is still winning he will continue to play then brag about still winning even though you were "cheating" throughout the game. If your friend is losing, he drops the stick and walk out claiming you were cheating and thats the only way you won. Again cant have it both ways.

Your action speak louder than any word. If Saints fans really thought that one call cost them a Superbowl then show it at that moment. I know they booed but everyone boos a bad call. But that just it "a bad call" not "the bad call. The Saints fans are making that call as "the bad call" since they didnt go on to win. Had they won that call wouldve been "a bad call" just like all the other bad calls in that game. Thats all Im trying to say. Never once said the Saints shouldnt show emotions because I dont like for someone to write the narrative based on the results. We all are guilty of it but the Saints fans were singing a different tune in 2009 when they beat the Vikings. Again you cant have it both ways. A bad call is a bad call no matter what the results are and there were plenty of bad calls that went against both teams in Sunday's game. The Saints were the team that couldnt over them and the Rams did. 

[NVRamsFan]

2 hours ago, iothar said:

My point is that the call is what it is. Taking the high road and admitting the Ram's got a huge break in that one moment isn't wrong. 

Basing the validity of the arguments on fans reaction is the worst argument I have read yet.

And you have to cherry pick that call because its all anyone is talking about. No one cares that another call was missed as it wasn't as egregious. The facemask happens a million times a game. It happened multiple times in the Pats Chiefs game and no one says anything nationally for a reason. 

Nor is admitting the Rams on that call weren't the only ones that got huge breaks in the game. Huge breaks that changed the score and momentum of the game calls. DPI and OPI happen every game and don't get called as well. It's interesting though in the year where they're trying to protect QB's more than ever before ,which is saying a lot, suddenly a facemask on one isn't a big deal. Love this attempted logic. It was a missed call that potentially took 4 points from the Rams. Just like the missed DPI call did to the Saints but somehow the two incidents that resulted in the same thing aren't the same. 

[NVRamsFan]

Now we see he didn't want to do the smart thing.

 

 

[stl4life07]

Terrell Owens is saying there is a video floating around where one of the refs was going to throw the flag on the non DPI call and the ref in questioned told that other ref to not throw the flag. Does anyone know about this or have the video?

[JonStark]

14 minutes ago, stl4life07 said:

Terrell Owens is saying there is a video floating around where one of the refs was going to throw the flag on the non DPI call and the ref in questioned that that other ref to not throw the flag. Does anyone know about this or have the video?

Haven't seen it but probably because the ref that stopped him told him the ball was tipped, even though it wasn't. That's what NRC was told.

 

[btfd16]

25 minutes ago, JonStark said:

Haven't seen it but probably because the ref that stopped him told him the ball was tipped, even though it wasn't. That's what NRC was told.

 

I posted the other angle in the general forum showing the ref is telling Sean Payton to get back as he is sprinting down the sideline

[btfd16]

43 minutes ago, stl4life07 said:

Terrell Owens is saying there is a video floating around where one of the refs was going to throw the flag on the non DPI call and the ref in questioned told that other ref to not throw the flag. Does anyone know about this or have the video?