AZBearsFan Posted January 16, 2019 Author Share Posted January 16, 2019 10 minutes ago, G08 said: I don't think Kareem Hunt has any leg to stand on when it comes to arguing for a contract. Bare minimum WITH heavy caveats. I don't know the dude but once you start playing with their money, more often than not people shape up. He'd get a base salary from me and his contract voids completely if he has another discretion. He has 23 years old and elite talent in his favor. That won’t have the leverage it would without the off field stuff obviously, but it has obvious value. Any deal he gets now is gonna be loaded with conditions, but I’d expect once (if) he’s reinstated he’s going to have multiple suitors, and while his base may be low I’d also fully expect that he’s gonna be able to earn a LOT in incentives if he walks the straight and narrow too. If he has teams bidding for him the high end of that deal is going to go up like any other FA. Also, if he’s not reinstated by the beginning of UFA (and it seems that’s by no means a sure thing) then IMO he can’t be the primary plan. We will obviously know more between now and mid-March but until we have a timeline on him I think it’s hard to consider him as a true option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAF-N72EX Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 2 hours ago, AZBearsFan said: He has 23 years old and elite talent in his favor. That won’t have the leverage it would without the off field stuff obviously, but it has obvious value. Any deal he gets now is gonna be loaded with conditions, but I’d expect once (if) he’s reinstated he’s going to have multiple suitors, and while his base may be low I’d also fully expect that he’s gonna be able to earn a LOT in incentives if he walks the straight and narrow too. If he has teams bidding for him the high end of that deal is going to go up like any other FA. Also, if he’s not reinstated by the beginning of UFA (and it seems that’s by no means a sure thing) then IMO he can’t be the primary plan. We will obviously know more between now and mid-March but until we have a timeline on him I think it’s hard to consider him as a true option. Just to get a clear understanding of your opinion regarding Hunt here AZ. Are you saying you would be all for signing Hunt, but we should also not rely on him as an viable option -- (pretty much as only a bonus --I.e in the way White could not be counted on to stay healthy and be productive but if he did...great)? Or are you of the opinion that we should stay away from him altogether? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 2 hours ago, AZBearsFan said: He has 23 years old and elite talent in his favor. That won’t have the leverage it would without the off field stuff obviously, but it has obvious value. Any deal he gets now is gonna be loaded with conditions, but I’d expect once (if) he’s reinstated he’s going to have multiple suitors, and while his base may be low I’d also fully expect that he’s gonna be able to earn a LOT in incentives if he walks the straight and narrow too. If he has teams bidding for him the high end of that deal is going to go up like any other FA. Also, if he’s not reinstated by the beginning of UFA (and it seems that’s by no means a sure thing) then IMO he can’t be the primary plan. We will obviously know more between now and mid-March but until we have a timeline on him I think it’s hard to consider him as a true option. If he's not facing a big suspension, and he does the right things--I'm all for the Bears signing him up. He's not without blame in his situation, but on the other hand, that woman is a loathsome human being. I feel sorry for Hunt, I really do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAF-N72EX Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 7 minutes ago, Heinz D. said: If he's not facing a big suspension, and he does the right things--I'm all for the Bears signing him up. He's not without blame in his situation, but on the other hand, that woman is a loathsome human being. I feel sorry for Hunt, I really do. As you said, he is not innocent by any means. But a person can only be pushed so far. Especially when it comes to racial subjects in these times (which I will now make this my last mention of such). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abstract_thought Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Didn't Hunt have other reported off-field issues? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZBearsFan Posted January 16, 2019 Author Share Posted January 16, 2019 1 hour ago, JustAnotherFan said: Just to get a clear understanding of your opinion regarding Hunt here AZ. Are you saying you would be all for signing Hunt, but we should also not rely on him as an viable option -- (pretty much as only a bonus --I.e in the way White could not be counted on to stay healthy and be productive but if he did...great)? Or are you of the opinion that we should stay away from him altogether? IF Hunt was removed from the commissioner’s exempt list before FA started I’d be all for signing him. If he’s not cleared before FA starts then IMO he can’t be Plan A for an upgrade at RB. I don’t want to wait on him and then he either doesn’t get removed or he does and signs elsewhere and we’ve already missed out on everyone else. Even if we sign him I’d still draft another guy though just because if there was another issue he’s gone. Mizzell can’t be in this roster next year, and if we sign a sure fire starter I would expect we’d at least try to move Howard for some draft capital either during the draft or in the preseason after some injury hits somewhere else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAF-N72EX Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 16 minutes ago, AZBearsFan said: IF Hunt was removed from the commissioner’s exempt list before FA started I’d be all for signing him. If he’s not cleared before FA starts then IMO he can’t be Plan A for an upgrade at RB. I don’t want to wait on him and then he either doesn’t get removed or he does and signs elsewhere and we’ve already missed out on everyone else. Even if we sign him I’d still draft another guy though just because if there was another issue he’s gone. Mizzell can’t be in this roster next year, and if we sign a sure fire starter I would expect we’d at least try to move Howard for some draft capital either during the draft or in the preseason after some injury hits somewhere else. I gotcha. See I dont think RB is a big concern and def not a reason to use a draft pick on. The offense can work with Cohen and Howard, it's just up to Nagy to adjust his offense to compliment them better at this point IMO. Adding Hunt is only a HUGE bonus. If he pulls the same crap again and he can't play......then we still have two RB's who have proven they can get the job done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G08 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 1 hour ago, abstract_thought said: Didn't Hunt have other reported off-field issues? I read two blurbs about him getting into altercations. One was when a friend of his got in a fight so Hunt and his friends jumped in but no charges were filed. I forget what the other one was but it was with a male and no charges were filed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZBearsFan Posted January 16, 2019 Author Share Posted January 16, 2019 1 hour ago, JustAnotherFan said: I gotcha. See I dont think RB is a big concern and def not a reason to use a draft pick on. The offense can work with Cohen and Howard, it's just up to Nagy to adjust his offense to compliment them better at this point IMO. Adding Hunt is only a HUGE bonus. If he pulls the same crap again and he can't play......then we still have two RB's who have proven they can get the job done. I think it’s a moderate need. Howard’s lack of viability in the passing game was far too much of a tip off IMO to what we were doing. A more versatile 1a to Cohen’s 1b would open things up for Nagy and Mitch. Screen game becomes a more viable response to pressure. Check downs and swing passes have a better chance to become consistently positive plays. That’s why I like Ingram. He’s basically Howard with hands and a little more shiftiness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dll2000 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 Hunt is an upgrade on Howard for Nagy because he has better hands, more speed and Nagy doesn't have to adjust blocking scheme. Howard, has he proved his first two seasons in league, is a viable and potent weapon if used to his strengths. So getting him helps, but not getting him isn't a disaster. As for Hunts off field incident, I think there is no legit excuse for how he acted. But why should he be banned from working in NFL ever again at this point? They won't and they shouldn't. He has never been a locker room problem. Team problem is can he control his off field behavior because if he spits on a sidewalk he is going to be suspended again. Not unlike risk of taking a drug user. I think there is a good chance this was a wake up call. At least as a deterrent from doing what he may want to do. Good enough to take signing him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAF-N72EX Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 7 hours ago, AZBearsFan said: I think it’s a moderate need. Howard’s lack of viability in the passing game was far too much of a tip off IMO to what we were doing. A more versatile 1a to Cohen’s 1b would open things up for Nagy and Mitch. Screen game becomes a more viable response to pressure. Check downs and swing passes have a better chance to become consistently positive plays. That’s why I like Ingram. He’s basically Howard with hands and a little more shiftiness. I agree that Nagy's offense is better suited for an all-around back, so it is a need, no doubt. But because I believe the offense can work with Cohen/Howard -- if Nagy's adjusts -- I don't like the idea of using a draft pick on a RB during a year when we have so few. I guess I'm looking at it this way. I'm fine with all our starters, personally. We just need depth (especially since it's unlikely our defense stays as healthy as they were) and mid-late rounds are where teams find those depth players so I where I think the picks need to be allocate too. This of course hinges on how free agency goes and what happens with Massie, Amos, Callahan,etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
51to54 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 1 hour ago, JustAnotherFan said: I agree that Nagy's offense is better suited for an all-around back, so it is a need, no doubt. But because I believe the offense can work with Cohen/Howard -- if Nagy's adjusts -- I don't like the idea of using a draft pick on a RB during a year when we have so few. I guess I'm looking at it this way. I'm fine with all our starters, personally. We just need depth (especially since it's unlikely our defense stays as healthy as they were) and mid-late rounds are where teams find those depth players so I where I think the picks need to be allocate too. This of course hinges on how free agency goes and what happens with Massie, Amos, Callahan,etc. Good cost-benefit post. Going into the 2019 draft with 6-8 picks. Adding a RB with a skill set more suited to Nagy's system is justified. With our draft list, not so much. Howard is not nearly so broken that he has to be replaced, especially when we already have a broken place kicker with a big cap hit to solve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 15 hours ago, AZBearsFan said: What are you expecting Hunt to cost? 2 years 3-3.5 million plus incentives would be a team recreating the last 2 years of his rookie deal and not take on a huge financial burden if he screws up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 The Cap Report 2019: 20.2 million 2020: 50 million [Projected 200 Million Cap] *Could be higher with new CBA 2019 Obviously things are tight. The Bears can get to 30 million [Sims/Acho] pretty easily, but after that there are no obvious deletions that save the Bears money. The Parkey situation is probably going to cost them an additional 1.1 million. The Bears are going to have to be very conservative this offseason in terms of money spent. The conservative approach is going to be further compounded by the lack of draft picks who come with cheap rookie contracts. The Bears obviously need to add depth in a number of spots and deal with starters at RT, S and NB, but a limited draft pool does not give them guaranteed cost controlled replacements. There are going to be some young guys [also read that as cheap] like Coward and Bush that are going to get legit chances to start for the Bears. The real issue is pushing money into 2020, which could be the most critical cap year the Bears have had in years. 2020 This year is a huge year. Probably the most critical cap year the Bears have faced since the 2006 Super Bowl, and even that won't really compare. Everything in 2020 is further screwed up by the fact that there will be a CBA negotiation and we have no idea what impact that will have on the cap in 2021. The last time the CBA was up 2010 this happened, 2009: 123 million 2010: Uncapped 2011: 120 million There was actually a reduction in the cap the year after the new CBA went into effect. The Bears will not know how much money can be pushed into 2021. The list of players is intimidating Cody Whitehair [Free Agent] Danny Trevathan [Free Agent] Jordan Howard [No chance he is back] RRH [RFA: 4 million] Leonard Floyd [5th year option 8 million cap bump] Mitch Trubisky [5th year option needs to be picked up which could really crush 2021] Eddie Jackson [Extension eligible] Tarik Cohen [Extension eligible] What needs to happen 1. Get extensions done with Floyd, who we do not want to pay the 5th year option money to, and with Whitehair, who we can use his final year at 1.3 million to spread out the cap hits. 2. Push as little money as possible into 2020. 3. Sign a ton of 1 year deals to maximize 2020 financial flexibility. 4. Cross your fingers the cap gets a healthy boost again next year and that the CBA negotiations do not drag on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topwop1 Posted January 16, 2019 Share Posted January 16, 2019 15 hours ago, AZBearsFan said: Wasted in terms of costing a non-rookie contract, or that you don’t think he’s any good? Like all the FA you list except Cordarelle. I think Ingram is a good player, just not that great of an upgrade that Bears should be spending valuable cap space on him when it could go towards keeping other key guys like Callahan, Amos, Lynch, etc. One thing to be cautious about with Ingram is he has previously been suspended for PED use, so there would be a risk there and I just don't think it'd be worth the $. I'd rather take on the risk of signing Kareem Hunt which brings me to my next point. 15 hours ago, AZBearsFan said: What are you expecting Hunt to cost? If I had to guess he will likely be offered a 2-year deal based on what was remaining from his rookie contract, with minimal guarantees and with heavy incentives. Something along the lines of: 2019 - $450k + $190k roster bonus (split up by each game active) 2020 - $500k + $240k roster bonus (split up by each game active) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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