Rich7sena Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, roi34 said: Sure he is but who we filling in that spot? Unless we resign bowman and draft a LB. kind of silly to weaken defense. There are a few options to consider for SLB: Sign a true second level player who would be a better fit for the prospective new defense. I.E. Bradham, Williamson, Hitchens. Even at a high end number, those guys would realistically sign at a lower number than Irvin — plus they’re all younger. Draft someone like Trumaine Edmunds in the first round or Lorenzo Carter (who I’m very high on) in the second. Both players would realistically be immediate contributors and project to have higher upside than Irvin at a much cheaper price (althogh the cost of spending a draft pick should be considered). Lastly, the team could simply put an existing player there in Cory James. I think Cory James’ natural NFL position is SLB linebacker and has already developed reliable starter traits there. I believe all three options offer higher return on investment than Irvin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dessie Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 1 hour ago, Rich7sena said: He’s making over $8 million. That’d make him one of if not the highest paid 4-3 SLB in he league — and he’s 30. He’s not a must cut but he’s definitely a cut candidate for me. That’s misleading to say the least. He’d be playing DE more than SLB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 Would you guys be willing to keep Irvin on his current contract if he was to only play nickel/dime DE under Guenther? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 57 minutes ago, Dessie said: That’s misleading to say the least. He’d be playing DE more than SLB. Not in the context of the converstion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dessie Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 44 minutes ago, Rich7sena said: Not in the context of the converstion. You stated he would be the highest paid SLB in the league, when he would be playing DE more than SLB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dessie Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 48 minutes ago, oakdb36 said: Would you guys be willing to keep Irvin on his current contract if he was to only play nickel/dime DE under Guenther? No but given his skill set why would he not play in base defense? He can play WLB, SLB and DE in a 4-3. If we cut Irvin we will need to pick up a DE and a LB to replace him and they will likely cost more. Imo we keep him for another year but look to get a pass rusher in mid rounds as a long term replacement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oakdb36 Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 3 minutes ago, Dessie said: No but given his skill set why would he not play in base defense? He can play WLB, SLB and DE in a 4-3. That's the question i have. I'm not sure he's an off LB. If you're confident he can play SAM in a traditional 4-3, you should want him back for one more year because we have enough needs as it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Dessie said: You stated he would be the highest paid SLB in the league, when he would be playing DE more than SLB. In that post. But earlier in the conversation I pointed out that Irvin would be playing off ball more often if Guenther's defense remains the same. Quote This was more or less his role last year and he barely got to 8 sacks. And the sack numbers are deceiving for Irvin because he barely got pressure. In Gunther's scheme -- if it mirrors what he did in Cincinnati -- Irvin will be rushing the passer more infrequently in base downs. Further, I'm not convinced Irvin would be a good fit in a base nickel (when the offense is not in an obvious passing downs situation but still deploys 3 receivers) in Guenther's scheme unless he's standing up. In a balance 4-3, the ends are usually in a 3-point stance in the 6 gap. If Irvin was a consistently productive player I might advocate for Guenther to simply change his scheme to fit the player; but Irvin is not consistently productive as a pass rusher. Considering his price and age, there are better fits out there. Edited February 11, 2018 by Rich7sena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dessie Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Rich7sena said: Considering his price and age, there are better fits out there. You keep bringing up his age, he’s 2 years younger than Michael Bennett who you want to give $6m a year to. As I have said before if we cut Irvin it will be that we deem him too expensive at $8m, age and scheme aren’t factors for me. Edited February 11, 2018 by Dessie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
raidr4life Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 6 hours ago, Rich7sena said: There are a few options to consider for SLB: Sign a true second level player who would be a better fit for the prospective new defense. I.E. Bradham, Williamson, Hitchens. Even at a high end number, those guys would realistically sign at a lower number than Irvin — plus they’re all younger. Draft someone like Trumaine Edmunds in the first round or Lorenzo Carter (who I’m very high on) in the second. Both players would realistically be immediate contributors and project to have higher upside than Irvin at a much cheaper price (althogh the cost of spending a draft pick should be considered). Lastly, the team could simply put an existing player there in Cory James. I think Cory James’ natural NFL position is SLB linebacker and has already developed reliable starter traits there. I believe all three options offer higher return on investment than Irvin. Or draft Rashaan Evans in the 2nd play him at SLB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 (edited) 11 minutes ago, raidr4life said: Or draft Rashaan Evans in the 2nd play him at SLB. He'd also be a great fit but I'm not sure he'll be there in the 2nd. I also like Okoronkwo in round 1. Edited February 11, 2018 by Rich7sena Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roi34 Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 All draft picks are a question mark though lets agree there. so you want to get rid of a brighter spot on defense for question mark or a lower level Lb? How about MLB? is bowman back under your cuts then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humble_Beast Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 if we went all Defense first 3 rounds 1- Edwards LB 2- Rasheem Green DE 3- JC Jackson CB Sudden d will be young and talented DL: Mack, Green, Edwards, FA LB: Edwards, Bowman, Irvin CB: Conely, Jackson S: Joseph, Obi maybe just add a free agent CB and DT and this defense would be fun to watch! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 42 minutes ago, roi34 said: All draft picks are a question mark though lets agree there. so you want to get rid of a brighter spot on defense for question mark or a lower level Lb? How about MLB? is bowman back under your cuts then? Any of the free agents I listed would be better fits, thus not "lower level" linebackers. There's only a degree of mystery surrounding draft picks. Let's not pretend we don't know anything about prospects. We know plenty. I'd bring Bowman back provided he can be brought back at a reasonable price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roi34 Posted February 12, 2018 Share Posted February 12, 2018 47 minutes ago, Rich7sena said: Any of the free agents I listed would be better fits, thus not "lower level" linebackers. There's only a degree of mystery surrounding draft picks. Let's not pretend we don't know anything about prospects. We know plenty. I'd bring Bowman back provided he can be brought back at a reasonable price. I'm not saying nothing is known from draft picks.. but let's also not pretend there is a sure thing. Some sure things are busts. just like some 5th rounders are stars. Either way those other Lbs we sign will most likely get 5 mill or so plus more years than irvin has left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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