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22 hours ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

It's night and day. I don't see anyone on defense outside of Mack who would start on defense. On offense, we're a lot younger. IOL and WR are worse, but RB, TE, and tackle should be better. QB should be better too because Carr had a rough year in 2017 (I remember well).

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52 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Carr also regressed big time in 2017 coming off of that leg injury.

I wouldn't say regressed as such, he seemed a bit less confident but that stands to reason after the injury but then of course he had that back injury in that fateful Washington game. That really scuppered the season on many fronts IMHO.

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On 9/9/2021 at 12:14 PM, Darbsk said:

I wouldn't say regressed as such, he seemed a bit less confident but that stands to reason after the injury but then of course he had that back injury in that fateful Washington game. That really scuppered the season on many fronts IMHO.

Carr was in the MVP conversation in 2016 and was average from 2017-2019. 

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12 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Carr was in the MVP conversation in 2016 and was average from 2017-2019. 

One man's 'regression' is another man's injury, playing not fully fit (2017), playing on a terrible roster getting torn apart in a new, complex scheme (2018) and rebuilding team lacking weapons (2019). Carr is probably a more complete player right now but 2016 was his zenith of confidence so far, everything seemed to fall right until the injury. Damn that fateful play 😤

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4 minutes ago, Darbsk said:

One man's 'regression' is another man's injury, playing not fully fit (2017), playing on a terrible roster getting torn apart in a new, complex scheme (2018) and rebuilding team lacking weapons (2019). Carr is probably a more complete player right now but 2016 was his zenith of confidence so far, everything seemed to fall right until the injury. Damn that fateful play 😤

Carr had the mojo in 2016 though, he was amazing in clutch situations. He folded down the stretch in 2020. 

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2 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Carr had the mojo in 2016 though, he was amazing in clutch situations. He folded down the stretch in 2020. 

Don't agree that he 'folded'. Injuries, lack of depth and poor play all round caught up with us. Did Carr excel? No, but I don't think he 'folded'. 😁

He had one really bad game against the Falcons but he was pretty clutch v the Jets - one chance and he took it and against the Broncos to finish the year.

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3 minutes ago, Darbsk said:

Don't agree that he 'folded'. Injuries, lack of depth and poor play all round caught up with us. Did Carr excel? No, but I don't think he 'folded'. 😁

He had one really bad game against the Falcons but he was pretty clutch v the Jets - one chance and he took it and against the Broncos to finish the year.

Carr the first 10 weeks (6-4): 2,431 yards (70% comp), 19 TD, 3 INT, 5 fumbles

Carr the last 6 weeks (2-4): 1,672 yards (64% comp), 8 TD, 6 INT, 3 fumbles 

The Jets and Broncos were two of the worst teams in the league and essentially gave us the game at the end. The Jets literally ran a nuke blitz in a Hail Mary situation and the Broncos called a timeout which let us get set or we would've ran out of time and lost. 

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6 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Carr the first 10 weeks (6-4): 2,431 yards (70% comp), 19 TD, 3 INT, 5 fumbles

Carr the last 6 weeks (2-4): 1,672 yards (64% comp), 8 TD, 6 INT, 3 fumbles 

The Jets and Broncos were two of the worst teams in the league and essentially gave us the game at the end. The Jets literally ran a nuke blitz in a Hail Mary situation and the Broncos called a timeout which let us get set or we would've ran out of time and lost. 

But he still made the plays. That's what being clutch is isn't it? spotting the open guy when the blitz is in your face like the Jets game. He had one play and he delivers. 

Stats are all well and good but we both watched the games, the running game faultered, injuries piled up and of course Carr didn't play as well. No argument there but you seem to stretch it a little with saying he folded. The team just wasn't good enough in my opinion of course.

The biggest game of the year was Chiefs away and Carr was superb, in fact if you look at his stats under pressure they contradict the much bandied around thought that he struggles under pressure and with the blitz on his face, they say the opposite.

It was really disappointing the last stretch last year and I want to be clear, I'm not saying Carr played really well, he struggled too but I think it was a symptom of the team's struggles rather than the cause and i think you're saying the opposite.

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4 minutes ago, Darbsk said:

But he still made the plays. That's what being clutch is isn't it? spotting the open guy when the blitz is in your face like the Jets game. He had one play and he delivers. 

He had 8 TD/9 INT against the easiest remaining SOS in the league over the final 6 games when we were in a great spot to push for the playoffs. The Atlanta game was almost entirely on Carr. In both the Colts game and the Dolphins game Carr couldn't finish drives so we settled for FG's and that played a huge factor in us losing those games. 

I'll give him credit for making a clutch throw against the Jets. But in that game we were in control in the third quarter up 24-13 and our offense stalled out with 3 straight 3 & Outs which put them in position to get back into the game. Luckily our defense was able to get a stop and get us the ball back with like a minute remaining. But he made that throw against one of the worst defensive play calls in recent memory against an 0-11 team that was actively tanking and their DC was fired immediately for sending an all out blitz in a Hail Mary situation. 

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1 hour ago, NYRaider said:

He had 8 TD/9 INT against the easiest remaining SOS in the league over the final 6 games when we were in a great spot to push for the playoffs. The Atlanta game was almost entirely on Carr. In both the Colts game and the Dolphins game Carr couldn't finish drives so we settled for FG's and that played a huge factor in us losing those games. 

I'll give him credit for making a clutch throw against the Jets. But in that game we were in control in the third quarter up 24-13 and our offense stalled out with 3 straight 3 & Outs which put them in position to get back into the game. Luckily our defense was able to get a stop and get us the ball back with like a minute remaining. But he made that throw against one of the worst defensive play calls in recent memory against an 0-11 team that was actively tanking and their DC was fired immediately for sending an all out blitz in a Hail Mary situation. 

Again, I don't agree with your hyperbole. The Jets clearly weren't tanking, that is laughable to say that as they went on to win two games and put themselves out of the #1 pick. That is just flat out wrong. Carr didn't play well, that is true but as I stated I think it was a symptom of the team rather than the cause of the slump. The team simply wasn't good enough to overcome the injuries and Carr probably tried to do too much with not enough which is why the interceptions look starkly different.

Jacobs was hobbled, the OL was all banged up and Ruggs and Edwards struggled and Agholor was our best WR which a year ago would have been mocked. Waller was the one consistent and he was excellent but of course other DCs noticed he was our best option so the defences knew what was coming, especially when our run game struggled.

I guess you say Carr folded, I say he didn't play well which was a symptom of the team. I think my take is more reasonable.

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On 9/9/2021 at 12:22 PM, Jeremy408 said:

 It look like everybody regressed big time lol

As the quarterback it's Carr's job to set the tone and lead the team. Turning the ball over 5 times and putting the defense in terrible spots is setting the tone. We've heard multiple players say that the team lacks accountability in the locker room and have had other players publicly celebrate once we traded/released them. Look back at 2019 as well we started 6-4 then completely fell off a cliff and it starts with Carr. 

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11 hours ago, NYRaider said:

As the quarterback it's Carr's job to set the tone and lead the team. Turning the ball over 5 times and putting the defense in terrible spots is setting the tone. We've heard multiple players say that the team lacks accountability in the locker room and have had other players publicly celebrate once we traded/released them. Look back at 2019 as well we started 6-4 then completely fell off a cliff and it starts with Carr. 

players that celebrate leaving are turds like Trent Brown/AB

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