Raiders Defense

[Rolni]

22 hours ago, Ryno said:

Where did you get the stats for this out of curiosity? 

Twitter:

Tristen Kuhn@KuhnTristen

The notion Nate Hobbs wasn't good on the outside last year is clouded from the hand injury. Wasn't able to press which limits his whole play style Prior to the injury (short period of time) he was allowing a 74.2 QBR, after the injury he allowed a 111.3 QBR

[Rolni]

21 hours ago, Geezy said:

my thing about Hobbs is he was so good at NCB his rookie year. Why change anything? NCB is a starting position nowadays and just as important imo. Have so many things broken on defense and tried to fix one of the few things working. 

You need 3 starting CB nowdays basically.

We need to put Hobbs where the CB unit is the best overall. Which means that he might be better for us on the outside, despite the fact that he would be better as a player in the slot.

The best 3 needs to play and if a guy like T.Hall is among the best 3 then Hobbs has to play on the outside...

[Justwinning]

Really surprised at how well Hall played albeit in a small sample size. Let's see how he does when he gets more playing time. 

[raidr4life]

One of the keys for me is if Nichols can get back to form he was a solid player two years prior hopefully a 2nd year in Graham scheme helps. Wilson being ready to roll could do wonders and keep Jones fresh so he can have more of an impact on 3rd downs.

Moehring needs to bounce back I feel like if it's the system then someone is going to end up with a good young safety.

Spillane is going to surprise good against the run, and better in coverage than Perryman was, now gets his shot full time and Pit hated to lose him. Deablo also a promising young player who could shine if he stays healthy could form a solid duo, but the depth is poor after that, an injury away from disaster.

CB we may have enough guys for some solid options to emerge outside of Hobbs.

Overall I think the defense will be slightly better unless Graham system is complete trash.

[big_palooka]

11 minutes ago, raidr4life said:

Moehring needs to bounce back I feel like if it's the system then someone is going to end up with a good young safety.

I think the addition of Epps will allow him to pay his natural role as a center fielder.

[drfrey13]

On 5/21/2023 at 10:39 AM, Dessie said:

Are you saying Perryman didn’t know what he was doing ? 

Perryman did not fully understand the defense the way a player who has been in the same system for 5+ years.  Also Perryman is not the ideal defensive QB that is out there directing the entire defense.  Not saying he sucked but he was not the total package you look for and only year 1 in the system did not allow him to play the way we needed.  The same thing would happen even if we got a great rookie to man the position.  They just can not reach the potential year 1.  There is a reason why Guenther's defense looked 100x better when Burfict was on the field and everyone was completely lost when he was gone.  Burfict new his role, everyone else's role, and what the play was designed to do on top of how teams would react to how they played.  That comes from time and experience.  Remember Burfict was a 5 second flat LB.  The mental side is what allowed him to thrive.

[Darbsk]

22 hours ago, raidr4life said:

One of the keys for me is if Nichols can get back to form he was a solid player two years prior hopefully a 2nd year in Graham scheme helps. Wilson being ready to roll could do wonders and keep Jones fresh so he can have more of an impact on 3rd downs.

Moehring needs to bounce back I feel like if it's the system then someone is going to end up with a good young safety.

Spillane is going to surprise good against the run, and better in coverage than Perryman was, now gets his shot full time and Pit hated to lose him. Deablo also a promising young player who could shine if he stays healthy could form a solid duo, but the depth is poor after that, an injury away from disaster.

CB we may have enough guys for some solid options to emerge outside of Hobbs.

Overall I think the defense will be slightly better unless Graham system is complete trash.

With regard Nichols, he did have Akiem Hicks, Khalil Mack and Robert Quinn on the line helping him out in his best years so maybe it’s not a case of form so much as he’s a role player who can play well when he’s not the focus but can’t elevate the play of others. Wilson we have to hope is all he’s being made out to be, that would make a big difference but it seems like putting all our eggs in one basket maybe? Man, I hope we hit on a round one defender!

Moehrig is someone I had high hopes for and I think being a young player we have to play him to his strengths more and adjust his role slightly. I don’t think he’ll ever be what we’d hoped for when we drafted him but I think he can be decent to good.

LB I’m just hoping for the best but expect we’ll get exposed again as there isn’t enough strength in front of them. Fingers crossed.

We’ve got numbers at CB certainly and we’ve hedged our bets a bit but it all feels a bit like slinging mud at a wall and hoping some sticks for me rather than a cohesive plan.

I don’t think the D could be much worse than last year to be honest but I hope for a league average unit. If they do that then I will be reasonably impressed given the lack of urgency they’ve used and seemingly underwhelming recruits. Definitely wait and see mode.

[big_palooka]

1 hour ago, Darbsk said:

With regard Nichols, he did have Akiem Hicks, Khalil Mack and Robert Quinn on the line helping him out in his best years so maybe it’s not a case of form so much as he’s a role player who can play well when he’s not the focus but can’t elevate the play of others. Wilson we have to hope is all he’s being made out to be, that would make a big difference but it seems like putting all our eggs in one basket maybe? Man, I hope we hit on a round one defender!

Moehrig is someone I had high hopes for and I think being a young player we have to play him to his strengths more and adjust his role slightly. I don’t think he’ll ever be what we’d hoped for when we drafted him but I think he can be decent to good.

LB I’m just hoping for the best but expect we’ll get exposed again as there isn’t enough strength in front of them. Fingers crossed.

We’ve got numbers at CB certainly and we’ve hedged our bets a bit but it all feels a bit like slinging mud at a wall and hoping some sticks for me rather than a cohesive plan.

I don’t think the D could be much worse than last year to be honest but I hope for a league average unit. If they do that then I will be reasonably impressed given the lack of urgency they’ve used and seemingly underwhelming recruits. Definitely wait and see mode.

I was going to say the same on Nichols. He had good company in Chicago. 

I think Spillane will surprise people as a run defender which is the role Perryman played. Coverage will be more fall more to the DBs with guys like Epps, Palo-Mao, Moehrig.

CB, I think the hope is Hobbs can realize his potential. Then you have several guys who fill in opposite and at nickel. Not getting my hopes high, but there is a good group of guys there. Just may need that pure CB1 eventually. 

I look for the defense to improve but also be better equipped to handle injury. Last season, CB was a mess with injuries. There are at least several guys who can step in and play. Not relying on Sam Webb for example. LB scares me. Dline, I think will be the surprise unit. New coach, good depth and rotation. 

[Darbsk]

42 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

I was going to say the same on Nichols. He had good company in Chicago. 

I think Spillane will surprise people as a run defender which is the role Perryman played. Coverage will be more fall more to the DBs with guys like Epps, Palo-Mao, Moehrig.

CB, I think the hope is Hobbs can realize his potential. Then you have several guys who fill in opposite and at nickel. Not getting my hopes high, but there is a good group of guys there. Just may need that pure CB1 eventually. 

I look for the defense to improve but also be better equipped to handle injury. Last season, CB was a mess with injuries. There are at least several guys who can step in and play. Not relying on Sam Webb for example. LB scares me. Dline, I think will be the surprise unit. New coach, good depth and rotation. 

Well, we’ve hand picked a few guys for Patrick Grahams specific defence so there is reason to expect some improvement. I think last year was a bit if a mulligan but there’s less excuse this year and we do need to see something taking shape at least.

Id like to see us at least do one thing well, be that takeaways, 3rd down stops, red zone D or pass rush. Please give us something to build off of and be optimistic about moving forward.

Edited May 25, 2023 by Darbsk

[jimkelly02]

On 5/24/2023 at 10:37 AM, Rolni said:

You need 3 starting CB nowdays basically.

We need to put Hobbs where the CB unit is the best overall. Which means that he might be better for us on the outside, despite the fact that he would be better as a player in the slot.

The best 3 needs to play and if a guy like T.Hall is among the best 3 then Hobbs has to play on the outside...

Not disagreeing but I would just say…

1) In 2 CB sets Hobbs will/should be on the field even if he’s the “starting slot CB”… that’s like a given by all fans.

2) while you should put hobbs in the best spot for the team… and that can change game to game and even within games based on offensive sets….

I do think we should try and get hobbs to be an outside cb as it offers more value then a slot cb, we could move other players to the slot, and we should be concerned with his development as a player and not sacrifice that development in the name of putting out a marginally better 3 cb unit.

[jimkelly02]

On 5/24/2023 at 2:44 PM, big_palooka said:

I think the addition of Epps will allow him to pay his natural role as a center fielder.

That’s what we should be hoping.  I think we overpaid for Epps personally but I’m hoping he can improve as he’s still young and can give us strong SS play and allow Moehrig to be a center fielder.  
 

im just tired of sacrificing high draft pick’s development in making them play way from their strengths because the defense is inept and requires compromising player roles/ responsibilities.  I’d rather we just keep a guy like Moehrig playing center field then make him do other things.  The players who aren’t cutting should just be cut and sign someone to do the job.  There’s always competent albeit non play making SS’s available.  

[raidr4life]

16 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

Not disagreeing but I would just say…

1) In 2 CB sets Hobbs will/should be on the field even if he’s the “starting slot CB”… that’s like a given by all fans.

2) while you should put hobbs in the best spot for the team… and that can change game to game and even within games based on offensive sets….

I do think we should try and get hobbs to be an outside cb as it offers more value then a slot cb, we could move other players to the slot, and we should be concerned with his development as a player and not sacrifice that development in the name of putting out a marginally better 3 cb unit.

I actually think David Long Jr is probably our 2nd best CB so the outside duo could be Hobbs and Long, but I'm still afraid Facyson is penciled in to start he needs to actually earn it.

[MrOaktown_56]

4 minutes ago, raidr4life said:

I actually think David Long Jr is probably our 2nd best CB so the outside duo could be Hobbs and Long, but I'm still afraid Facyson is penciled in to start he needs to actually earn it.

David long is a career journeyman. At least shelley played well last year.

[raidr4life]

7 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

David long is a career journeyman. At least shelley played well last year.

Forgot Shelley I really don't know the plan here can't wait to see it take shape.

[bucksavage1]

16 minutes ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

David long is a career journeyman. At least shelley played well last year.

 

7 minutes ago, raidr4life said:

Forgot Shelley I really don't know the plan here can't wait to see it take shape.

I’m intrigued with the CB position. No stars yet but solid young vet players. CB by committee 

Facyson/Shelley/Long/Hobbs