🦅🤠 NFC East 🤷‍♂️🆘 | Celebrating the Cowboys' 28 Years of Sadness

[MKnight82]

4 minutes ago, jonu62882 said:

Disagree strongly with all points.  The first - How did the NFL "screw up" the investigation.  They took their time (1 year long investigation of gathering facts and evidence before passing down sentence and covered all bases while basing their decision to hand down said decision based on BROAD powers and low threshold to do so (tarnishing the shield).  They gave Zeke enough DUE PROCESS to show that this met the CBA requirements.

Second point - The longer more people hear about him being involved with the words "domestic violence" and the more it is repeated, the longer it stays in people's minds.  Public opinion usually assumes he already did it.  The average Joe isn't going to hear facts and change their mind whatsoever.  He won't get sympathy AT ALL because it's drawn out.   This will have the opposite intended effect.  Look at how scandals work...look at Trump with all his shenanigans.  The more he fights things with tweets on a certain point, the most his perception rating goes down in the public's eyes.

I agree with this 100%.  The only people who see Elliot as some martyr being taken down by Goodell are the ones who already made up their mind he shouldn't have been suspended in the first place.  The increased longevity of this is hurting Elliot's image.

[jonu62882]

32 minutes ago, Jroc04 said:

Zeke is doing everything every one of us would or should be doing in his situation. Even if you're completely guilty, you turn over every rock, appeal every decision against you and delay, delay, delay. When money is not an issue, you can afford to jerk around the court system. Thus, why so many rich people get less punishment for the same crimes general people are charged with. 

I don't really care what happens to Zeke. He's obviously screwing around too much for the NFL's liking and is getting slapped on the wrist for it. It doesn't matter whether or not he's been legally charged. The NFL sees this as too many black eyes on the league and are, within every inch of their right, punishing him for conduct detrimental to the league. What's the argument? 

This isn't about whether or not he's guilty or about any crimes.  Sure, if his personal freedom and criminal record were at stake, fight on as the consequences are much greater.  We're talking about him being punished by his employer, which you know they have a right to as you so alluded.  It only hurts the team by extending this and fighting it longer into next season or later into their playoff push a game or two can change seeding or whether they even make the playoffs.  Terrible strategy all around.

[Phire]

4 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

When you ask questions like this, it makes me want to not talk anymore with you. There are literally dozens of articles about how bad the NFL messed this up. There are ~5-10 lawyers who have been blasting the NFL all over social media and creating articles about how bad this was handled. There is a number of ways the NFL messed this up. If you dont know them by now, whats the point of talking with you about it.

Ask @Phire to explain. Hes a lawyer. Youll trust him. 

Sarcasm aside, and for the record, as a matter of principle I do agree that the NFL isn't equipped to perform investigations like these. I've always been of the opinion that they don't want to be in this position. The Ray Rice thing kind of screwed it all up. In that case, Ray Rice was on video doing something horrific, but the charges were dropped because, as in most domestic violence cases, the victim stops cooperating or flat out doesn't want the transgressor to be punished legally. But the NFL took MASSIVE HEAT for that, I'm not shocked at all that they're jumping at the slightest mention of domestic violence.

But that's a separate question from whether, under the CBA, the commissioner has the power to do basically what he wants.

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

59 minutes ago, Phire said:

Sarcasm aside, and for the record, as a matter of principle I do agree that the NFL isn't equipped to perform investigations like these. I've always been of the opinion that they don't want to be in this position. The Ray Rice thing kind of screwed it all up. In that case, Ray Rice was on video doing something horrific, but the charges were dropped because, as in most domestic violence cases, the victim stops cooperating or flat out doesn't want the transgressor to be punished legally. But the NFL took MASSIVE HEAT for that, I'm not shocked at all that they're jumping at the slightest mention of domestic violence.

But that's a separate question from whether, under the CBA, the commissioner has the power to do basically what he wants.

I agree with this almost completely. I agree the NFL has botched this and other cases, but it is clear that the NFL currently can do what it wants in these cases.. That isn't to say I am 100% certain that Zeke didn't do what he is accused of, I don't think anyone can be, I just think that the NFL is trying to punish Elliot for all the nonsense he has done in the past, and that they wanted to look good doing it by being hard on domestic violence.

[RandyMossIsBoss]

1 hour ago, jonu62882 said:

Okay, that's somewhat reasonable.  That begs the question, though, why the hell did Jerry build an environment with no discernible HFA?  Also, you'll still have to play more games if you're a wildcard spot and therefore no bye week to rest either.  Not sure what the %'s are, but I'd have to imagine no matter how your team is built #1 seed is better than being a #6 seed.  It would be interesting to find out those numbers.  @RandyMossIsBoss  I feel this something you would probably know since the analytics guy around here.

 

Honestly though I don't think it's something you even need to explore, anybody telling themselves they'd rather a 6 seed than a 1 seed is just coping. The absence of a HFA does not equate to the away team having the advantage, so even if you have no HFA, you'd still want to avoid traveling to play teams that DO have a HFA.

Cowboys are 37-33 at Jerry World, 39-31 on the road, so it's true that they're one of the few teams on paper that don't have a HFA... The thing is, I don't really buy it. Getting to practice and play in your comfort zone, not have to travel, and not deal with crowd noise is an advantage, or at the very least not a disadvantage, which the opposite certainly is (having to travel, play in another environment, etc.) 

More important then where you're playing is who you're playing, and 6 seeds always will have the toughest road. No question that a 1 seed >>>>> 6 seed.

[jonu62882]

1 hour ago, Matts4313 said:

@AZ_Eaglesfan  @MKnight82  @jonu62882

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ I still argue that this has only been "bad press" or a "bad story" for the NFL. This was brilliantly played by the NFLPA/Zeke. They want us talking about this. 

Don’t think so, but we’ll have to agree to disagree on this one.

[Matts4313]

10 minutes ago, RandyMossIsBoss said:

anybody telling themselves they'd rather a 6 seed than a 1 seed is just coping.

Literally no one said this. 

[Phire]

10 minutes ago, RandyMossIsBoss said:

More important then where you're playing is who you're playing, and 6 seeds always will have the toughest road. No question that a 1 seed >>>>> 6 seed.

that first round bye doe

[jonu62882]

1 hour ago, Matts4313 said:

The suspension is only for regular season games. And if we miss playoffs in 2 years because our RB missed 6 games, people should get fired. Hes all pro, one of the top 5 in the league, but he is still a RB. We should be able to weather a 6 game storm w/o him. 

Not when your QB is game manager (a good one) and can’t expect to lean on to win you games...We all know Zeke is the most important player to your team and affects game plans more than Dak.

Yeah yeah, but Dak da real MVP.

[Matts4313]

3 minutes ago, jonu62882 said:

Not when your QB is game manager (a good one) and can’t expect to lean on to win you games...We all know Zeke is the most important player to your team and affects game plans more than Dak.

Yeah yeah, but Dak da real MVP.

I disagree, obvi. Dak is good enough to win you games. And he is by far more *VALUABLE* than Zeke (hence MVP). You may feel different, but I guarantee you that 90%+ of the world would say Dak is more important to the Cowboys than Zeke. A top 10 QB >>>>>>>>> a top 5 RB. Thats just football.

Edited November 3, 2017 by Matts4313

[jonu62882]

1 hour ago, Phire said:

Although, due to the appeals, it's possible the NFL can modify their original suspension. I'm sure the CBA allows for that too haha.

Should fight that too after all this and drag on it on for 3 seasons. Lol

[jonu62882]

2 hours ago, Jroc04 said:

Besides the constant bickering in the East thread, I personally love how he's handling it. 

Its been a distraction all year and it just keeps keeps going. The longer they drag it out, the longer the distraction and now, I'd take the suspension next year so it messes them up even longer. 

That’s what I’ve been saying.

 

Matts: Dragging it out iz bettterzzz for our push next year when he’s suspended.  Derpity derp.

Is this real life?

Edited November 3, 2017 by jonu62882

[Matts4313]

2 minutes ago, jonu62882 said:

That’s what I’ve been saying.

 

Matts: Dragging it out iz bettterzzz for our push next year when he’s suspended.  Derpity derp.

i said dragging it out was better for Zeke and the NFLPA.

I said that the Cowboys will likely be in a better spot to absorb his suspension next year as opposed to right now. We are really young and it will be harder to overcome this year. 

Reading comprehension. 

OBVI if I new we were going to come out of the gates like butt and Zeke was 100% suspended, I too would have rather it be done week 1. But thats hindsight.

Edited November 3, 2017 by Matts4313

[jonu62882]

1 hour ago, Matts4313 said:

When you ask questions like this, it makes me want to not talk anymore with you. There are literally dozens of articles about how bad the NFL messed this up. There are ~5-10 lawyers who have been blasting the NFL all over social media and creating articles about how bad this was handled. There is a number of ways the NFL messed this up. If you dont know them by now, whats the point of talking with you about it.

Ask @Phire to explain. Hes a lawyer. Youll trust him. 

Lol wit?! Now, you’re just delusional.

 

 Phire and I are on the same page, I believe, in that there was a legitimate enough investigation.  The NFL probably spent hundreds of thousands of dollars, if not millions, while gathering facts and evidence from the various sources, witnesses, governmental entities (Ohio PD, Ohio DA, in-house lawyers and security team made up of former police from different levels, independent investigators, etc.  for 1 YEAR before the punishment was issued.

 They didn’t just hand Zeke his punishment the next.  That’s what all this is about and thats why Zeke will.  They did their due diligence for 1 year and were within their rights to punish Zeke under the current CBA.

Bruh, I don’t have a license but I have a law degree and can analyze the facts.  I’ve the read the pleadings, judges’ opinions, read what the ADA and witnesses have said.  Due diligence was done, more than enough for them to find what they found and levy punishment against Zeke.  Remember, this isn’t CRIMINAL court he’s facing...You keep getting this confused with the standards and “burden of proof” being thrown around with little understanding of it.

[Jroc04]

I figure Zeke is only taking his lawyer's advice at this point. They see holes they think they can wiggle in and exploit. And while, they wouldn't necessarily be doing the Cowboys any favor by prolonging an almost definite suspension, Zeke probably doesn't want to accept the suspension and by that, admit some kind of guilt. I can't blame him there. 

But, since this has become an 8+ week distraction, I'd take the suspension and on my outgoing press conference note how I felt about it. 

"I'm going to reluctantly accept this punishment by the NFL in hopes that myself and my team won't have any further distractions. This has damaged my and my family's mental health and has taken a toll on the Cowboys' players and staff. And this I cannot allow any further. And although I will move on from this, I do not agree with the NFL's decision. It was rash and short-sighted. The NFL rushed to judgment before letting me have a fair trial in court, where myself and my lawyers are very confident I would have been deemed innocent in every way. Thanks. Peace out. Go birds!"