🦅🤠 NFC East 🤷‍♂️🆘 | Celebrating the Cowboys' 28 Years of Sadness

[HTTRDynasty]

16 minutes ago, Gmen said:

I'm partial to expected points added (EPA) as a metric. 

If you want to learn more about it, here is a good resource.

http://insidethepylon.com/football-101/glossary-football-101/2019/10/25/glossary-entry-expected-points-added/

 

This isn't schedule-adjusted, correct?

[Gmen]

15 minutes ago, HTTRDynasty said:

This isn't schedule-adjusted, correct?

Nope

[ACO]

Looking back at 2020 the Giants had a ton of close games. I mean 9 of them were one score games. 7 of them a FG or less. And they almost beat the Bucs which was wild. I do think they improved this offseason but we shall see how it all shapes out once they hit the field. I still pick them to win the division at the moment. But Washington very well could do it. It is all up to those QB. I think Daniel Jones is better than Fitz.

[Kiltman]

2 hours ago, Go_Giants said:

The lie is saying the Giants have a spotty defense, they had a top 10 defense last year, and are going to be better this season.

As for Daniel Jones, I think Daniel Jones can be a good QB when he is not playing behind the 2nd worst offensive line in the NFL. Your take sound extremely biased, Daniel Jones is not costing the Giants big time money, he is only in the third year of his rookie contract. If he was in the third year in the same offense system I could understand some of your criticism. He is not, he had to learn a new offensive system last year with out a real offseason or preseason games. 

The Giants are taking this division, the Eagles will be looking for a new QB next season. They are not in the same boat.

Spotty doesn't mean awful. Spotty means they have holes and lack the star talent to probably be consistent week to week, let alone year to year. A lot of times when a team sticks to being at one of those top 3rd of the league spots it's because of top of the league talent. Both the teams are sparse on that front. But both are good enough to help if the QBs are doing their parts. 

Has the Giants Oline rapidly improved since last year? Who cares about the money if they aren't going to do anything with it. If Jones gets it together these next two years it'll be just in time for them to have to pay for a lot of these guys. Being cheap only matters if it opens up paying for talent elsewhere and....
Sure, year two could and should be better. But like how much better can anyone be in a Jason Garrett offense amirite? 

Money is we are looking elsewhere for a QB next year, can use one or all three of our 1sts to do so.
But money is also on you guys should be too, Giants have a solid shot at the division but that ≠ them being a threat at anything.

But hey..just my take on them.

[Kiltman]

3 hours ago, Gmen said:

You're vastly overrating the Eagles offensive talent, and underrating the Giants.  PFF came out with WR and RB rankings yesterday. 

WR : Giants #11, Eagles #30

RB : Giants #12, Eagles #27

 

Jalen Hurts showed bad accuracy last season.  His completion percentage over expectation (CPOE) was one of the worst in the NFL last year.  I've explored this before, and a rookie QB's CPOE correlates relatively well with his career CPOE.  This means that we can judge how good of a passer a QB is, just from a rookie season.  Obviously there is some degree of error, and some QBs buck the trend (Josh Allen).  But Hurts is not in good historical company.  FWIW, this was the same argument I made for Haskins sucking.

Daniel Jones has a completely different set of issues.  He's an accurate enough passer - CPOE right around league average for both his rookie and sophomore seasons.  His issues have been processing speed and pocket awareness.  These issues have been confounded by the fact that the Giants offensive line has been one of the worst in the league the past two seasons, and his receivers had trouble getting separation (Golden Tate in particular).   But with upgraded weapons and with another year of experience, there is hope.  Still worried about the O-line though.

Those rankings are pretty idiotic.
But yeah Giants clearly have an edge on RB1 and WR right now.

I see no way Sanders/Johnson/Scott/Gainwell is that low, especially in a scheme like this new one where they are going to be used way more. Like obviously when Saquon is healthy he can be the best. But that's a pretty solid stable of backs to at least be #18 or higher.

They both have solid to good TEs, Goedert's ceiling is  higher and he'll finally get a chance to show that.
OL is still pretty clearly in the Eagles' favor, they need to stay healthy but have top of the roster talent and the depth.
If the Eagles do well this year, the oline has a big part of that.

WR the giants on paper and on tape have an advantage, #11 seems a bit rich but they are top 2/3rds probably. Eagles it's all question marks. They could earn that spot or Smith can pick up where he left off, Reagor can emerge with a full year and who knows maybe that Fulgham we saw for a month comes back. But nothing is concrete there. If Smith hits like he has the potential to, it'll be similar to the RBs where the Eagles have the clear #1 and the Giants have the deeper stable. Both units are looking better on either team.

I'm with you on the task ahead for Hurts, he showed glimpses after Doug finally gave up on Carson improving.
Best thing he has going for him over guys like a Haskins is he does seem to be locked in with all the surrounding stuff that goes into quarterbacking.  But we've seen guys like that never be able to overcome their talent deficiencies. As a fan I'm fine giving him a year to prove he can with there being no real better options. Rather that than what Washington is doing, book is written on Fitz and he's in his late 30s even if he does finally play consistently for now 17 games you're going to have to find a guy soon and have less ammo to do so.

3 hours ago, Gmen said:

Since the Eagles lost out on the Adoree Jackson sweepstakes their #2 CB is Avante Maddox, and Darius Slay hasn't exactly play like probowl Darius Slay since he's been with the Eagles.  That's not a secondary I would feel comfortable with.

Adoree is solid, I got the reason he was cut...but won't act like he wouldn't have been an improvement...hell anyone would be. I still think the #2 corner has yet to be added, can see them trying to emulate Xavier Rhoades bounceback in Indy here with a vet.

Saving grace is this scheme is going to be night and day to what Schwartz did with corners. Jim would leave corners on islands all the time with no extra rush to at least help them that way. Gannon's scheme seems to be more cover 2, so the corners will get help over the top and will have extra rushers.

Hopefully we don't use all the 1sts next year for a QB, would be nice to snag a corner too.

[Danger]

Simply put, Daniel Jones has shown nothing to inspire confidence. Even after the Rookie season gimme. He was underwhelming last year.

[EaglesPeteC]

Locked on NFL Draft's All NFC East team

QB- Dak Prescott 

RB- Saquon Barkley

WRs- Amari Cooper/Terry McLaurin/Kenny Golladay 

TE- Dallas Goedart

T- Tyron Smith/Lane Johnson

C- Jason Kelce

G- Zack Martin/Brandon Scherff

EDGE- DeMarcus Lawrence/ Leonard Williams(?)

DT- Fletcher Cox/Jonathan Allen

LB- Cole Holcomb/Micah Parsons

CB- James Bradbury/Darius Slay/William Jackson

S- Anthony Harris/Julian Love

 

The offense is pretty standard. The only real argument is Brooks over Schreff

I don't know WTF they did with that defense.....

[HTTRDynasty]

42 minutes ago, EaglesPeteC said:

Locked on NFL Draft's All NFC East team

QB- Dak Prescott 

RB- Saquon Barkley

WRs- Amari Cooper/Terry McLaurin/Kenny Golladay 

TE- Dallas Goedart

T- Tyron Smith/Lane Johnson

C- Jason Kelce

G- Zack Martin/Brandon Scherff

EDGE- DeMarcus Lawrence/ Leonard Williams(?)

DT- Fletcher Cox/Jonathan Allen

LB- Cole Holcomb/Micah Parsons

CB- James Bradbury/Darius Slay/William Jackson

S- Anthony Harris/Julian Love

 

The offense is pretty standard. The only real argument is Brooks over Schreff

I don't know WTF they did with that defense.....

Excluding rookies...

QB- Dak Prescott 

RB- Saquon Barkley

WRs- Terry McLaurin / Amari Cooper / Kenny Golladay 

TEs- Dallas Goedart/ (Logan Thomas)

T- Tyron Smith / Lane Johnson

C- Jason Kelce

G- Zack Martin / Brandon Scherff

 

EDGE- Chase Young / Demarcus Lawrence

DT- Fletcher Cox / Jonathan Allen

LB- Cole Holcomb / Blake Martinez / (Jaylon Smith)

CB- James Bradbury / William Jackson / Adoree Jackson

S- Anthony Harris / Kamren Curl

[Go_Giants]

6 hours ago, Jeezla said:

You played bad teams. You have a top 10 defense for the same reasons the jets do. Giants D doesn't scare anybody. They will get lit up by good teams, but play good vs bad teams, just like every average defense. 

If they play a bunch of bottom 10 offenses, the defense will finish top 10. If they play a bunch of top 10 offenses, they will finish in the bottom 10.

In the stat I used points allowed, Giants were #9 the Jets #26 so no the Jets were not a top 10 defense.

Seeing how the Eagles did not lite up the Giants defense, are you admitting they are a bad team. Seems like some Eagles fans believe the Eagles are winning 10 or more games and are a legitimate  threat to win this division.

[Go_Giants]

6 hours ago, MKnight82 said:

If Daniel Jones struggles this year does Dave Gettleman survive to pick the next QB?

Good question, I am guessing no.

[Kiltman]

26 minutes ago, Go_Giants said:

In the stat I used points allowed, Giants were #9 the Jets #26 so no the Jets were not a top 10 defense.

Seeing how the Eagles did not lite up the Giants defense, are you admitting they are a bad team. Seems like some Eagles fans believe the Eagles are winning 10 or more games and are a legitimate  threat to win this division.

Will the Eagles be bad this year? Decent shot.

Were they worse last year? 100%.

Cutting away an inept Doug offense and a wayward Wentz should improve who the Eagles are on their own. 
 

Even last year’s mess was good enough to split the series.

 

I don’t think any Eagles fans are saying we will be a top team, most everyone is just saying the Giants won’t be. Which will be the same as last year.

[Go_Giants]

4 hours ago, Kiltman said:

Spotty doesn't mean awful. Spotty means they have holes and lack the star talent to probably be consistent week to week, let alone year to year. A lot of times when a team sticks to being at one of those top 3rd of the league spots it's because of top of the league talent. Both the teams are sparse on that front. But both are good enough to help if the QBs are doing their parts. 

Has the Giants Oline rapidly improved since last year? Who cares about the money if they aren't going to do anything with it. If Jones gets it together these next two years it'll be just in time for them to have to pay for a lot of these guys. Being cheap only matters if it opens up paying for talent elsewhere and....
Sure, year two could and should be better. But like how much better can anyone be in a Jason Garrett offense amirite? 

Money is we are looking elsewhere for a QB next year, can use one or all three of our 1sts to do so.
But money is also on you guys should be too, Giants have a solid shot at the division but that ≠ them being a threat at anything.

But hey..just my take on them.

The Giants have a probowl caliber player at every level, D-line (L.Williams) Linebacker (B. Martinez) and Secondary (J. Bradberry). With free agency the draft and the return of injured players, our linebackers and secondary have been augmented. The Giants defense at one point was not just helping the team it was carrying the team. No matter what anyone thinks of this defense last year (top 10, just average or below average) it is going to be a lot better this season.

Can the offense line rapidly improve? Probably not considering we have to go against two top 10, maybe even top 5 defensive in just 5 days to start the year.  After that I expect to see steady improvement from the line. I am not saying they are going to be great they are not, for this team to win this season all this o-line needs to be is average, which is a reachable goal.

Joe Judge knows Garret is the weak link of the coaching staff, but he is still just a 2nd year coach, it is too early for him to fire a coordinator the owner put in place. That being said it is the Garrett offense in name only this season. Judge promoted a coach to senior offensive assistant and brought in another person to help Garrett with the passing attack.

[EagleBlueDon]

44 minutes ago, Go_Giants said:

In the stat I used points allowed, Giants were #9 the Jets #26 so no the Jets were not a top 10 defense.

Seeing how the Eagles did not lite up the Giants defense, are you admitting they are a bad team. Seems like some Eagles fans believe the Eagles are winning 10 or more games and are a legitimate  threat to win this division.

I don't think it's ridiculous at all to think the Eagles could win this joke of a division. To suggest otherwise is the more crazy thing imo. Having established that this division is indeed bad, 10 wins isn't that far fetched either.

[Go_Giants]

10 minutes ago, Kiltman said:

I don’t think any Eagles fans are saying we will be a top team, most everyone is just saying the Giants won’t be. Which will be the same as last year.

The Giants swept WFT.

They were one catch from sweeping the Eagles.

They ended Dak season and beat the Cowboys when they still had a chance to win this division.

And they did this with out their best player Saquan Barkley. Barkley is back and the team has upgraded the offense weapons and as well as their linebackers and secondary. I have many reasons to believe this year is going to be different.

[Kiltman]

1 hour ago, Go_Giants said:

The Giants have a probowl caliber player at every level, D-line (L.Williams) Linebacker (B. Martinez) and Secondary (J. Bradberry). With free agency the draft and the return of injured players, our linebackers and secondary have been augmented. The Giants defense at one point was not just helping the team it was carrying the team. No matter what anyone thinks of this defense last year (top 10, just average or below average) it is going to be a lot better this season.

Can the offense line rapidly improve? Probably not considering we have to go against two top 10, maybe even top 5 defensive in just 5 days to start the year.  After that I expect to see steady improvement from the line. I am not saying they are going to be great they are not, for this team to win this season all this o-line needs to be is average, which is a reachable goal.

Joe Judge knows Garret is the weak link of the coaching staff, but he is still just a 2nd year coach, it is too early for him to fire a coordinator the owner put in place. That being said it is the Garrett offense in name only this season. Judge promoted a coach to senior offensive assistant and brought in another person to help Garrett with the passing attack.

Allowing Martinez to slide because probowl is an irrelevant thing, what about the other 8 players (more if we get into sub packages)? Adoree was an overpay but a solid #2, what else changed?

The Oline better improve in an obvious way if what you think will happen can happen. Otherwise it’s more Danny Nickels and Saquon getting negatives to 2.5 yards a carry with some big ones he breaks on his own thrown in.

As long as Garrett is calling plays nothing will change no matter how many advisors you bring in. That’s the problem. Eagles just did this last year.

He’s like the worst side of a bunch of different play callers the last few years. 
 

1 hour ago, Go_Giants said:

The Giants swept WFT.

They were one catch from sweeping the Eagles.

They ended Dak season and beat the Cowboys when they still had a chance to win this division.

And they did this with out their best player Saquan Barkley. Barkley is back and the team has upgraded the offense weapons and as well as their linebackers and secondary. I have many reasons to believe this year is going to be different.

They beat or barely loss to some of the worst teams in the league and this is a reason to be up on them? I’m confused.

Hey more power to ya. It’ll be fun and competitive this year. We here are trying to be realistic and naturally pessimistic. But by all means believe in Danny and Co..