Andrew Luck vs Trevor Lawrence

[Tetsujin]

1 hour ago, DirtyDez said:

I thought Luck had more arm talent at Stanford but it’s still early in TL’s career.  Luck was a freak though.

 

I remember that play. I watched a ton of Luck in college but the ball really jumps out of TL's hand more, IMO, but it's because he has elite arm strength. Luck's is very good,though.

[Calvert28]

11 hours ago, PAW said:

Lawrence has been referred to as the best QB prospect since Peyton since he has been in HS.  Pretty much every HS recruiting analyst had him as the best QB prospect they've ever seen. 

Lots of analyst say that. But he didn't have quite the hype of a Vince Young, Terrelle Pryor, or Jimmy Clausen or even Tim Couch for that matter. I have seen a few sites that even had Justin Fields over him as the Top ranked QB for most of the year.

[Ozzy]

On 1/25/2019 at 1:42 PM, Activated10 said:

Lawrence is only freshman but so far form you seen and where you project him to be at end of his college career, who's the better prospect as these 2 are probably most hyped prospects in the last 20 years 

Manning was drafted in 1998 so is he not included in this list?  I guess if you consider it this year 2019 sure but Peyton Manning was a more elite prospect than both Luck and Lawrence, Manning is the standard I feel.

 

As for Luck and Lawrence, it is still early to call because Lawrence still has some time, could have a better idea after his sophomore year.  But in terms of freshman seasons Lawrence is more advanced I feel, but lucky for him he has weapons to throw to.  Ross who arguably was the best WR in the nation especially late in the season after just being ok during the regular season.  Then you also have Higgins and Rodgers and others.  

 

Luck was in a very run heavy offense that had some weapons but nothing to the level Lawrence has at Clemson in terms of playing with elite talent.  Both are athletic but Luck is a little more built Lawrence is a little more lean and quick.  Arm talent I would give Lawrence the edge as well.  Luck was more of a typical pro style offensive QB in college but what Lawrence runs at Clemson many NFL teams are clearly doing the same thing now a days.  So in some ways that offense is pro style because many pro teams use a lot of the same style often.  This next year will tell a lot about Lawrence and how he deals with the unreal expectations that will be on him.  

[BowlesDawgDX]

On 1/25/2019 at 3:31 PM, KellChippy said:

Lawrence at the moment.

Remember though, the hype for Jameis after his first season as a starter was crazy.  While I like Lawrence a lot more than Jameis even as a freshman, they both benefited from unreal supporting casts.

 

Christian Hackenberg as well. Don't get me wrong, Lawrence is fantastic, but let's see how he does in year 2 and 3

[SBLIII]

3 minutes ago, BowlesDawgDX said:

Christian Hackenberg as well. Don't get me wrong, Lawrence is fantastic, but let's see how he does in year 2 and 3

He was pretty good but no comparison to Lawrence. 

[Ozzy]

18 minutes ago, BowlesDawgDX said:

Christian Hackenberg as well. Don't get me wrong, Lawrence is fantastic, but let's see how he does in year 2 and 3

True, one also has Johnny Manziel and Sam Bradford but both of them were redshirt FR QBs.  But to me Lawrence is on and entirely different level than them and Hackenberg it is not even close either or Winston.  Lawrence shows more pocket awareness and fundamentals in a series than Hackenberg showed his entire career.  Only one close in terms of pure upside and arm talent is Michael Vick and he too was a RS FR.  Few of them were obviously true freshman like Lawrence.  Deondre Francois and Jacob Eason, both of them had good freshman years, Francois was a RS FR season but clearly since then he has disappointed I feel and never got back to that same level as a player, same with Eason but Eason will be really interesting how he does at Washington next year.

 

But sure if Trevor Lawrence plateaued last year and will never get any better and has peaked, yeah he will not be that good but I seriously doubt that will be the case.  Nothing about him makes it seem like he is flawed and will fail from here on out.  His pure size, athletic ability and arm talent is very rare but yeah probably should wait and see how he does next year.

 

[Teen Girl Squad]

On 1/25/2019 at 12:31 PM, KellChippy said:

Lawrence at the moment.

Remember though, the hype for Jameis after his first season as a starter was crazy.  While I like Lawrence a lot more than Jameis even as a freshman, they both benefited from unreal supporting casts.

 

Yeah to me Jameis is the cautionary tale. He followed his first year with an underwhelming second (plagued by turnovers) and as we've seen in the pros, it turns out his freshman season was the statistical outlier. Luck's hype came from years of excellent performance at Stanford, a school where he didn't have a decided talent advantage week to week. Not to say Lawrence is a flash in the pan or fake hype, just that people need to temper their expectations a bit.

[Activated10]

12 hours ago, Ozzy said:

Manning was drafted in 1998 so is he not included in this list?  I guess if you consider it this year 2019 sure but Peyton Manning was a more elite prospect than both Luck and Lawrence, Manning is the standard I feel.

 

As for Luck and Lawrence, it is still early to call because Lawrence still has some time, could have a better idea after his sophomore year.  But in terms of freshman seasons Lawrence is more advanced I feel, but lucky for him he has weapons to throw to.  Ross who arguably was the best WR in the nation especially late in the season after just being ok during the regular season.  Then you also have Higgins and Rodgers and others.  

 

Luck was in a very run heavy offense that had some weapons but nothing to the level Lawrence has at Clemson in terms of playing with elite talent.  Both are athletic but Luck is a little more built Lawrence is a little more lean and quick.  Arm talent I would give Lawrence the edge as well.  Luck was more of a typical pro style offensive QB in college but what Lawrence runs at Clemson many NFL teams are clearly doing the same thing now a days.  So in some ways that offense is pro style because many pro teams use a lot of the same style often.  This next year will tell a lot about Lawrence and how he deals with the unreal expectations that will be on him.  

Peyton Manning wasn't considered to be better than Ryan Leaf from many people, both were elite prospects though so maybe that isn't fair to Peyton Manning but he didn't separate himself in that class

[Ozzy]

1 minute ago, Activated10 said:

Peyton Manning wasn't considered to be better than Ryan Leaf from many people, both were elite prospects though so maybe that isn't fair to Peyton Manning but he didn't separate himself in that class

Not sure what you were watching but in no way was Ryan Leaf a better prospect than Peyton Manning.  Leaf had the big arm but his pocket fundamentals were nothing compared to Manning, much less the consistency Manning showed Leaf did not show over his entire career.  Manning was better in almost every single way, not to mention leadership, to me Manning was the clear #1 QB and as a prospect is pretty close to prototype as you can get.  Mind you I did not see Elway and those other guys play in college, that was before my time but since I have been watching Manning is it in terms of prototype QBs.

[Tugboat]

Luck was the archetype "franchise QB" prospect.  He checked all the boxes physically, he was productive and effective, he won games, he led men...and he was by all accounts, exceptionally smart and capable of absorbing playbook information.  Really, the only tiny chink in his armor as the "Perfect Prospect" was that his arm was just "good" not great.  He was as "safe" as a QB prospect gets.

 

Trevor Lawrence is really intriguing...but also, he's only started a year in college, in a really gimmicky system.  He's got all the tools, he's got a bigtime headstart on getting those signature wins under his belt.  He's a top tier prospect.  But i'd like to see a little more first.  I want to see an evolution in his play from what he's done, to something more.  If he can put together a couple more years like that...yeah, i think we start asking this question for real.  Until then...he's a huge upside, uncertain downside prospect.  But he's just get started on his collegiate career.

[lod01]

Lawrence. His resume is already ahead of Luck at the same point in their college careers. A freshman QB beats Alabama. There' s a good chance they win 3 straight NCAA championships. He wants to be great. There is Manning attitude in him.

[MSURacerDT55]

I picked Lawrence, but if Luck had access to the same type of talent around him like Lawrence did we would have had multiple championships

[Ozzy]

On 1/29/2019 at 9:51 AM, Tugboat said:

Luck was the archetype "franchise QB" prospect.  He checked all the boxes physically, he was productive and effective, he won games, he led men...and he was by all accounts, exceptionally smart and capable of absorbing playbook information.  Really, the only tiny chink in his armor as the "Perfect Prospect" was that his arm was just "good" not great.  He was as "safe" as a QB prospect gets.

 

Trevor Lawrence is really intriguing...but also, he's only started a year in college, in a really gimmicky system.  He's got all the tools, he's got a bigtime headstart on getting those signature wins under his belt.  He's a top tier prospect.  But i'd like to see a little more first.  I want to see an evolution in his play from what he's done, to something more.  If he can put together a couple more years like that...yeah, i think we start asking this question for real.  Until then...he's a huge upside, uncertain downside prospect.  But he's just get started on his collegiate career.

Sure one could say awhile back Clemson is a gimmicky system, but when the NFL systems look remarkable similar to many pass happy college systems there is clearly starting to be some overlap.  When guys like Mahomes, Goff, Watson, Trubisky and Mayfield all came from Air raid type systems in college and all have had a good deal of success in the NFL right away says something.  It is just how football is played now with the rules and how defenses are flagged on certain things for pass interference and roughing the passer.  So to me what used to be a gimmicky offense is just now considered the norm in some ways.

 

Lawrence to me is easily ahead of Luck if you just look at freshman play.  He already has a way better arm than Luck that is for sure.  Yes he has more to show no doubt but there is little about him that says he will just flame out from here on out.  If he is not the #1 pick in 2021 that would be a freaking shock.  It will be interesting to watch after all this hype is put on him about being this future great NFL QB before he even is out of college, will see how he handles all that.

 

 

[Tugboat]

1 hour ago, Ozzy said:

Sure one could say awhile back Clemson is a gimmicky system, but when the NFL systems look remarkable similar to many pass happy college systems there is clearly starting to be some overlap.  When guys like Mahomes, Goff, Watson, Trubisky and Mayfield all came from Air raid type systems in college and all have had a good deal of success in the NFL right away says something.  It is just how football is played now with the rules and how defenses are flagged on certain things for pass interference and roughing the passer.  So to me what used to be a gimmicky offense is just now considered the norm in some ways.

 

Lawrence to me is easily ahead of Luck if you just look at freshman play.  He already has a way better arm than Luck that is for sure.  Yes he has more to show no doubt but there is little about him that says he will just flame out from here on out.  If he is not the #1 pick in 2021 that would be a freaking shock.  It will be interesting to watch after all this hype is put on him about being this future great NFL QB before he even is out of college, will see how he handles all that.

 

 

I don't really doubt that Lawrence will be absolutely fine jumping into an NFL system, and like you said...a lot of the NFL game is gravitating toward the college systems anyway.

I just think when you're comparing to a "benchmark" prospect like Andrew Luck, there's a difference in how much he'd shown in the mental aspects of the game and managing a more sophisticated system.  It's not really a "knock" on Lawrence, so much as just a compliment to what Luck was as a prospect.  But yeah...we're also talking about a guy who still has at least two years left in college to show that stuff, compared to Luck with all those years under his belt. Which isn't that fair i guess.  Just hard to completely separate out.

[Teen Girl Squad]

I'm less worried about the "gimmicky system" and more concerned with "he's on a stacked team thats better across the board than everyone he plays, maybe even Alabama included."We've seen that be a recipe for underwhelming NFL success. Again, I'm high on Lawrence like most but I am not interested in the generational talent talk that is going on.