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Humble_Beast

Jared Cook?

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you guys think it would be wise to franchise tag Cook? Last year he played like a top 5 TE,  so paying him top 3 TE money isn't a stretch.. We could maybe use him as trade bait for another asset, or bring him back. A team lacking talent, would be foolish to let him walk for nothing. This organization needs better asset management. A one year deal would be nice, because Cook easily had his best season, wonder if he can do it twice... He is getting older, so Idk If investing long term is wise. We have the cap space to overpaid him for one year, and no one else to franchise....  

 

Would you guys franchise Cook? Makes sense when you consider our current state of WRS.. why create another hole, would rather focus on filling needs in free agency

Edited by Humble_Beast

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Doesn't seem like they are making efforts to bring him back and Cook likely wants to play for something at his age. Good class of TEs, Cook will likely walk. Franchise tagging him would be mindless. Raiders don't need to overspend on a TE when they are not a playoff team in 2019.

Rebuild, get younger and prep for 2020.

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5 minutes ago, big_palooka said:

Doesn't seem like they are making efforts to bring him back and Cook likely wants to play for something at his age. Good class of TEs, Cook will likely walk. Franchise tagging him would be mindless. Raiders don't need to overspend on a TE when they are not a playoff team in 2019.

Rebuild, get younger and prep for 2020.

If we could get some talent in FA we might be able to do this a lot faster.  If we think he will live up to his contract and we will be a playoff team in the next few years while he is still under contract then why not.  Carr is the type of QB that needs a good TE.

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On 16/02/2019 at 10:29 PM, big_palooka said:

Doesn't seem like they are making efforts to bring him back and Cook likely wants to play for something at his age. Good class of TEs, Cook will likely walk. Franchise tagging him would be mindless. Raiders don't need to overspend on a TE when they are not a playoff team in 2019.

Rebuild, get younger and prep for 2020.

I understand the rebuild sentiment but I have a couple issues with it in this case:

1. We have the most important part IMO, the QB already in place so we are not in need of a full tear down and a competent coaching staff should be able to contend for the playoffs this year I believe - contend being the operative word.

2. If we are rebuilding we don’t automatically have to jettison our best players or expensive players regardless, especially if they have positive effects on the other cogs in the machine as Cook definitely has with the QB.

3. If we are getting younger and bringing in a draft pick for example then I think the best way to bring them along would be as a TE2 alongside Cook rather than putting all our eggs in the rookies basket as the receiving TE.

4. TE is generally a position with a little longer shelf life than say a WR or RB and Cook doesn't have that much wear and tear over his career having only recently ascended to undisputed starter and looked very explosive and fast last season, no reason to think he’ll falloff a cliff over the next couple seasons.

I’d definitely bring Cook back and look to sign him to a fair deal for 3 years with the 3rd year non guaranteed. I’d also look to draft a well rounded TE to take over in a couple seasons and give the rookie time to improve.

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Let Cook walk and play for a contender to end his career. Draft a TE at the end of round 1 this year. 

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32 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Let Cook walk and play for a contender to end his career. Draft a TE at the end of round 1 this year. 

why not have two stud TE.. help Carr succeed, and our WRs suck.. rookie TEs hardly shine, not even OJ Howard...  if we sign a few free agents, hit on the draft, develop our youth, we could be in the mix for a wild card. I don't want to waste another season "rebuilding"

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47 minutes ago, Humble_Beast said:

why not have two stud TE.. help Carr succeed, and our WRs suck.. rookie TEs hardly shine, not even OJ Howard...  if we sign a few free agents, hit on the draft, develop our youth, we could be in the mix for a wild card. I don't want to waste another season "rebuilding"

You don’t wanna waste another season rebuilding? Please explain to me how there is any possible way we win more than 7 games this year? Especially with the toughest schedule in the NFL by SoS. We’ll probably win 5 games. We are rebuilding. 2020 in Vegas is where we will start to be competitive again. 

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I'd prefer to use the free cap on younger free agents that can be around for 3-4 years.

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9 hours ago, Humble_Beast said:

why not have two stud TE.. help Carr succeed, and our WRs suck.. rookie TEs hardly shine, not even OJ Howard...  if we sign a few free agents, hit on the draft, develop our youth, we could be in the mix for a wild card. I don't want to waste another season "rebuilding"

Cook will probably get a pretty nice deal and he's going to be 32 next season. We're not going to be a good team next year so I'd rather spend our cap space on younger guys that will be here for a while and focus on adding studs in the draft. 

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Tight ends play well into their 30s. Give him a market value deal (8-9 million APY for 3 years). Draft a tight end too. Why not. Don't let talent walk. He's not 36 guys.

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22 hours ago, Darbsk said:

I understand the rebuild sentiment but I have a couple issues with it in this case:

1. We have the most important part IMO, the QB already in place so we are not in need of a full tear down and a competent coaching staff should be able to contend for the playoffs this year I believe - contend being the operative word.

2. If we are rebuilding we don’t automatically have to jettison our best players or expensive players regardless, especially if they have positive effects on the other cogs in the machine as Cook definitely has with the QB.

3. If we are getting younger and bringing in a draft pick for example then I think the best way to bring them along would be as a TE2 alongside Cook rather than putting all our eggs in the rookies basket as the receiving TE.

4. TE is generally a position with a little longer shelf life than say a WR or RB and Cook doesn't have that much wear and tear over his career having only recently ascended to undisputed starter and looked very explosive and fast last season, no reason to think he’ll falloff a cliff over the next couple seasons.

I’d definitely bring Cook back and look to sign him to a fair deal for 3 years with the 3rd year non guaranteed. I’d also look to draft a well rounded TE to take over in a couple seasons and give the rookie time to improve.

I would definately try to bring him back, if his mid season problems with the staff are well behind him and if he won't be a distraction.

If he is on board lets bring him back on a 1+1 or 1+1+1 deal, where the guarantees are tide to roster bonuses, so we can get out after every year.

If the draft brings a BPA TE to us, we should grab that and put him behind Cook as a weapon. Since our WR corp will remain below average for 2019 (IMO) we could always use more wuality TEs. Especially with Gruden's "love" for them and with Carr's comfort level with throwing to TEs...

In this strong TE class we could pick a solid guy even in the 3rd, who can be groomed behing Cook, while he could be a weapon even as a rookie.

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14 hours ago, BayRaider said:

You don’t wanna waste another season rebuilding? Please explain to me how there is any possible way we win more than 7 games this year? Especially with the toughest schedule in the NFL by SoS. We’ll probably win 5 games. We are rebuilding. 2020 in Vegas is where we will start to be competitive again. 

Ever the optimist I would suggest that a years growth for the rookies, some of which looked pretty promising like Hurst and Hall, a couple of impact free agents and a large number of high round rookies could turn around a roster pretty quickly. Imagine for a moment if we got a realistic FA haul like Ansah at DE, Earl Thomas at FS, a decent RT like Nseke and a Guy like Avery Williamson in the middle of the LB core and added a few draft picks like Clelin Ferrell, Nasir Adderley and a couple receivers like N’Keal Harry or Debo Samuel which we realistically could do. Carr has a second season in the same system with some of the same receivers and Gruden actually remembers he’s a pretty adept offensive coach, there really is no reason why we shouldn’t be competing at the very least.

If we think Gruden and Mayock are competent then we should be competing very quickly.

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2 hours ago, Darbsk said:

Ever the optimist I would suggest that a years growth for the rookies, some of which looked pretty promising like Hurst and Hall, a couple of impact free agents and a large number of high round rookies could turn around a roster pretty quickly. Imagine for a moment if we got a realistic FA haul like Ansah at DE, Earl Thomas at FS, a decent RT like Nseke and a Guy like Avery Williamson in the middle of the LB core and added a few draft picks like Clelin Ferrell, Nasir Adderley and a couple receivers like N’Keal Harry or Debo Samuel which we realistically could do. Carr has a second season in the same system with some of the same receivers and Gruden actually remembers he’s a pretty adept offensive coach, there really is no reason why we shouldn’t be competing at the very least.

If we think Gruden and Mayock are competent then we should be competing very quickly.

This is the silver lining IMO.

If Carr can step ahead we could turn it around quickly. Obviously we need better production and better talent around him, but he needs to make a big step. If he can't we are stuck in this rebuilidng for years regardless of FA's, draft IMO.

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17 minutes ago, Rolni said:

This is the silver lining IMO.

If Carr can step ahead we could turn it around quickly. Obviously we need better production and better talent around him, but he needs to make a big step. If he can't we are stuck in this rebuilidng for years regardless of FA's, draft IMO.

Agreed, although I will say that I think if the team is strong even average QB play and specifically not turning the ball over and converting 3rd downs can win a whole lot of games. The list of QBs that have won the big one in the recent past is not that stellar and include the likes of Flacco, a clearly second hand Brady, the corpse of Payton Manning, Nick Foles, Eli Manning, Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson in the last two decades. The list of losing QBs has some really mediocre contenders. While it clearly would be a massive help to have a prime Brady or Rodgers I firmly believe that a Derek Carr level QB (I’m thinking of his average level of play over 2015 to 2018) can easily be good enough. If he plays like 2016 which would be above the mean then he could easily lead us to the promised land.

We have to IMO build a solid team and support Carr and we’ll be challenging year after year, the one year he had continuity in receivers, a stable environment with a OC to build a rapport and good protection he was near MVP level,  the plan has to be to see if he can replicate that first before tearing it all down. 

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On 2/18/2019 at 2:05 PM, Humble_Beast said:

why not have two stud TE.. help Carr succeed, and our WRs suck.. rookie TEs hardly shine, not even OJ Howard...  if we sign a few free agents, hit on the draft, develop our youth, we could be in the mix for a wild card. I don't want to waste another season "rebuilding"

As someone else asked and you avoided Please explain to me how there is any possible way we win more than 7 games this year?

This team plays in one of the toughest divisions and are more that a few free agents away, You don't build teams in FA and the top players will be tagged or resigned. So you're left overpaying tier 2 and 3 FAs. The draft is always a crapshoot and this staff has shown no ability to develop anything. The team isn't going to be in the wildcard picture until 2022 if things go right and if Carr flops, then all bets are off.

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