Shockwave Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 3 minutes ago, Kip Smithers said: There is no way you can ever convince me of this. Might as well trade Saquon while you’re at it... Because great WR's don't win you SB's. Solid offensive and defensive lines, secondaries, and/or elite QB play is what matters most in this modern NFL. A move like this absolutely makes sense for a rebuild, you trade a guy at his absolute peak before he starts to decline, but I think DG failed in getting enough in return and that's where my criticism lies in this trade (as it currently stands). Two years from now when we see the final result perhaps we look back and see the plan and appreciate the move. Right now it's hard to imagine that being the case. I was not a fan of the Barkley pick, although I love the player and the immense talent he is. Elite RB's also do not win you SB's. Now if this move results in solidifying the O and D lines, adding the next franchise QB be it Haskins/Rosen/Tua or whoever on down the line. Then it was absolutely the right move. For now... yea it looks bad. But I need to the see the final product. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 7 minutes ago, Gmen said: I think we got decent value. Peppers is 23 years old and he was a first round pick two years ago. It’s not insignificant given we just lost Collins. I like this trade alot more when I combine both the trades together. To me Vernon was not a loss at all, and Zeitler was a great add. I think we won that trade. In the end we sent Vernon/OBJ to Clev for 1st,3rd,stud OL, young high potential Safety, and salary cap relief after this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodaraw Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 18 minutes ago, Gmen said: I’m here buddy. I expressed my thoughts in the NFL news thread. I’m torn on the trade because OBJ provides so many exciting moments over the past 4 years. But at the same time I understand the Giants are in a rebuilding stage and this may be for the best Rebuilding with a 38 year old declining quarterback? That’s a neat strategy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmen19851 Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Just now, Shockey1979 said: Because great WR's don't win you SB's. Solid offensive and defensive lines, secondaries, and/or elite QB play is what matters most in this modern NFL. A move like this absolutely makes sense for a rebuild, you trade a guy at his absolute peak before he starts to decline, but I think DG failed in getting enough in return and that's where my criticism lies in this trade (as it currently stands). Two years from now when we see the final result perhaps we look back and see the plan and appreciate the move. Right now it's hard to imagine that being the case. I was not a fan of the Barkley pick, although I love the player and the immense talent he is. Elite RB's also do not win you SB's. Now if this move results in solidifying the O and D lines, adding the next franchise QB be it Haskins/Rosen/Tua or whoever on down the line. Then it was absolutely the right move. For now... yea it looks bad. But I need to the see the final product. My initial reaction to the trade was much like the rest of you as I was infuriated in losing a "generational" talent at a skill position. But now that I've had some time to think I have started to come around to the deal. I would have expected a little more compensation for a player like him but if that's the best the giants could have done then so be it. It really matter what you do wit the compensation rather than what it is. As long as there is a plan, then I'm all for this trade. First and foremost, we have our offensive superstar. I truly believe that Dave Gettleman thinks that Saquon made Odell expendable with the way he played last year. Odell would have been at least a 19 million dollar cap hit throughout the rest of his deal. Teams just don't win with paying wide receivers that much of their cap. I think that we will allocate this money to keeping both Engram and Shepard beyond their rookie contracts. We would have lost one of them if Beckham was on the roster. Unfortunately, this trade probably means that 2019 will be a lost year. It will be about building towards 2020. I would assume we will have a high pick in the 2020 draft and we will have a ton of cap room next year assuming this will be Eli's last year and dead money coming off the books with Veron and OBJ coming off the books. Again this trade is all about having a plan in place. Is that trading a couple picks in this years draft for Josh Rosen? Is it trading or signing Russel Wilson next year? I can't speak to the plan. But the Eagles tore everything down after Chip Kelly's failed tenure. So I can only hope our rebuild is as successful was theirs. One thing is for sure, this is the first move in a new era of Giants football Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 39 minutes ago, Kodaraw said: Rebuilding with a 38 year old declining quarterback? That’s a neat strategy. I'm more then certain Eli will not be around after 2019. This is the final year. Whether it's Haskins/Rosen/Tua or whoever is the end game they'll sit behind Eli for this season (or perhaps take over halfway through) and learn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmen Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Kodaraw said: Rebuilding with a 38 year old declining quarterback? That’s a neat strategy. Yea sure. If only there were some sort of event in late April where teams were able to acquire young players... if only... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acgott Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 You don’t trade good talent. eli needs to be cut. It’s a ridiculous decision to keep him. Use his cap to fix the team and sign bortles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go_Giants Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 5 hours ago, Kip Smithers said: There is no way you can ever convince me of this. Might as well trade Saquon while you’re at it... Saquon will not be 30 when the Giants are ready to win again and still on his rookie contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shockwave Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 2 hours ago, Acgott said: You don’t trade good talent. eli needs to be cut. It’s a ridiculous decision to keep him. Use his cap to fix the team and sign bortles. Well I can agree it's time to move on from Eli...but Bortles? No TY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acgott Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 25 minutes ago, Shockey1979 said: Well I can agree it's time to move on from Eli...but Bortles? No TY Just to have a warm body. Geno, AJ Maccaron, it doens't matter. Play for 2020 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GmenSeattle Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 Unless someone wants a 1 year deal on a bad team I'm fine with rolling with Eli for another year. It's not like this one draft is fixing this team, and we've got quite a bit (the most I believe?) dead money, cutting Eli just hamstrings us more. Frankly the worse we are next year the better off we are IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acgott Posted March 13, 2019 Author Share Posted March 13, 2019 Just now, GmenSeattle said: Unless someone wants a 1 year deal on a bad team I'm fine with rolling with Eli for another year. It's not like this one draft is fixing this team, and we've got quite a bit (the most I believe?) dead money, cutting Eli just hamstrings us more. Frankly the worse we are next year the better off we are IMO. Cutting Eli gives us 17M of useable cap. The 6M cap for the dead money, we already can't use because of Eli's contract. Thats a lot of money we can use to help the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kodaraw Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 5 hours ago, Gmen said: Yea sure. If only there were some sort of event in late April where teams were able to acquire young players... if only... I think you missed my point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Smithers Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 7 hours ago, Shockey1979 said: Because great WR's don't win you SB's. Solid offensive and defensive lines, secondaries, and/or elite QB play is what matters most in this modern NFL. A move like this absolutely makes sense for a rebuild, you trade a guy at his absolute peak before he starts to decline, but I think DG failed in getting enough in return and that's where my criticism lies in this trade (as it currently stands). Two years from now when we see the final result perhaps we look back and see the plan and appreciate the move. Right now it's hard to imagine that being the case. I was not a fan of the Barkley pick, although I love the player and the immense talent he is. Elite RB's also do not win you SB's. Now if this move results in solidifying the O and D lines, adding the next franchise QB be it Haskins/Rosen/Tua or whoever on down the line. Then it was absolutely the right move. For now... yea it looks bad. But I need to the see the final product. There are a lot of things that go into winning SBs, it’s never just one thing. People point to well, “when was the last time an great or elites WR won a SB”? It’s a silly statement for one Julio, Moss, Fitz, were all guys that were close to winning and that notion would be put to bed. Secondly correlation =/= causation. Beckham is a piece you use for a rebuild. He’s not somebody you get rid of. You don’t get rid of a HOF talent and think that it helps with a rebuild. Louis Rodrick, who I’m starting to think should’ve been hired instead, made a great point about how these executives have this arrogance that any player is replaceable. The compensation that is equatable to Beckhams talents and impact is very high so you’re gonna get fair value for him or even close which is why you don’t trade him. You can rebuild with Beckham. People make it seem as if the only way to rebuild is getting rid of Beckham. Let’s face it, they traded him because he isn’t a personality fit for this current management which for that, shame on them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kip Smithers Posted March 13, 2019 Share Posted March 13, 2019 4 hours ago, Acgott said: You don’t trade good talent. eli needs to be cut. It’s a ridiculous decision to keep him. Use his cap to fix the team and sign bortles. We finally agree on something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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