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Pick a bust - 2019

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On 2/23/2019 at 9:15 AM, Ozzy said:

DK Metcalf Ole Miss WR RS SOPH: Has amazing physical gifts but his production in college is nothing amazing and seems to get injured all the time.  Sure if he can stay healthy maybe but that is a huge if.  Is pretty raw to be picked as high as some project him to be.  

Ehh he isn’t injured all the time. He played a full 12 last year and the year before wasn’t he redshirted? He had a freak injury. 

I would be much more inclined to believe your take if you discussed his route tree. 

On 2/23/2019 at 9:15 AM, Ozzy said:

Dwayne Haskins Ohio State QB RS SOPH:  Good QB but not sure he is as great as some make him out to be, is just the best in a pretty poor QB class at the top end but I could see some of the other guys out playing him long term.  When pressured he struggles and not sure he will be able to hold up if say he is on a team with a poor WR core without a lot of weapons to throw to.  If he was drafted in the 2020 draft he would arguably be the 4th or 5th best QB.    

His receivers weren’t even that good. They were good in college, but most of those guys won’t be seeing significant snaps as NFL pass catchers. Yeah and all QB’s starting for the first time in Division 1 football are going to be able to stare down the barrel of a rifle and deliver a strike.

The fact that his mechanics stay the same regardless if there is pressure or not speaks volumes to his mental make up, and with more experience is not going to be an issue at all. The last time I watched a guy who had such flawless repitition on his throwing motion was probably Goff. Are his feet statuesque? Not in the slightest, he keeps them moving until he’s ready to deliver a strike. He anticipates people getting open, and throws the ball where they should be consistently. Those are the things that make him a stud imo and if he gets to sit for a year to learn his system he is going to ball out. 

 

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10 minutes ago, YogiBiz said:

Ehh he isn’t injured all the time. He played a full 12 last year and the year before wasn’t he redshirted? He had a freak injury. 

I would be much more inclined to believe your take if you discussed his route tree. 

His receivers weren’t even that good. They were good in college, but most of those guys won’t be seeing significant snaps as NFL pass catchers. Yeah and all QB’s starting for the first time in Division 1 football are going to be able to stare down the barrel of a rifle and deliver a strike.

The fact that his mechanics stay the same regardless if there is pressure or not speaks volumes to his mental make up, and with more experience is not going to be an issue at all. The last time I watched a guy who had such flawless repitition on his throwing motion was probably Goff. Are his feet statuesque? Not in the slightest, he keeps them moving until he’s ready to deliver a strike. He anticipates people getting open, and throws the ball where they should be consistently. Those are the things that make him a stud imo and if he gets to sit for a year to learn his system he is going to ball out. 

 

Metcalf got a foot injury as a freshman that ended his season and this past year, suffered that neck injured that ended his season this year.  Two out of three years in college he had his season ended by injury, that is not exactly a good thing.  

 

As for Haskins and the WRs he throws to, I discussed that earlier in this thread.  I do agree he does not change his mechanics that often which is nice and has a good touch and passing feel overall.  Just not sure he is going to be this All Pro for years to come in the NFL.  Also depends on where he goes and what system/coach he is with but could say that about a lot of players.

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34 minutes ago, Ozzy said:

Metcalf got a foot injury as a freshman that ended his season and this past year, suffered that neck injured that ended his season this year.  Two out of three years in college he had his season ended by injury, that is not exactly a good thing.   

As for Haskins and the WRs he throws to, I discussed that earlier in this thread.  I do agree he does not change his mechanics that often which is nice and has a good touch and passing feel overall.  Just not sure he is going to be this All Pro for years to come in the NFL.  Also depends on where he goes and what system/coach he is with but could say that about a lot of players.

I forgot about the foot injury. I’ll retract that statement. 

On the Haskins front, no QB is going to succeed unless he’s in an offense that plays to his strengths. Except the unique case of a QB being able to dominate regardless of scheme. 

Also my Haskins comparison is Phillip Rivers. It’s eerie how similar they are as prospects even down to the weird throwing motion that looks like it starts from the hip, but it winds up being faster than most every other throwing motion, and that kind of side armish (Haskins is more 3 Quarters motion than full side arm, but still) throw. If Haskins was two inches taller I would feel like they cloned Rivers. You can’t teach his ability to anticipate open receivers, or his ability to know when to throw with touch or to power a fastball. His feet can get quicker, but they are still always moving. 

I would take Haskins over Tua. Tua literally falls apart with pressure. His motion becomes sporadic, and he forgets how to move in the pocket. I would rank Haskins only behind Fromm next year MAYBE with Eason being a close third. The 2020 hype is just that hype. Before you say Herbert, ask me about that kid when he learns how to be a QB. 

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6 hours ago, SmittyBacall said:

?

Sorry, if he is so small he would need a great arm, accuracy and strength, which he doesnt seem to have.

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I disagree that Haskins didn’t have great weapons at Ohio State. Campbell will be a Mid 2nd Round Pick and is a solid all around WR. McLaurin is currently projected as a Mid 3rd Round Pick but could shoot up to the Late 2nd if he runs a sub 4.4 which he probably will. McLaurin is one of my sleepers in the NFL, he’s gonna be a solid second option on any team with great speed. 

Mike Weber was also a stud, don’t think he’ll do that great in the NFL but he was great for Ohio State.

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2 minutes ago, BayRaider said:

I disagree that Haskins didn’t have great weapons at Ohio State. Campbell will be a Mid 2nd Round Pick and is a solid all around WR. McLaurin is currently projected as a Mid 3rd Round Pick but could shoot up to the Late 2nd if he runs a sub 4.4 which he probably will. McLaurin is one of my sleepers in the NFL, he’s gonna be a solid second option on any team with great speed. 

Mike Weber was also a stud, don’t think he’ll do that great in the NFL but he was great for Ohio State.

Haskins had one of the best WR corps in the nation and one of the most talented RB duos. He did have plenty of help.

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4 hours ago, YogiBiz said:

I forgot about the foot injury. I’ll retract that statement. 

On the Haskins front, no QB is going to succeed unless he’s in an offense that plays to his strengths. Except the unique case of a QB being able to dominate regardless of scheme. 

Also my Haskins comparison is Phillip Rivers. It’s eerie how similar they are as prospects even down to the weird throwing motion that looks like it starts from the hip, but it winds up being faster than most every other throwing motion, and that kind of side armish (Haskins is more 3 Quarters motion than full side arm, but still) throw. If Haskins was two inches taller I would feel like they cloned Rivers. You can’t teach his ability to anticipate open receivers, or his ability to know when to throw with touch or to power a fastball. His feet can get quicker, but they are still always moving. 

I would take Haskins over Tua. Tua literally falls apart with pressure. His motion becomes sporadic, and he forgets how to move in the pocket. I would rank Haskins only behind Fromm next year MAYBE with Eason being a close third. The 2020 hype is just that hype. Before you say Herbert, ask me about that kid when he learns how to be a QB. 

To me Haskins has no where near the passion or leadership ability Phillip Rivers had in college.  Rivers was a spark plug, Haskins just is not that type of personality at all.  Would love to have seen a little more vocal and energizing leadership out of him but again it is just not really his personality and that might be fine.  So that alone competitively they are not alike as prospects to me, and Haskins does not have near the odd release Phillip Rivers has.

In terms of next year Tua looked bad because of that foot injury late in the season, sure played terrible in the Championship game but it was his first year starting full time.  A lot will tell with him in how he does next year with a loaded cast around him again, but even with him yeah he might look better than he is because of the weapons he has to throw to, will see.  Leadership wise and character wise because of his amazing family background and support I would give the nod to Tua, seems a little more vocal and is a little better leader on and off the field than Haskins as well.  Fromm I am not that high on,the issue with him I do not see an elite arm, and he has never passed for over 3000 yards in a season ever at Georgia.  Aaron Murray who was a 5th round pick out of Georgia, started four years in a row and passed for well over 3000 yards every season he played including his FR and SOPH years.  He is no longer in the NFL and clearly never did much when he was in the league. So that is what concerns me with Fromm.

I would take Jordan Love over Fromm all day long, as for Herbert he has more athletic ability and arm talent than a guy like Haskins, he has higher upside because he is a better athlete with a stronger arm.  Haskins is more accurate but it will be curious to see how Herbert progresses with the loaded Oregon team they have next season, should be the hands on favorites to win the conference.  

Haskins to me seems a little doughy, not really athletically built but that is not always important.  Needs to be more direct in his decisions in the pocket but will benefit from the QB class this up coming draft.  But really Murray is ten times the athlete Haskins is and has a stronger arm and throws the ball with more velocity than Haskins, only knock on Murray is his height and personality arguably.  It will be interesting how Haskins does in the NFL that is for sure, a lot of QBs put up insane numbers in college and clearly they did not translate, see if Haskins can carry over his success to the next level.  I would have really liked to see Haskins next year at Ohio State and what he could do and if he could do it again but obviously that will not happen.

 

 

1 minute ago, BayRaider said:

I disagree that Haskins didn’t have great weapons at Ohio State. Campbell will be a Mid 2nd Round Pick and is a solid all around WR. McLaurin is currently projected as a Mid 3rd Round Pick but could shoot up to the Late 2nd if he runs a sub 4.4 which he probably will. McLaurin is one of my sleepers in the NFL, he’s gonna be a solid second option on any team with great speed. 

Mike Weber was also a stud, don’t think he’ll do that great in the NFL but he was great for Ohio State.

Agreed.  Not to mention Johnnie Dixon if he times out well and passes physically will be a 4th-6th round pick, has burner speed.  Benjimen Victor will be in the NFL and is back on Ohio State next year, he has tons of athletic upside and KJ Hill is another NFL prospect as well who is dynamic with the football and along with being a good receiver is a great return man.  You also have Austin Mack who has late round potential and could have a breakout year next season and of course the freshman stud for late in the year, great in the slot Chris Olave.  Oh and JK Dobbins helps having him around at RB, yeah the team offensively had a ton of weapons not to even mention the TEs.  

 

 

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4 minutes ago, SBLIII said:

Haskins had one of the best WR corps in the nation and one of the most talented RB duos. He did have plenty of help.

Agreed. I was replying to Yogi who said otherwise. 

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Hakeem Butler would be my pick at WR.  I really think he will struggle getting open in the NFL.  I have seen him all over the mock drafts. 1st round to 3rd round.

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2 hours ago, SBLIII said:

Haskins had one of the best WR corps in the nation and one of the most talented RB duos. He did have plenty of help.

Easy to play the hindsight game, where were these guys you propped up when JT Barrett was playing QB and we were struggling to complete a pass? 

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If DK didn't have the last name  of Metcalf, I would consider him a potential bust for lack of #s. He's a Metcalf, so the pedigree is there. The injury potential is there especially if he tries going David Boston. You cannot be wound real tight in the NFL. You need to be strong but limber.

Edited by lod01

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3 hours ago, MSURacerDT55 said:

Easy to play the hindsight game, where were these guys you propped up when JT Barrett was playing QB and we were struggling to complete a pass? 

Well no ones saying Haskins isn’t good, just that he did have a ton of help. He could have two WRs in the 2nd Round and a RB in the 3rd. A QB isn’t going to get a guy drafted super high, these guys are scouted to death.

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6 minutes ago, BayRaider said:

Well no ones saying Haskins isn’t good, just that he did have a ton of help. He could have two WRs in the 2nd Round and a RB in the 3rd. A QB isn’t going to get a guy drafted super high, these guys are scouted to death.

Bro, you are talking to one of the biggest Buckeye fans on this forum, our offense was a huge concern going into the year, the only sure thing we had were our Running Backs, our offensive line was a huge concern, our WRs were even more concerning, we couldn't even definitively say who our #1 receiver was. God, it's so easy for people to play the hindsight game.

 

 

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Just now, MSURacerDT55 said:

Bro, you are talking to one of the biggest Buckeye fans on this forum, our offense was a huge concern going into the year, the only sure thing we had were our Running Backs, our offensive line was a huge concern, our WRs were even more concerning, we couldn't even definitively say who our #1 receiver was. God, it's so easy for people to play the hindsight game.

 

 

So these guys are all getting drafted high cause Haskins made them godly?

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3 minutes ago, BayRaider said:

So these guys are all getting drafted high cause Haskins made them godly?

No because they finally had a QB that could consistently get them the ball (to showcase their skills), something they couldnt do a year ago,not hard to follow

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