New Forum - New Random

[big9erfan]

Hate to beat a dead horse on this one particular point but the Committee just strongly encouraged OU and OSU to schedule patsies early in the season rather than each other. We fans will be the losers if they start doing that.  I love those good cross conference games.  In fact, if there were a whole more of those kind of games, instead of fewer of them, we might be able to get a better idea of how strong each conference is which would help in decisions like Alabama over OSU and USC and CFU thjis year. If Michigan State played Mississippi Sate, and Wisconsin played LSU, and Penn State played Texas A&M then we'd at least have sdome wild-*** idea of how to evaluate Alabama's wins over those teams. Or better yet if Alabama played Wisconsin in Madison, or Penn State in Happy Valley, or (can you imagine Saban doing this?) OU in Norman, then we'd really have a way to decide if Alabama was "clearly better" than OSU.

[Chrissooner49er]

Just had this thought: Perhaps UCF and Oklahoma will reach out and put together scheduled game since Josh Heupel--former OU QB and Offensive Coordinator--is now HC at UCF. I would very much like to see that.

[big9erfan]

See, now that's a game I'd love to see too.

[Forge]

12 minutes ago, big9erfan said:

See, now that's a game I'd love to see too.

Why? They'd schedule it like 6 years out, and by that point UCF could easily be complete and total crap again and we'd be complaining about OU scheduling light. Alabama schedule FSU for this year, who just happened to turn out to be awful, and people are complaining about how Alabama scheduled. It's not their fault that Francois got hurt in  that game and FSU ended up being awful. It was supposed to be a great matchup. OSU scheduled Oregon for 2020 and 2021, and there's a really decent chance at this point that Oregon won't even be a top 25 team in those years, so in two years we will be talking about how OSU scheduled light out of conference. We did the same thing when they played VaTech home and home and Miami. 

[Chrissooner49er]

The teams cannot help the fact that talent/success is cyclical. The problem with 'Bama is FSU is the ONLY decent non-conference matchup they scheduled. Don't bank on one game to buoy your strength of schedule. Mercer? I had never even heard of them.

Last year, OU scheduled both Ohio St. and Houston...and lost to both, unfortunately.  

[Forge]

2 hours ago, Chrissooner49er said:

The teams cannot help the fact that talent/success is cyclical. The problem with 'Bama is FSU is the ONLY decent non-conference matchup they scheduled. Don't bank on one game to buoy your strength of schedule. Mercer? I had never even heard of them.

Last year, OU scheduled both Ohio St. and Houston...and lost to both, unfortunately.  

Even the teams that schedule a tough OOC matchup typically only do one. OSU played OU...and then Army and UNLV. Last year they played OU, and then Tulsa and Bowling Green. The year before their big match up was Va tech...then they had Western Michigan, Hawaii and Northern Illinois. I'm not going to ask any team to play more than one big primetime matchup a year. There's basically against their own self interest.

OU just got unlucky last year that Houston turned out to be good - but when they scheduled that game, Houston wasn't very good. That wasn't supposed to be a primetime matchup, so I'm not going to give them credit for "tough scheduling". It just happened to play out that way. When they scheduled that game, Houston was coming off an 8-5 season. Not awful, but it was 4th in the conference and it's really no different than OSU playing tulsa, who was also coming off an 8-5 season in a lower conference when OSU scheduled them (and then finished 10-3 they year the game was scheduled). 

As you said, talent / success is cyclical, and part of the problem with scheduling is that they allow for teams to schedule so far out. That needs to be stopped. They should cap schedules at like 3 years in advance. That is plenty of time. The second issue is the uneven conference schedule. Most teams in the big 5 play 9 conference games. SEC teams only play 8, which is why you end up with Alabama playing mercer halfway through the year (which lets be honest, is basically an additional bye week for them), while a team like Ohio State ends up crossing division lines to play Iowa. That is a major issue that needs to be corrected. 

[big9erfan]

On 12/6/2017 at 10:40 AM, Forge said:

Why? They'd schedule it like 6 years out, and by that point UCF could easily be complete and total crap again and we'd be complaining about OU scheduling light. Alabama schedule FSU for this year, who just happened to turn out to be awful, and people are complaining about how Alabama scheduled. It's not their fault that Francois got hurt in  that game and FSU ended up being awful. It was supposed to be a great matchup. OSU scheduled Oregon for 2020 and 2021, and there's a really decent chance at this point that Oregon won't even be a top 25 team in those years, so in two years we will be talking about how OSU scheduled light out of conference. We did the same thing when they played VaTech home and home and Miami. 

Yeah, I know. But with Alabama there's very little chance of ever seeing them play an intersting game since they only play one tough one out of conference every year and then it's at home or on a neutral field.. Plus SEC schools play the softest conference schedules in the sense that Big 12, Pac 12 and B1G conference  team play 9 conference games instead of 8 like the SEC. And what does Alabama do with that late season week where insdtead of a tough conference game like most othe teams around the country are playing? They are busy taking part in its fabled Chicken**** Saturday where they play the Little Sisters of the Poor or somebody like that. The world needs to start making a whole lot more fun of Nick Saban for coming close to taking the week off every year just so he can prepare for Auburn.  That's just ridiculous.

[Chrissooner49er]

20 hours ago, Forge said:

Even the teams that schedule a tough OOC matchup typically only do one. OSU played OU...and then Army and UNLV. Last year they played OU, and then Tulsa and Bowling Green. The year before their big match up was Va tech...then they had Western Michigan, Hawaii and Northern Illinois. I'm not going to ask any team to play more than one big primetime matchup a year. There's basically against their own self interest.

OU just got unlucky last year that Houston turned out to be good - but when they scheduled that game, Houston wasn't very good. That wasn't supposed to be a primetime matchup, so I'm not going to give them credit for "tough scheduling". It just happened to play out that way. When they scheduled that game, Houston was coming off an 8-5 season. Not awful, but it was 4th in the conference and it's really no different than OSU playing tulsa, who was also coming off an 8-5 season in a lower conference when OSU scheduled them (and then finished 10-3 they year the game was scheduled). 

As you said, talent / success is cyclical, and part of the problem with scheduling is that they allow for teams to schedule so far out. That needs to be stopped. They should cap schedules at like 3 years in advance. That is plenty of time. The second issue is the uneven conference schedule. Most teams in the big 5 play 9 conference games. SEC teams only play 8, which is why you end up with Alabama playing mercer halfway through the year (which lets be honest, is basically an additional bye week for them), while a team like Ohio State ends up crossing division lines to play Iowa. That is a major issue that needs to be corrected. 

I was with you until you equated Tulsa to Houston...uh, nope. Houston has been pretty good, fairly often. Tulsa? Wow, I think you have to go back to Steve Largent's days... 

[Forge]

2 hours ago, Chrissooner49er said:

I was with you until you equated Tulsa to Houston...uh, nope. Houston has been pretty good, fairly often. Tulsa? Wow, I think you have to go back to Steve Largent's days... 

Uh, yes. Houston has the better tradition, sure. That's not the debate. We aren't talking about how they have been all time. We are talking about how good they were when the games were scheduled. OSU scheduled Tulsa in 2012, when they finished 11-3, stomped Houston 41-7, and played in the same conference. The year before, they were 8-5 with 4 of their losses coming against 10 ten teams (including Houston). The year that OU scheduled Houston, they were 8-5 with a 10 point win against Tulsa, the year before, 8-5. And just fyi, Tulsa has had two ten win seasons since 2012, Houston has had 1, with another 10 wins season in 2011. And they play in the same conference, so no, you don't have to go back to Steve Largent. The difference is when Tulsa is bad, they are really, really bad. Houston manages a lot of meager 8-5 type seasons without the 2-9 type seasons. 

Has Houston historically been better than Tulsa? Sure. But that's not the debate. Its about where they were as a program when the game was scheduled. If you're going to give OU credit for scheduling "tough" based on the history of Houston, who has some history of success in a small conference, you better give Alabama a ton of credit for scheduling tough against FSU this year. Otherwise, the Tulsa and Houston were very similar at the time each respective game was scheduled for the big boy. 

[big9erfan]

23 hours ago, Forge said:

Even the teams that schedule a tough OOC matchup typically only do one. OSU played OU...and then Army and UNLV. Last year they played OU, and then Tulsa and Bowling Green. The year before their big match up was Va tech...then they had Western Michigan, Hawaii and Northern Illinois. I'm not going to ask any team to play more than one big primetime matchup a year. There's basically against their own self interest.

OU just got unlucky last year that Houston turned out to be good - but when they scheduled that game, Houston wasn't very good. That wasn't supposed to be a primetime matchup, so I'm not going to give them credit for "tough scheduling". It just happened to play out that way. When they scheduled that game, Houston was coming off an 8-5 season. Not awful, but it was 4th in the conference and it's really no different than OSU playing tulsa, who was also coming off an 8-5 season in a lower conference when OSU scheduled them (and then finished 10-3 they year the game was scheduled). 

As you said, talent / success is cyclical, and part of the problem with scheduling is that they allow for teams to schedule so far out. That needs to be stopped. They should cap schedules at like 3 years in advance. That is plenty of time. The second issue is the uneven conference schedule. Most teams in the big 5 play 9 conference games. SEC teams only play 8, which is why you end up with Alabama playing mercer halfway through the year (which lets be honest, is basically an additional bye week for them), while a team like Ohio State ends up crossing division lines to play Iowa. That is a major issue that needs to be corrected. 

I would love this.  More to the point I'd love for the committee to reward strength of schedule WAY more than they do, Like to the extent they will rank a team with a worse record higher than a team with a better record if that better reecord was achieved against bad opponents.  What I'd really love to see, and I"m sure never will, would be for about 3 weeks of cross conference play between the major conferences.  Imagine a week when 5 SEC schools are playing 5 B1G schools, while maybe 5 Big 12 teams are playing 5 ACC schools and 5 PAC 12 teams are playing a mix of 5 teams from the SEC, ACC, B1G and Big 12. Keep that up for 3 weeks with the mix of connferences playing against each other. Then maybe we wouid have a lot better idea of how to evaluate wins over Michigan, Michgan State, Penn State and Wisconsin but a loss to Oklahoma vs wins over LSU, Mississippi State, Texas A&M, Arkansas and Mercer.

[big9erfan]

50 minutes ago, Forge said:

Uh, yes. Houston has the better tradition, sure. That's not the debate. We aren't talking about how they have been all time. We are talking about how good they were when the games were scheduled. OSU scheduled Tulsa in 2012, when they finished 11-3, stomped Houston 41-7, and played in the same conference. The year before, they were 8-5 with 4 of their losses coming against 10 ten teams (including Houston). The year that OU scheduled Houston, they were 8-5 with a 10 point win against Tulsa, the year before, 8-5. And just fyi, Tulsa has had two ten win seasons since 2012, Houston has had 1, with another 10 wins season in 2011. And they play in the same conference, so no, you don't have to go back to Steve Largent. The difference is when Tulsa is bad, they are really, really bad. Houston manages a lot of meager 8-5 type seasons without the 2-9 type seasons. 

Has Houston historically been better than Tulsa? Sure. But that's not the debate. Its about where they were as a program when the game was scheduled. If you're going to give OU credit for scheduling "tough" based on the history of Houston, who has some history of success in a small conference, you better give Alabama a ton of credit for scheduling tough against FSU this year. Otherwise, the Tulsa and Houston were very similar at the time each respective game was scheduled for the big boy. 

Just curious do you know any way to find out when a game taking place this year was originaly scheduled? I can't seem to find this info. Not all games are schedule far in advance.  For instance Michigan just added ND back to its schedule. And it's a home and home series, just like the OU/OSU series was.  Clemson played home and home against Auburn in 2016/17. Alabama just never, ever does that. The one, and only, tough game they schedule in any year is always on a neutral field. And again, they have an extra chance to schedule a challenging game since they only play 8 conference games instead of 9. And what do they do with that extra non-fonference week when most teams are playing a tough conference game?  They schedule the likes of Mercer and Chattanoogo.

[Forge]

Just now, big9erfan said:

Just curious do you know any way to find out when a game taking place this year was originaly scheduled? I can't seem to find this info. Not all games are schedule far in advance.  For instance Michigan just added ND back to its schedule. And it's a home and home series, just like the OU/OSU series was.  Clemson played home and home against Auburn in 2016/17. Alabama just never, ever does that. The one, and only, tough game they schedule in any year is always on a neutral field. And again, they have an extra chance to schedule a challenging game since they only play 8 conference games instead of 9. And what do they do with that extra non-fonference week when most teams are playing a tough conference game?  They schedule the likes of Mercer and Chattanoogo.

Honestly, I just google something along the lines of, "Ohio State and Oklahoma schedule home and home" and then look at the date of the news article. There's not an actual site or anything that contains the information so far as I know. For example, I googled "auburn and clemson schedule home and home", got an article dated 2014 from acc saying that they announced the scheduling. So I know that it was scheduled in 2014. Some are scheduled within a reasonable time frame (such as that one), and some are scheduled way out.  Oregon and OSU, for example, scheduled their home and home, slated for 20 and 21, in 2012. That's ridiculous

Generally speaking, I'm not a fan of neutral field games just because they are hardly ever "neutral". I'd prefer home and home set ups. But depending on the actual location of the said game, it could be less impressive than a true road game and more impressive than a true home game. So I suppose that there is that. The late season "bye week" that the SEC teams get by only having to schedule 8 conference games and then schedules a lower level school is criminal, however. It really is essentially a bye week for them. 

[big9erfan]

Honestly I read a fruna article a while back, but can't remember where about what the article called "Chicken**** Saturday". Loved that term.

[big9erfan]

I watched the CA state championship open division game yesterday between Mater Dei and De La Salle.  I honestly and truely believe Mater Dei could beat a whole bunch of college teams.  Their offense is unreal.  They've got the highest rated pro style QB in the 2019 class (and he can run too), they've got one WR that is probably the best in the country, a second WR committed to UCLA, a third WR commited to Cal and a 4th that is only a 10th grader but almost certainly in that talent level.  THey've got one RB that is among the highest rated "Athletes" in the 20198 class and another with a bunch of big time offers.  Even their junior TE already has an offer from Oregon. As for their o-line - one guy is committed to Alabama, one to Navy, one to Boise State, and one still considering from a host of bigtime programs. The fifth o-line guy is a 10th grader and he already has offers from major programs. That makes the entire offense, plus some reserves, that hae offers not just from D1 schools but from major programs.  Never seen anything like that before! They've got three d-line guys with offers from big-time programs, one of the best LBs in the country, a second LB with muliple big time offers, and at least a couple of d-backs that will play D1 ball. Any college team that could just recruit all of those guys would turn into a pretty good college team.  Even now I think this group could give a whole bunch of the not-so-good college teams a run for their money.

Edited December 17, 2017 by big9erfan

[Forge]

For those who follow Hockey, this note amuses me. 

Quote

Jaromir Jagr was drafted with Keith Tkachuk in 1990 and now plays with his son, Matt Tkachuk, who was born in 1997