soflbillsfan Posted April 18, 2019 Author Share Posted April 18, 2019 2 minutes ago, Yibbyl said: I, too, doubt Oliver falls to us at 9, but if by some miracle he does, we have to pounce on him. As you said, the need is great and the player is just too good. He should be a no-brainer if we get lucky enough to see him. As for Hockenson, I have no problem taking a TE - at least a COMPLETE one like him - in the top 10. If he was a 1-trick pony, I'd agree with you and in fact would be arguing that a player like that should be held off from drafting until at least the 2nd round. TJ does it all though and given who we currently have signed, would result in the biggest upgrade at any position on our team. His ability to block benefits the ground game. His ability to catch benefits our receiving core. This improves 2 aspects of our offense with just one player! That just makes a ton of sense to me. I know you had White as your 2nd option at #9 and I also had him, but as my 4th option. Truth is, I would not complain one bit (I'd still say that I would have taken TJ though) if the FO took White over TJ. That guy is a stud and would set us up with a very high quality LB corps for years. Still, IMHO White is also a longshot to be there at 9. If these 3 were gone, I'd go back to focusing on the OL. I understand your interest in a DE to improve the pass rush, but I just don't see McDermott scheming to free the ends up to rush the QB. I really wish he did as it takes pressure off of our secondary, but I've never seen evidence that he is willing to do that other than on the barest of minimum snaps. Because of that, upgrading the OL with quality, young talent makes more sense to me with that pick than a DE and give Josh a better chance at improving his game. The offense needed to have the focus on them and they did so in free agency. They answered it by adding 6 olineman, a TE and 3 WRs. You can only have so many Olineman on a team as well as starting, so to add more then what we currently have makes zero sense to me as it means that they will let go of someone who they just paid money to. I wont complain that Tj is taken at 9 if guys like sweat oliver and white are off the board. I just know short and long term the bills desperately need help on that dline. I just dont see why the bills would have to take TJ at 9 rather then move back even if it is to collect a 3rd rd pick its still worth the risk and land TJ in the lower to mid teens where he will likely go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yibbyl Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 6 minutes ago, soflbillsfan said: The offense needed to have the focus on them and they did so in free agency. They answered it by adding 6 olineman, a TE and 3 WRs. You can only have so many Olineman on a team as well as starting, so to add more then what we currently have makes zero sense to me as it means that they will let go of someone who they just paid money to. I wont complain that Tj is taken at 9 if guys like sweat oliver and white are off the board. I just know short and long term the bills desperately need help on that dline. I just dont see why the bills would have to take TJ at 9 rather then move back even if it is to collect a 3rd rd pick its still worth the risk and land TJ in the lower to mid teens where he will likely go The mantra out of the FO seems to be "BPA, no matter what!". Players get signed in the off-season and released before the regular season every year. It wouldn't be some sort of shocking scenario if we dumped any of these newly signed O-Linemen. Curious (if you have the time)...Let's say the Bills move back, picking up a 3rd (yay!), but TJ is gone at that new 1st round pick. Best guess as far as I can tell would be a trade back with either GB, WAS, or NYG (they'd have to give more than their 3rd) - 12/15/17 or maybe ATL at 14. I don't know if any of those seem likely to you, but either meet in the middle-ish at 14/15 or just pick whoever you think is most likely to move up to 9. Then, can you tell me who you think will still be available that you'd take with that pick? Does that new player meet BPA or is it addressing a need? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trentwannabe Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 2 hours ago, soflbillsfan said: They answered it by adding 6 olineman, a TE and 3 WRs. You can only have so many Olineman on a team as well as starting, so to add more then what we currently have makes zero sense to me as it means that they will let go of someone who they just paid money to. Only if the question was how can we continue to be average. If they add Jonah he can compete at LT, RT or Guard. Making potentially one of Waddle or Ty expendable or Long/Feliciano. None of those guys deserve to be on the team simply because they were a free agent pickup. If they add Dillard then he'll compete at LT and likely move Dawkins to RT or G. Again adding competition. Would you really be that upset if we cut Spain or Long or whomever because a draft pick beat them out? We'll likely bring 12-14 OL to camp. Dawkins, Spain, Teller, Morse, Boetteger, Feliciano, Long, Ty, Waddle, McDermott and Sirles makes 11. Ducasse and Bodine are likely cut after the draft once they've selected replacements. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsGuy82 Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 3 hours ago, Trentwannabe said: Only if the question was how can we continue to be average. If they add Jonah he can compete at LT, RT or Guard. Making potentially one of Waddle or Ty expendable or Long/Feliciano. None of those guys deserve to be on the team simply because they were a free agent pickup. If they add Dillard then he'll compete at LT and likely move Dawkins to RT or G. Again adding competition. Would you really be that upset if we cut Spain or Long or whomever because a draft pick beat them out? We'll likely bring 12-14 OL to camp. Dawkins, Spain, Teller, Morse, Boetteger, Feliciano, Long, Ty, Waddle, McDermott and Sirles makes 11. Ducasse and Bodine are likely cut after the draft once they've selected replacements. Dawkins could be a top Guard I think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trentwannabe Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 16 hours ago, BillsGuy82 said: Dawkins could be a top Guard I think Me too. Jonah and Dawkins at LT and LG could solve the left side for a decade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DER10N92 Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 My wish list for first two rounds, in order: 1st Round DT Ed Oliver - Houston OT Andre Dillard - Washington St OT Jonah Williams - Alabama 2nd Round WR N'Keal Harry - Arizona St. WR Hakeem Butler - Iowa St C Garrett Bradbury - NC State So obviously if we go o-line in the first we wouldnt do that again in the second. Bradbury is a potential first rounder, but we never really see the Center position going in the first. So this is more like a shot in the dark hoping he would fall to us in the second. Either way, I feel one side of the line will be addressed in the first round and in the second, we will target the opposite side of the line of a skill position at WR. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kmart128 Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 1 hour ago, DER10N92 said: My wish list for first two rounds, in order: 1st Round DT Ed Oliver - Houston OT Andre Dillard - Washington St OT Jonah Williams - Alabama 2nd Round WR N'Keal Harry - Arizona St. WR Hakeem Butler - Iowa St C Garrett Bradbury - NC State So obviously if we go o-line in the first we wouldnt do that again in the second. Bradbury is a potential first rounder, but we never really see the Center position going in the first. So this is more like a shot in the dark hoping he would fall to us in the second. Either way, I feel one side of the line will be addressed in the first round and in the second, we will target the opposite side of the line of a skill position at WR. I don't see why people still want olinemen. We've added 6 new pieces to the line. If we draft a linemen we will be forced to cut someone we just signed. We will only keep 7. Most likely 8 offensive linemen. Locks- 1. Dion Dawkins 2. Mitch Morse 3. Quinton Spain Recently signed (can't see us cutting any of these guys)- 4. Spencer Long 5. Jon Felciano 6. Ty Neskhe 7. LaAdrien Waddle Practice Squad Eligible but highly doubt it- 8. Wyatt Tellar Then we have two guys like Bodine and Sirles who is derserving of a roster spot at the very least but seem like the odd men out. I just can't see room for a rookie linemen. We would have to cut Bodine, Sirles, and either Waddle or Felciano to make it happen. And both those guys are tremendous depth player. But I don't see it. Or we would have to risk losing Wyatt Tellar but he would be snatched up immediatly by someone. I'm pretty certain our OLine is gonna look like this. LT: Dawkins / Nsekhe LG: Spain / Felciano C: Morse / Long RG: Long / Tellar RT: Nsekhe / Waddle That's 8 olinemen which is typical Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DER10N92 Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 32 minutes ago, marshawn lynch said: I don't see why people still want olinemen. We've added 6 new pieces to the line. If we draft a linemen we will be forced to cut someone we just signed. We will only keep 7. Most likely 8 offensive linemen. Locks- 1. Dion Dawkins 2. Mitch Morse 3. Quinton Spain Recently signed (can't see us cutting any of these guys)- 4. Spencer Long 5. Jon Felciano 6. Ty Neskhe 7. LaAdrien Waddle Practice Squad Eligible but highly doubt it- 8. Wyatt Tellar Then we have two guys like Bodine and Sirles who is derserving of a roster spot at the very least but seem like the odd men out. I just can't see room for a rookie linemen. We would have to cut Bodine, Sirles, and either Waddle or Felciano to make it happen. And both those guys are tremendous depth player. But I don't see it. Or we would have to risk losing Wyatt Tellar but he would be snatched up immediatly by someone. I'm pretty certain our OLine is gonna look like this. LT: Dawkins / Nsekhe LG: Spain / Felciano C: Morse / Long RG: Long / Tellar RT: Nsekhe / Waddle That's 8 olinemen which is typical Outside of Morse, every other lineman signed was signed to 1-2 year contracts. Maybe they are stop gaps so that we can draft someone for the future. Signing a bunch of guys to compete is great and all but a lot of the people we signed are not proven so we need that competition in here and worst case scenario, we end up with great depth for protecting our franchise QB 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trentwannabe Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 1 hour ago, DER10N92 said: Outside of Morse, every other lineman signed was signed to 1-2 year contracts. Maybe they are stop gaps so that we can draft someone for the future. Signing a bunch of guys to compete is great and all but a lot of the people we signed are not proven so we need that competition in here and worst case scenario, we end up with great depth for protecting our franchise QB This. Morse is the only free agent pickup I would consider a lock to make roster. Probably Ty as well. But Long, Felciano, Spain and Waddle are all easily cut with next to no repercussions. Wyatt Teller should be sweating. None of these guys have proven a damn thing and none of them should prevent us from taking a potential stalwart across the line. The Bills have continued to do extensive work on draft eligible OL and it should be no surprise when we take one. My hope: LT: Williams or Dillard LG: Dawkins, Spain or Teller C: Morse, Long RG: Feliciano RT: Ty, Waddle Gives us two veterans on the right side, Dawkins at a more natural position where he can dominate, a proven C and a potential all-pro LT. Waddle, Long and either Spain or Teller provide us depth from guys who have started before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsGuy82 Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 I'd prefer to stay away from OL in first 2 rounds but won't be upset if we went OL at same time. Our Guards are still shaky so I get drafting Jonah Williams and kicking him inside for a season or 2 or Andre Dillard and kick Dion Dawkins inside 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trentwannabe Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 2 hours ago, marshawn lynch said: Then we have two guys like Bodine and Sirles who is derserving of a roster spot at the very least but seem like the odd men out. Based on what exactly? And what has Teller done to suggest he is more than a backup? Simply because he was an improvement over Ducasse? He was quite bad in run blocking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trentwannabe Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 8 minutes ago, BillsGuy82 said: Our Guards are still shaky so I get drafting Jonah Williams and kicking him inside for a season or 2 or Andre Dillard and kick Dion Dawkins inside Agree with this. We may have "signed 6 OL!" but the reality is Long, Feliciano, Spain, Teller are competing for 2 starting jobs which doesn't make me feel too good. I would feel much more confident with Dawkins or a guy like Risner in at Guard and the best of the remaining 4 fighting for one starting position and one depth spot. IMO Long has an upper hand at a roster spot because he can back-up the Center and Guards. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillsGuy82 Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 What would thoughts be if we whiff on Ed Oliver grabbing Jeffrey Simmons if he's available at 40 even though he'll miss this season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trentwannabe Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 47 minutes ago, BillsGuy82 said: What would thoughts be if we whiff on Ed Oliver grabbing Jeffrey Simmons if he's available at 40 even though he'll miss this season? Assuming his background checks out I would be fine with it. I honestly don't think he'll be there though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yibbyl Posted April 21, 2019 Share Posted April 21, 2019 3 hours ago, BillsGuy82 said: What would thoughts be if we whiff on Ed Oliver grabbing Jeffrey Simmons if he's available at 40 even though he'll miss this season? 2 hours ago, Trentwannabe said: Assuming his background checks out I would be fine with it. I honestly don't think he'll be there though. Doesn't sound like his background is going to be an issue as most sources are claiming he is a stand-up guy. Looks like the assault was a result of breaking up a fight between a female family member and another lady. He was young and hit the lady, but there's nothing else I'm seeing that says there's a pattern of violence against women. The issue is he's a D-Lineman with what sounds like a bad ligament injury. He needs the agility to put together most pass rush moves. I'm all for using late round picks to pick up players who were recently injured if the history shows this is uncommon. A high 2nd though? I'm a little leary of doing that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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