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Calvin Johnson is a first ballot hofer; change my mind

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Just now, Malik said:

SEVEN? SEVEN? He definitely was not between 08-10 Larry Fitzgerald and Andre Johnson were above him pretty definitely. Julio Jones and Antonio Brown were above him in his last two for 14-15 as well.

Maybe in stats. I guarantee if you asked NFL CB's who they would least want to guard, Calvin Johnson is at the top of the list.

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2 hours ago, MWil23 said:

Guys I'd CONSIDER as my 3rd guy:

*T.O.

*Cris Carter

*Larry Fitzgerald

*Megatron

From there, I think that you have a secondary tier of guys like:

Marvin Harrison, Steve Largent, Steve Smith, Isaac Bruce, Tim Brown, Reggie Wayne, Andre Johnson, and Torry Holt (he's become criminally underrated)

In my eyes.

1. Jerry Rice

2. TO
3. Randy Moss

4. Marvin Harrison
5. Larry Fitzgerald
6. Calvin Johnson

-Everyone else.

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36 minutes ago, Danger said:

In my eyes.

1. Jerry Rice

2. TO
3. Randy Moss

4. Marvin Harrison
5. Larry Fitzgerald
6. Calvin Johnson

-Everyone else.

I personally never thought Marvin Harrison was Top 5, but I can understand why some others do I suppose. He's certainly not better than Cris Carter or Larry Fitz IMO.

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5 hours ago, patriotsheatyan said:

It doesn’t have anything to do with drama. It’s because the media loved Johnson and pitied Detroit so they spent the first five years of his career waiting for him to break out so they could declare him the best. The same reason why Johnson could get All Pro selection while being 9th in the league in receiving or make the Pro Bowl while being 9th in his conference in receiving or why it’s been largely forgotten that Johnson wasn’t elite until a three year stretch between 11-13. 

So now anyone with a memory is stuck listening to people who think Johnson walked into the league and established himself as the best receiver at the start of his career and must have dominated like no one else has. 

We also must all forget that Stafford did better without him and he never led an elite passing game or offense.

He had over 1300 yards and lead the league with 12tds in his second season ...... I could be wrong but I don’t think a persons 2nd year is waiting 5 years ..... that was also the 0fer season with the likes of Jon Kitna, Daunte culpepper and drew stanton and Dan orlovsky throwing the ball. 

Youre also completely forgetting about the impact he had on the defense and attention he garnered. 

You shouldn’t claim to have a memory if you’re forgetting pretty easy facts. 

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15 hours ago, Mr Bad Example said:

Here's another comparison: 
 

- is Antonio Brown a first-ballot HoF if he retired today? Because his and Johnson's career numbers are remarkably similar. 

If he didn't open his mouth, maybe.

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12 hours ago, C0LTSFAN4L1F3 said:

Oh really, if you have a chance to draft a guy, would you rather have one that can be productive for you for 9 years or for 15 years? I don't see how this shouldn't matter. Especially at a position like receiver when the focus is so highly on the accumulated statistics. 

I mean, cool. I'm more so referring to players like Larry Fitzgerald or Jerry Rice that played an enormous role in their team making a Super Bowl appearance/win. Playing good in 2 playoff games doesn't really amount to much in the way of HoF merit as far as I'm concerned. 

No. Not first ballot. Not when Tim Brown, Andre Reed, Art Monk, Terrel Owens, and Cris Carter among others were not first ballot. 

How has that worked out for Sterling Sharpe? There's players with better careers who have had to wait. 

It depends. I’d take Gronk for 9 years over any other TE even with injuries because he’s much more complete and a bigger difference maker

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I came into this on the fence but the crowd arguing against it has down a great job of swaying me...to side with him going in 1st ballot.

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6 hours ago, patriotsheatyan said:

It doesn’t have anything to do with drama. It’s because the media loved Johnson and pitied Detroit so they spent the first five years of his career waiting for him to break out so they could declare him the best. The same reason why Johnson could get All Pro selection while being 9th in the league in receiving or make the Pro Bowl while being 9th in his conference in receiving or why it’s been largely forgotten that Johnson wasn’t elite until a three year stretch between 11-13. 

So now anyone with a memory is stuck listening to people who think Johnson walked into the league and established himself as the best receiver at the start of his career and must have dominated like no one else has. 

We also must all forget that Stafford did better without him and he never led an elite passing game or offense.

Also, there was never a time that he was selected for all pro and was 9th in receiving, ever. 

The only season that he would have made pro bowl and been 9th in the conference was 2014, where he completely missed 3 games and was still hurt for about 5 others. 

Just sayin 

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2 hours ago, Malik said:

Julio Jones and Antonio Brown were above him in his last two for 14-15 as well.

Calvin was widely considered the best until he retired. Brown and Julio weren’t debated as #1-#2 until then. 

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He should be. Dude was straight up dominant.

The Lions at the time didn't have a running game, didn't have an oline, didn't have anything else at reciever and didn't have a defence. All they had is best summed up by this
DeBr3ZO.png

The only CB that I recall actually taking Megatron out of a game was Optimus Grimes.

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5 hours ago, MWil23 said:

Guys I'd CONSIDER as my 3rd guy:

*T.O.

*Cris Carter

*Larry Fitzgerald

*Megatron

From there, I think that you have a secondary tier of guys like:

Marvin Harrison, Steve Largent, Steve Smith, Isaac Bruce, Tim Brown, Reggie Wayne, Andre Johnson, and Torry Holt (he's become criminally underrated)

1

That's a good list.  I think I'd put Megatron and Fitz on a tier just very slightly above T.O. and CC because they were both better than Carter and they didn't bring along the headaches that T.O. did.

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Image the diva crap that Calvin Johnson could of pulled.

Arguably his biggest diva move was retiring early, but that was for health reasons.

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4 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

That's a good list.  I think I'd put Megatron and Fitz on a tier just very slightly above T.O. and CC because they were both better than Carter and they didn't bring along the headaches that T.O. did.

I don't get how Julio Jones isn't on that list.

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I won’t ever try to change anyone’s mind that he’s a 1st ballot HoF, but count me in the extreme minority that say he is not (for some of the reasons listed already). Longevity (not only being capable of playing many seasons at a high level, but also actually doing it) is not overrated but underrated. He would be 1st ballot in everyone’s eyes, surely, had he played several more years, perhaps even just a couple.

 

Some of us have slightly different priorities in what goes into a 1st ballot HoF, and I don’t think we or anyone else is wrong in their priorities. 

 

All that hat being said, knowing some 1st ballot HoF’ers have already missed such longevity, I really don’t have an issue at all here.

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He has a slight chance to get in on the first ballot because people like him and he's well respected.  Obviously has great stats, but has really poor team success.  I'm not blaming him, but it's something that people consider.

The thing about Calvin Johnson is, he dominated when he played - but his stats aren't all that amazing.  What I mean is, he has the 30th most receiving yards ever and he doesn't have 90 TD's.  That isn't very impressive when you look at everything as a whole.  Yea, he didn't play as many years as he could have, but that's his problem.

If guys like Tim Brown and Cris Carter didn't get in on the first ballot, then Johnson might not either.

 

The guy who's currently playing who is HANDS DOWN 100% a first ballot HoF'er is Larry Fitzgerald.

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