Prospects at Positions of Need

[AZBearsFan]

39 minutes ago, RunningVaccs said:

We have to face the fact that based on league wide odds, we might roll into the season with no one from this draft on the active roster, we're just picking so deep. 

 

Pace has done well in middle rounds, especially with non-premium spots like RB, but that's still pretty far from a guarantee. 

 

If we get 1 starter from this draft we're doing well.

 

I don’t expect any 2019 starters from this draft outside of kicker if we take one. I expect any RB we draft to be a rotational player st least for 2019. If we get a starter from this draft then that’s a bonus. 

[soulman]

3 hours ago, RunningVaccs said:

We have to face the fact that based on league wide odds, we might roll into the season with no one from this draft on the active roster, we're just picking so deep. 

 

Pace has done well in middle rounds, especially with non-premium spots like RB, but that's still pretty far from a guarantee. 

 

If we get 1 starter from this draft we're doing well.

 

The only "starters" I'm expecting would be a RB and TE who take part in a rotation or an Edge Rusher doing the same.

Other than that we really have no openings.  So by in large none of these picks would be starters in the truest sense unless an injury creates an opening.

[Epyon]

Kickers are people too... at least that's what they claim.

If we end up drafting one late, I'd more or less expect them to have a leg up on the job.... That Gay guy, for example, seems like an obvious choice ~6-7th

[soulman]

Owing to the fact that we have three PKs signed already and will almost certainly get rid of one prior to camp I've crossed PK off my draft list.

There's also the scenario playing out in SF.  Robbie Gould is not pleased to have been tagged and has not agreed to sign his tender.  I'm curious about how John Lynch will handle this since his indication is Robbie isn't high on remaining in SF.  Lynch said he would like to sign him but both parties have to want that which to me is a clear indication Robbie is the one holding up the parade.

What if SF spends a pick on one of the top PKs?  What then?

SF could play hardball and force Robbie to play 2019 under his tag but to what end when next year he'd leave leaving them in search of a dependable PK.

We have no real commitments to any of the three PKs we've signed.  They're all still on an extended try out.  Call me crazy but it looks to me like Pace has left a side door open to bringing Robbie Gould back should SF remove his tag while simultaneously preparing for that to not happen.  Of the two teams SF has far more need for a younger PK who'll be with them once they become competitive again than we do.  We need that guy now.

[Madmike90]

22 minutes ago, soulman said:

Owing to the fact that we have three PKs signed already and will almost certainly get rid of one prior to camp I've crossed PK off my draft list.

There's also the scenario playing out in SF.  Robbie Gould is not pleased to have been tagged and has not agreed to sign his tender.  I'm curious about how John Lynch will handle this since his indication is Robbie isn't high on remaining in SF.  Lynch said he would like to sign him but both parties have to want that which to me is a clear indication Robbie is the one holding up the parade.

What if SF spends a pick on one of the top PKs?  What then?

SF could play hardball and force Robbie to play 2019 under his tag but to what end when next year he'd leave leaving them in search of a dependable PK.

We have no real commitments to any of the three PKs we've signed.  They're all still on an extended try out.  Call me crazy but it looks to me like Pace has left a side door open to bringing Robbie Gould back should SF remove his tag while simultaneously preparing for that to not happen.  Of the two teams SF has far more need for a younger PK who'll be with them once they become competitive again than we do.  We need that guy now.

I wouldn't take it off the list at all...I think Pace is just doing what he does best in the offseason and leaving no glaring holes but if a quality kicker is there and presents value he has to pull the trigger.

[soulman]

39 minutes ago, Madmike90 said:

I wouldn't take it off the list at all...I think Pace is just doing what he does best in the offseason and leaving no glaring holes but if a quality kicker is there and presents value he has to pull the trigger.

Well then it comes down to is the PK better value than another position player?

With a 90 man roster limit we're unlikely to take more than two to camp so one of our current three will already be gone.  To spend a pick on another would mean he's got to be seen as being better than two we have now or at least that's how I would view it.

Listened to a Podcast with Pat Mannelly being interviewed about the Bears situation and NFL PK in general and it was illuminating.  He identified Parkey's issue with that double doink immediately......too low, yanked left due to rushing his approach.

He had a lot to offer as far as what goes into all three elements of a PK team; LS, Holder, and PK and how they practice.  Two things he emphasized were height and pop/leg strength and velocity.  NFL teams work hard on kick blocks and even have guys who practice it and specialize in it and they will burn you if you don't get immediate height on kicks.  It's as important as accuracy.  Velocity also helps avoid blocks and in Chicago helps cut through the wind.

He also indicated that the NFL was short of quality PKs which is why there's so much turn over and his pick for a college PK to draft or sign is this kid.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/austin-seibert?id=32195345-4927-5063-f746-ec3c4535f51d

Edited April 20, 2019 by soulman

[AZBearsFan]

1 hour ago, soulman said:

Owing to the fact that we have three PKs signed already and will almost certainly get rid of one prior to camp I've crossed PK off my draft list.

There's also the scenario playing out in SF.  Robbie Gould is not pleased to have been tagged and has not agreed to sign his tender.  I'm curious about how John Lynch will handle this since his indication is Robbie isn't high on remaining in SF.  Lynch said he would like to sign him but both parties have to want that which to me is a clear indication Robbie is the one holding up the parade.

What if SF spends a pick on one of the top PKs?  What then?

SF could play hardball and force Robbie to play 2019 under his tag but to what end when next year he'd leave leaving them in search of a dependable PK.

We have no real commitments to any of the three PKs we've signed.  They're all still on an extended try out.  Call me crazy but it looks to me like Pace has left a side door open to bringing Robbie Gould back should SF remove his tag while simultaneously preparing for that to not happen.  Of the two teams SF has far more need for a younger PK who'll be with them once they become competitive again than we do.  We need that guy now.

I also have K off my draft list at this point though don’t rule out a UDFA. 

Re: SF they were the trendy on the rise team last offseason and were expecting to be a playoff team last year before Garoppolo and McKinnon got hurt. Those guys are healthy now and they’re about to add the #2 pick in the draft and are playing a 3rd place schedule. I’m guessing they fully expect to push for a playoff spot this year. 

[Madmike90]

1 hour ago, soulman said:

Well then it comes down to is the PK better value than another position player?

With a 90 man roster limit we're unlikely to take more than two to camp so one of our current three will already be gone.  To spend a pick on another would mean he's got to be seen as being better than two we have now or at least that's how I would view it.

Listened to a Podcast with Pat Mannelly being interviewed about the Bears situation and NFL PK in general and it was illuminating.  He identified Parkey's issue with that double doink immediately......too low, yanked left due to rushing his approach.

He had a lot to offer as far as what goes into all three elements of a PK team; LS, Holder, and PK and how they practice.  Two things he emphasized were height and pop/leg strength and velocity.  NFL teams work hard on kick blocks and even have guys who practice it and specialize in it and they will burn you if you don't get immediate height on kicks.  It's as important as accuracy.  Velocity also helps avoid blocks and in Chicago helps cut through the wind.

He also indicated that the NFL was short of quality PKs which is why there's so much turn over and his pick for a college PK to draft or sign is this kid.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/austin-seibert?id=32195345-4927-5063-f746-ec3c4535f51d

I think there is a ton of value in getting a quality place kicker...I don't see any of the guys we currently have as a sure thing and would feel better with a guy like Matt Gay in camp over any if these guys.

[AZBearsFan]

1 hour ago, Madmike90 said:

I think there is a ton of value in getting a quality place kicker...I don't see any of the guys we currently have as a sure thing and would feel better with a guy like Matt Gay in camp over any if these guys.

Based on what? Gay is also likely a UDFA kicker. 

[Madmike90]

52 minutes ago, AZBearsFan said:

Based on what? Gay is also likely a UDFA kicker. 

Based on college production and the fact most of these guys have never kicked in the NFL either.

[WindyCity]

Gabriel was saying his source close to the team says that they have done the most work at TE, RB, And CB.

 

I expect those are the top 3 picks in some order 

[soulman]

5 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

I think there is a ton of value in getting a quality place kicker...I don't see any of the guys we currently have as a sure thing and would feel better with a guy like Matt Gay in camp over any if these guys.

I don't disagree with you on what I bold faced at all Mike.  Nor do I feel any one of the three guys we have is a sure thing but one has gone on post college to show success in the recently demised AAF and another has had a lot of post college coaching/training and won a national kicking competition.

So far Pace has brought in seven guys I believe for kicking auditions and these must have been the three best on the market so via that approach we've increased our chances a bit.  I have no problem with looking at even more I just question whether or not Pace would now spend a pick on one.

Matt Gay was a guy I had on top of my list to until I heard Patrick Mannelly offer his opinion about Austin Siebert.  Mannelly made the point that Siebert also punted in college and punting would negatively impact his place kicking.  Siebert's post college kicking has now greatly improved.

In the end it's only what Pace will feel most comfortable with.  His back's against the wall on this one and he's out of Mulligans.  He can sign and/or draft as many as he likes but it's still most likely only two will go to camp in July and if SF removes Robbie's tag he could be one of them.

[soulman]

29 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

Gabriel was saying his source close to the team says that they have done the most work at TE, RB, And CB.

 

I expect those are the top 3 picks in some order 

Makes sense.  RB and TE are current needs and CB along with SS are likely to be 2020 needs.

Owing to the likelihood that it's far easier to find decent SS later in the draft I would prioritize CB as well.

We can shuffle the deck any way we like but until it begins to happen we aren't gonna know in what order because we don't know Pace's board.  What we do know is he will typically choose his highest ranked guy at a position of need first then maneuver for his other picks trading up or back if he can.

Few NFL GMs have played these middle rounds any better than Pace has and no Bears GM ever has so I have a lot of confidence in who he'll come away with and also that at least one pick or more will probably surprise us.

[soulman]

3 hours ago, Madmike90 said:

Based on college production and the fact most of these guys have never kicked in the NFL either.

Unless we do bring back Robbie my guess is whoever we do end up with will have zero NFL experience either.

Robbie is the only near sure thing I believe Pace would spend top dollar on to bring back to Chicago.

[AZBearsFan]

3 hours ago, soulman said:

Unless we do bring back Robbie my guess is whoever we do end up with will have zero NFL experience either.

Robbie is the only near sure thing I believe Pace would spend top dollar on to bring back to Chicago.

Of the guys already here I have the most comfort with Fry out of the gate just because he’s kicked post-collegiately in games against NFL practice squad level competition and was flawless. That’s real pressure. Granted it was in ideal conditions, but it has value to me. He was also more accurate than either Blewitt or Jones in college. Gay was 86.2% in college though (Fry 75%) in at least sometimes non-ideal conditions. Were we to add him I’d stack he and Fry as the two I’d expect to get to camp.