turtle28 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) 10 hours ago, naptownskinsfan said: An off-season with a competent head coach? Yes. The same Jay gruden that developed Andy Dalton, Kirk Cousins and made Colt McCoy and Josh Johnson average, can also develop Haskins into a good starter or more. Jay isn’t a good HC, but he is good at developing QBs and developing a passing game. He’s been doing that for nearly a decade. Edited October 3, 2019 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeezy Fanatic Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 45 minutes ago, turtle28 said: The same Jay gruden that developed Andy Dalton, Kirk Cousins and made Colt McCoy and Josh Johnson average, can also develop Haskins into a good starter or more. Jay isn’t a good HC, but he is good at developing QBs and developing a passing game. He’s been doing that for nearly a decade. If I'm touting my QB development skills, I'd be very nervous pointing at Kirk Cousins and Andy Dalton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Jeezy Fanatic said: If I'm touting my QB development skills, I'd be very nervous pointing at Kirk Cousins and Andy Dalton Why? Don't like 17,474 with 111 TDs and just 46 ints in 4 seasons and 28,100 with 188 TDs and 104 ints in 8 seasons? They’re both top half of the league QBs when their weapons are healthy and they are protected adequately. Edited October 3, 2019 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeezy Fanatic Posted October 3, 2019 Share Posted October 3, 2019 40 minutes ago, turtle28 said: Why? Don't like 17,474 with 111 TDs and just 46 ints in 4 seasons and 28,100 with 188 TDs and 104 ints in 8 seasons? They’re both top half of the league QBs when their weapons are healthy and they are protected adequately. I fundamentally don't agree with this statement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 (edited) 4 hours ago, Jeezy Fanatic said: I fundamentally don't agree with this statement. I mean it’s at least a discussion. Cousins definitely is top half of the league and has been since 2015, I think he’s top 10 or just outside the top 10. Dalton is in the mid to high teens as a QB. He’s averaged 3500 yds and 24 TDs and 13 ints over his career. That’s right around average teetering towards top 16. Edited October 4, 2019 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeezy Fanatic Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 45 minutes ago, turtle28 said: I mean it’s at least a discussion. Cousins definitely is top half of the league and has been since 2015, I think he’s top 10 or just outside the top 10. Dalton is in the mid to high teens as a QB. He’s averaged 3500 yds and 24 TDs and 13 ints over his career. That’s right around average teetering towards top 16. Brady rodgers mahomes rivers brees Watson wilson big ben jackson mayfield Dak wentz goff ryan newton Are all guys I’d without question take over Kirk Cousins You can put him in a crop with Jimmy G, Jacoby Brissett types Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
e16bball Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 The point is that Cousins and Dalton were both marginal talents at best. It doesn’t take much coaching skill to be handed an Andrew Luck or a Carson Wentz and “mold” him into a star QB. No one wanted Dalton or Cousins, and yet Gruden had both throwing for 4000+ yards (almost 5000 for Cousins). Neither was ever a top tier QB — but they both became more than anyone ever really expected they would/could be, especially Cousins. Which is kinda how I define good coaching: finding ways to get the absolute most out of your players. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 Well the good news is Jay didn’t want Haskins and Haskins knows so that’s probably been fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slappy Mc Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 1 minute ago, lavar703 said: Well the good news is Jay didn’t want Haskins and Haskins knows so that’s probably been fun. https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/10/04/report-jay-gruden-didnt-want-haskins-and-haskins-can-sense-that/ There are a lot of things I dont like in my job, but you cant do that to a young kid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 1 minute ago, Slappy Mc said: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/10/04/report-jay-gruden-didnt-want-haskins-and-haskins-can-sense-that/ There are a lot of things I dont like in my job, but you cant do that to a young kid. I don’t understand dragging this out anymore? I don’t hate Jay but he seems to be infatuated with Colt. He’s wanted to start Colt consistently throughout his tenure and I don’t understand it but whatever. Just fire him and move on. It’s best for both parties to just end this relationship now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 15 hours ago, Jeezy Fanatic said: Brady rodgers mahomes rivers brees Watson wilson big ben jackson mayfield Dak wentz goff ryan newton Are all guys I’d without question take over Kirk Cousins You can put him in a crop with Jimmy G, Jacoby Brissett types Yeah, based off of what? 4 games? Cam Newton Just had serious shoulder surgery and looked awful this year. He may have to end up retiring bc of it IMO. You can’t trust Jimmy G & Brissett, too small of a sample size. Cousins has been consistently a top half of the league QB since 2015, and Dalton hasn't been too far off from that, especially when AJ Green plays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 4, 2019 Share Posted October 4, 2019 2 hours ago, lavar703 said: I don’t understand dragging this out anymore? I don’t hate Jay but he seems to be infatuated with Colt. He’s wanted to start Colt consistently throughout his tenure and I don’t understand it but whatever. Just fire him and move on. It’s best for both parties to just end this relationship now. Exactly! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 18 hours ago, e16bball said: The point is that Cousins and Dalton were both marginal talents at best. It doesn’t take much coaching skill to be handed an Andrew Luck or a Carson Wentz and “mold” him into a star QB. No one wanted Dalton or Cousins, and yet Gruden had both throwing for 4000+ yards (almost 5000 for Cousins). Neither was ever a top tier QB — but they both became more than anyone ever really expected they would/could be, especially Cousins. Which is kinda how I define good coaching: finding ways to get the absolute most out of your players. I want to know how much McVay played apart in Cousins development. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skins212689 Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 10 hours ago, Slappy Mc said: https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2019/10/04/report-jay-gruden-didnt-want-haskins-and-haskins-can-sense-that/ There are a lot of things I dont like in my job, but you cant do that to a young kid. Yet some are so pressed to put this kid in that type of situation and expect him to succeed or learn from this experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted October 5, 2019 Share Posted October 5, 2019 6 hours ago, Skins212689 said: I want to know how much McVay played apart in Cousins development. He obviously played a part, as did the Shanahan's, and Matt LeFleur (current Packers HC) who was Cousins' first QBs coach in 2012 & 13. Let's be clear though, Jay made McVay his OC day 1, Jay recognized McVay's talent and promoted him. Just follow the facts and stop trying to figure out a hypothetical no one can answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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