2019 NFL Draft Live GDT - NO SPOILERS DON'T POST PICKS UNTIL TELEVISED

[Scoundrel]

3 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Cashman would have fit really well with the Fangio scheme.  FWIW, I think he'll be better than Mack Wilson, who went 2 picks earlier.   My tracker said we took Wilson lol.

At this stage, it's all flyers (unless you are taking a P/K lol).   Would have preferred we keep both 5ths and then could have had Cashman and Hollins, for example.  Or Hall and Hollins, if they thought Hollins can move inside.   Just can't endorse 1 year of Watson vs. 4 year min-wage fliers on these guys.  You hit on these, and suddenly the rebuild is that much faster.   Trevathan redux.

Yeah the trade makes zero sense 

[BroncoBruin]

12 minutes ago, BroncoBruin said:

Interesting that Elway says Hollins can play inside and outside. Mad genius Fangio cooking up something? 

Sounds like Fangio wants to play him inside. I trust his evaluations with LBs, so that's pretty interesting. Remember Leavitt who coached under Fangio in SF coaches Oregon's defense. 

Edited April 27, 2019 by BroncoBruin

[Royal_VT]

14 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Cashman would have fit really well with the Fangio scheme.  FWIW, I think he'll be better than Mack Wilson, who went 2 picks earlier.   My tracker said we took Wilson lol.

At this stage, it's all flyers (unless you are taking a P/K lol), so the Hollins pick won't get me too upset, although I'll stand on Cashman when we get our GM game going.   Would have preferred we keep both 5ths, though.  We then could have had Cashman and Hollins, for example.  Or Hall and Hollins, if they thought Hollins can move inside.   

And that's recognizing they're all fliers.  I just can't endorse 1 year of Watson vs. 4 year min-wage fliers on these guys.  You hit on these, and suddenly the rebuild is that much faster, Trevathan/Paradis-style.   You can't hit for that kind of impact with a 1-year guy. Oh well.

I was hoping we landed Wilson, got upset that the Browns took him right before us. Not even sure he was on our radar though. 

Also it's important that we did get a 6th back in the trade so its 1 year of Watson + 4 year min-wage flier on a guy vs. 4 year min-wage flier on a possibly slightly better guy.

I don't like the trade either, but lets not act like the sky is falling because we moved back 60 spots. 

[Broncofan]

5 minutes ago, Royal_VT said:

I was hoping we landed Wilson, got upset that the Browns took him right before us. Not even sure he was on our radar though. 

Also it's important that we did get a 6th back in the trade so its 1 year of Watson + 4 year min-wage flier on a guy vs. 4 year min-wage flier on a possibly slightly better guy.

I don't like the trade either, but lets not act like the sky is falling because we moved back 60 spots. 

No one is saying the sky is falling.  It's just that there's zero gain with Watson beyond 2019.    That's fine if we think the different Watson makes is worth it.  For who Watson is, it's not, given where we are in our rebuilding.    

A Day 3 F pick doesn't kill the draft.  A Rd1 F pick sure does.  Like I said before, they're all fliers.  I think we all get that.  But the thinking here is baffling, given the potential for 2020 gain is literally 0, when Elway's picks all were rightfully aimed at a 2020 impact with everyone but Risner (who just fell to us at the sweet spot of value.)   

Re: Wilson, we did NOT bring him for a visit.  So I agree he probably wasn't on our radar.  I much prefer Cashman - Wilson's got athleticism - but he's out of control and did not improve throughout his entire time at 'Bama.  For Saban and that D coaching staff, that's a huge flag IMO.  Undeniably has talent, but if he's not coachable at 'Bama...man, huge warning sign.

Edited April 27, 2019 by Broncofan

[BroncoSojia]

1 hour ago, Counselor said:

Jones isn’t very athletic and is small for a 5T. Fant drops a lot of passes. Lock I don’t  think pans out. Now this trade. Risner is the only one IMO that lives up to expectations. 

This is just not true, judging by his tape. I know his combine numbers aren't that good, but he showed hella athleticism on film. 

[germ-x]

9 minutes ago, BroncoBruin said:

Sounds like Fangio wants to play him inside. I trust his evaluations with LBs, so that's pretty interesting. Remember Leavitt who coached under Fangio in SF coaches Oregon's defense. 

Interesting.  Reading his report I guess he’s pretty advanced in coverage and it’s believed he’s capable of matching up with TEs.

[Broncofan]

BTW, Hollins is yet another top-30 visit guy.  I sense a trend lol.  Everyone but Chubb last year IIRC, who they thought CLE was going to pick (or even NYG, as we know now, NYG is smoke-screen central for Rd1 picks lol).   

Edited April 27, 2019 by Broncofan

[Scoundrel]

If they are playing Hollins at ILB this draft moves to a B for me

[BroncoBruin]

This draft is an A- to me only because the Watson trade just didn't make sense to me. I've liked every single pick. Even last year, I wasn't crazy about the Freeman pick and it kind of fizzled out after the 4th round. 

[Broncofan]

20 minutes ago, BroncoBruin said:

This draft is an A- to me only because the Watson trade just didn't make sense to me. I've liked every single pick. Even last year, I wasn't crazy about the Freeman pick and it kind of fizzled out after the 4th round. 

Yeah, right up until Jewell, they were on a roll - I understood the pick with Freeman, but the Pac-12 D, Oregon O scheme and the mileage were legit issues with Freeman.  Still, it's not like he failed as much as Lindsay succeeded.  There were signs of the rookie wall with Freeman when they tried to use him late.  It's just with Lindsay now the alpha, it devalues the Rd3 investment, why I usually wait even longer for RB, unless it's a 3-down skill set, and Freeman clearly is more of a 2-down banger. 

From Fumigali on down, though, not much progress.  You don't expect any real impact, but there was little to no progress to even be active on gameday.  That's pretty concerning.   I don't hold it against Elway making bad choices - those are just the risks associated with Day 3.  I was NOT a fan though of accumulating more Day 3 picks and trading back from Rd 5 2x into Rd 6-7 to get 4 Rd 6-7 picks instead of 2 Rd5 picks.  They may be fliers, but at devalued positions, you still run into guys with say 30 percent hit rates, vs. 10 percent hit rates at Rd7.  Not worth it, IMO.  I would have much preferred we stay in Rd5 and get those 2 guys than the 4 we got (and in case it sounds like hindsight, I did do that int the GM game lol).

 Still, it was nice though that Elway hit not just on Lindsay (duh) but it looks like Jeff Holland is making the rotation.  For a UDFA to get that result is just awesome.  I hope we see similar success, can't expect Lindsay's, but 1-2 Holland type results, and that's a free ticket cashed in with each guy.  

I can't change my initial preference for Haskins, but given we didn't go there, taking Lock out of the equation, the rest of the draft is a solid B draft for me...for now.   Lock's grade is literally as far as a C to A+ - it won't get a D/F ever, beause the pick capital is so much less.  In that respect, waiting until 2.42 and 3rd pick insulates the draft from a disaster outcome, at least based on the pre-draft info we have.  It doesn't mean  we know the outcome will be successfull, but use the right processes, you'll get the best draft results.  The more encouraging thing for me is that with worse draft position, we've avoided the 2013-17 pitfalls in Rd1-2 that we saw year in and year out - 1 year, could be a fluke.  2 years, it's a trend.  Now just to get back some of that Day 3 magic, and we're set.  Of course, you actually need to keep the picks to get magic...

Ultimately, the big plus for me is that Elway's stopped reaching early for pure need in Day 1 and changed his disastrous Day 2 approach for a 2nd straight year.  That means it's sticking.    That was his 2011-12 formula for success.  After going win-now from 2013-17 Rd1 and always tools-over-skills Day 2, he's back to BPA & now using skills-based analysis Day 2, hurrah!   He didn't force a Lock pick at 1.10 or a Lock trade-back into 1.32.  He even resisted to take Risner, IMO our best pick of the draft bar none value wise from his picks.  The old Elway from 2013-17 would not have resisted.  I wasn't sure if he learned the lesson for good after 2018, but it seems to have stuck.  That's the most important thing for our return to sustained contention.  

 

Edited April 27, 2019 by Broncofan

[broncos_fan _from _uk]

Another trade...

[Broncofan]

And that's a wrap, the trade uses up our last 2 picks.   Juwann Winfree.  As I'm not a COL guy, the locals here might know more. 

Time for UDFA.

Edited April 27, 2019 by Broncofan

[broncos_fan _from _uk]

1 minute ago, Broncofan said:

And that's a wrap, the trade uses up our last 2 picks.   Juwann Winfree.  As I'm not a COL guy, the locals here might know more. 

Time for UDFA.

He’s...ok. Thought he’d be a priority UDFA. The 4th best WR prospect from Colorado colleges left on the board.

[broncos_fan _from _uk]

It was almost like Elway was like “I have a tee time, im done here. Package the rest of our picks and grab a kid we were going to sign as a UDFA and let’s get out of here”

[BroncoBruin]

Bizarre. Guess he had a really good workout at the local pro day. Size/speed project.