Scoundrel Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 1 minute ago, AKRNA said: Damn, you grade on a tough curve. Jones isn’t very athletic and is small for a 5T. Fant drops a lot of passes. Lock I don’t think pans out. Now this trade. Risner is the only one IMO that lives up to expectations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cutler06 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 A LOT of diverse opinions here about the job Elway has done, that 49er trade really swayed the tide and nobody knows what Fangio will do with this guy (Watson). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1234567 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 12 minutes ago, Counselor said: Jones isn’t very athletic and is small for a 5T. Fant drops a lot of passes. Lock I don’t think pans out. Now this trade. Risner is the only one IMO that lives up to expectations. Haven't watched a ton of film on Fant; particularly his drops. Are they concentration drops (looking up-field too soon) or are they a hand-eye coordination problem? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted April 27, 2019 Author Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Cutler06 said: A LOT of diverse opinions here about the job Elway has done, that 49er trade really swayed the tide and nobody knows what Fangio will do with this guy (Watson). I think once Elway went to 1.20, Fant was the last impact ceiling O guy left. And I don't mind if it takes a year, or even just under 2, to be a major impact player. We're not legit contenders until 2020 at earliest, and most likely 2021. Risner was an A+ pick. Jones was solid for the value present, but by Rd3 it's not like the hit rates offer a sure thing. I think Fant's a B/B+ type pick because TE's have risk, Risner's an A++ pick, and Jones is about B/B+ again (I'm a tough grader). That trade is a F though. Big F. The trade is that brutal because it's a total win-now move, with a 31 year old guy under contract for ONLY 2019. It's literally the exact opposite of taking guys like Fant and Jones - Jones needs a full offseason to put on bulk in his lower half to be a full-time 3-tech, and Fant's most likely 90th percentile outcome is a non-impact season year 1 (year 2 is where the great ones start to surge up, Vernon Davis is literally the only exception as it was brought up many times on Thu lol). It's not a complete disaster because it's a Day 3 pick - so the lost value isn't as high. It's just that it literally uses the opposite philosophy to taking Fant, Lock & Jones. Risner is just such a value pick he helps right away. The others don't. To use ANY pick on a 31 year old with 1 year control, unless it's an impact starter on a contender, it's lunacy. And we're not that team, and nothing in Watson's past says he's that guy now. I mean, he couldn't start regularly for San Francisco last year. Even if Watson somehow improves his play - no control for 2020, and no way we pay even midrange ILB FA $ to a 32 year old. So there's literally no upside. It's not the end-all by itself, it's just baffling because our draft clearly will have the greatest impact in 2020+. To spend for 2019 and no future is just nuts, even if it's a Day 3 pick - at least if you only hit with the Day 3 guy for his last 2 years, you get 4 cheap years in total - and those 2 cheap years will be when we really could contend. This does nothing to move the needle, and it's only for 2019. I get why ppl are pissed. I'm frankly still just baffled - I'm waiting to hear that it's actually only a <10 spot move back, that at least would make some sense (not much, but some). Edited April 27, 2019 by Broncofan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germ-x Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 I don’t think it was a great trade, but Denver has nothing in terms of OLB depth. Watson while in Denver was part of that rotation, he has experience at both ILB and OLB, and he’s a very good special teamed who the organization is familiar with. They gave up too much, but I get the move. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoundrel Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Could have stayed put and taken Mack Wilson Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germ-x Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Well now the trade confuses me. IMO part of the play by adding Watson was for OLB depth and then they select Hollins to do the same. Really like the Hollins pick, though. He’s a freaky athlete with a lot of upside. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncoBruin Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 I like the player. But would have preferred Cashman or Emmanuel Hall. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoundrel Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, germ-x said: Well now the trade confuses me. IMO part of the play by adding Watson was for OLB depth and then they select Hollins to do the same. Really like the Hollins pick, though. He’s a freaky athlete with a lot of upside. His upside is limited. He’s a red shirt senior who isn’t great. He just an athletic specimen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AKRNA Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 13 minutes ago, germ-x said: I don’t think it was a great trade, but Denver has nothing in terms of OLB depth. Watson while in Denver was part of that rotation, he has experience at both ILB and OLB, and he’s a very good special teamed who the organization is familiar with. They gave up too much, but I get the move. Good points. Also, value was an early 6th rd pick. You're looking for PS players at that point. I don't like or dislike it. It's pretty close to a non-issue. The FO knows team needs better than we do and must've figured he brought more to the table than anyone they'd pick at that spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cutler06 Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Have to wonder what Elway/Fangio believe they have at ILB ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted April 27, 2019 Author Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, Counselor said: His upside is limited. He’s a red shirt senior who isn’t great. He just an athletic specimen. EDIT: Wait, wrong pick came in, I thought it was Mack Wilson. Ignore lol. Edited April 27, 2019 by Broncofan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
germ-x Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 6 minutes ago, Counselor said: His upside is limited. He’s a red shirt senior who isn’t great. He just an athletic specimen. Athleticism is upside. You don’t find 250 pounders with his speed/explosiveness growing on trees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BroncoBruin Posted April 27, 2019 Share Posted April 27, 2019 Interesting that Elway says Hollins can play inside and outside. Mad genius Fangio cooking up something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted April 27, 2019 Author Share Posted April 27, 2019 (edited) 24 minutes ago, BroncoBruin said: I like the player. But would have preferred Cashman or Emmanuel Hall. Cashman would have fit really well with the Fangio scheme. FWIW, I think he'll be better than Mack Wilson, who went 2 picks earlier. My tracker said we took Wilson lol. At this stage, it's all flyers (unless you are taking a P/K lol), so the Hollins pick won't get me too upset, although I'll stand on Cashman & keeping the other pick instead of trading the 5th for Watson when we get our GM game going. Would have preferred we keep both 5ths, though most of all. We then could have had Cashman and Hollins, for example. Or Hall and Hollins, if they thought Hollins can move inside. And that's recognizing they're all fliers. I just can't endorse 1 year of Watson vs. 4 year min-wage fliers on these guys. You hit on these, and suddenly the rebuild is that much faster, Trevathan/Paradis-style. You can't hit for that kind of impact with a 1-year guy. Oh well. Edited April 27, 2019 by Broncofan 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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