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Pick is in, #4 Clelin Ferrell DE Clemson

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Perfect fit for PG's scheme. Versatile guy, can  play either side, van play the run well and van rush the passer. He is not a super athlete, but has a great motor and he is already pretty good technically...Carlos Dunlap comes to mind for me, but I think Ferrell has higher upside.

Josh Allen's carrier will be interesting, since he got to a 4-3 team too...different scheme, but still...

As a leader he looks to be a great one...we need a guy there since Tuck!!

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I just didnt believe the prototypical DE in PGs scheme required a top 5 pick. You look at the guys PG and Mike Zimmer had in Cincy - the Carlos Dunlaps, Michael Johnson, Robert Geathers, Wallace Gillbery, Frostee Ruckers of the world  - all solid all around DEs but not elite level players by any means. 

With the 4th pick in the draft, you gotta get a star. I don't believe we got one in Ferrell. He has a chance to be a solid all around player , but he wont be the guy you ideally want to have as your best edge rusher. If he can carve out a career like Dunlap (only one double digit sack season in 9 yr career, but good all around player) I guess I cant be too mad, but I believe Mayock played it way to safe for his first ever NFL draft pick. Devin White is going to be a mega star, and I believe Ed Oliver will be a star as well.

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26 minutes ago, SilverNBlackFan said:

I just didnt believe the prototypical DE in PGs scheme required a top 5 pick. You look at the guys PG and Mike Zimmer had in Cincy - the Carlos Dunlaps, Michael Johnson, Robert Geathers, Wallace Gillbery, Frostee Ruckers of the world  - all solid all around DEs but not elite level players by any means. 

With the 4th pick in the draft, you gotta get a star. I don't believe we got one in Ferrell. He has a chance to be a solid all around player , but he wont be the guy you ideally want to have as your best edge rusher. If he can carve out a career like Dunlap (only one double digit sack season in 9 yr career, but good all around player) I guess I cant be too mad, but I believe Mayock played it way to safe for his first ever NFL draft pick. Devin White is going to be a mega star, and I believe Ed Oliver will be a star as well.

I think that’s a fair assessment. I definitely think some of these players that went right after him will be better,  but we just weren’t so desperate at those positions. My opinion is that DE was such an urgent need that I’m glad they clubbed down and just hit it in the fairway. I would have been real nervous if they had to rely on a trade up or a player fall to address DE and get a player that might not be as safe of a fit. 

But your point still remains - it was real conservative. But after all the rumors about Haskins, Jones, Lock, it was mainly just a relief in my eyes. 

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2 hours ago, SilverNBlackFan said:

I guess I cant be too mad, but I believe Mayock played it way to safe for his first ever NFL draft pick. Devin White is going to be a mega star, and I believe Ed Oliver will be a star as well.

4

Ferrell was the cleanest edge prospect in the class and should be a plug and play starter. Bosa was clearly the best edge in the class but he has injury concerns and the best ability is availability. Josh Allen was good but he's a 3-4 OLB that doesn't fit our scheme, Gary was a workout warrior with minimal production, Burns was a speed rusher with weight/strength concerns, and Montez Sweat's heart condition could realistically cut his career very short. 

Ferrell is only 21, has produced at an elite level, has good athleticism, and has the frame/tools you look for in an edge player. Barring injury, he should be a starter here for a long time. We could've taken a "sexier" pick for sure but those guys came with a lot more risk. 

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1 hour ago, NYRaider said:

Josh Allen was good but he's a 3-4 OLB that doesn't fit our scheme

This simply isn't true. Allen would be an ideal right end in Guenther's scheme. Also I reject the notion that any scheme doesn't have room for an elite edge rushing prospect. That's like saying there are teams out there who wouldn't be able to fit in Von Miller, Khalil Mack, or Chandler Jones. You might have you make some changes, but if you can't fit that type of player in your scheme the problem is the scheme (you) not the player.

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Guenther said he could change his scheme up to fit the best players possible.

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3 minutes ago, drfrey13 said:

Guenther said he could change his scheme up to fit the best players possible.

Ultimately think the Ferrell pick was based on a divergent evaluation from myself and the draft consensus. I simply think Mayock and/or Gruden thought Ferrell was a better prospect than Allen. I also think they knew they through differently from the rest of the league which is why they tried to trade back. We will see.

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1 hour ago, NYRaider said:

Ferrell was the cleanest edge prospect in the class and should be a plug and play starter. Bosa was clearly the best edge in the class but he has injury concerns and the best ability is availability. Josh Allen was good but he's a 3-4 OLB that doesn't fit our scheme, Gary was a workout warrior with minimal production, Burns was a speed rusher with weight/strength concerns, and Montez Sweat's heart condition could realistically cut his career very short. 

Ferrell is only 21, has produced at an elite level, has good athleticism, and has the frame/tools you look for in an edge player. Barring injury, he should be a starter here for a long time. We could've taken a "sexier" pick for sure but those guys came with a lot more risk. 

Average athleticism at best.  He played at an extreme high level, I will not even try to deny this, in college because his athleticism was above average in college and he plays with exceptional technique and is smart.  Those will translate well in the pros and he will play well in the beginning but his lack of athleticism will is what is going to limit his ceiling.  He reminds me of a defensive LeVeon Bell.  Now we have to see if an NFL strength program can bring out some hidden athleticism similar to what happen with Bell so that he can be elite.  If he can not improve there he will be good but not great or elite.

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3 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Ferrell was the cleanest edge prospect in the class and should be a plug and play starter.

Not sure what "cleanest" means, especially when he's the only one of the top Edges without a complete athletic profile available.  Sure, he's "safe" as in he should be at least an average starter for the duration of his rookie contract but that's not what you should be aiming for in a top 5 pick.  People said the exact same thing about Shaq Lawson.

Plus, any one of Bosa, Allen, Sweat, Gary, Burns would be a "plug and play starter" given our DE depth chart right now.

3 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Josh Allen was good but he's a 3-4 OLB that doesn't fit our scheme, Gary was a workout warrior with minimal production, Burns was a speed rusher with weight/strength concerns, and Montez Sweat's heart condition could realistically cut his career very short. 

1. Josh Allen - he's like 3lbs lighter than Clelin Ferrell.  A pass rusher is a pass rusher and it's Guenther's fault if he couldn't find a way to play Josh Allen.  Cincinatti drafted Carl Lawson when Guenther was the D Coordinator and they made it work, Zimmer uses the scheme scheme and has Danielle Hunter as a starting DE.  Don't like this argument at all.

2. Gary, Burns, and Sweat all have concerns just like Ferrell does.  You're acting like the only players available to us at 4 were Edges.

3 hours ago, NYRaider said:

Ferrell is only 21, has produced at an elite level, has good athleticism, and has the frame/tools you look for in an edge player. Barring injury, he should be a starter here for a long time. We could've taken a "sexier" pick for sure but those guys came with a lot more risk. 

 He doesn't have the "tools" you look for in an edge player.  He's has a decent get off and good hand usage but lacks any real juice.  Why do you think he has "good athleticism?"  He didnt look like a good athlete on film, had a 42nd percentile 3 cone, and then didnt run or jump.  The fact that he chose not to run or jump should indicate to you that he is actually a poor athlete.

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2 hours ago, Rich7sena said:

This simply isn't true. Allen would be an ideal right end in Guenther's scheme. Also I reject the notion that any scheme doesn't have room for an elite edge rushing prospect. That's like saying there are teams out there who wouldn't be able to fit in Von Miller, Khalil Mack, or Chandler Jones. You might have you make some changes, but if you can't fit that type of player in your scheme the problem is the scheme (you) not the player.

Josh Allen is more Anthony Barr than he is Khalil Mack or Von Miller though. 

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2 hours ago, drfrey13 said:

Guenther said he could change his scheme up to fit the best players possible.

It appears we never thought much of Allen. I think the proof is in the pudding at this point.

6 hours ago, SilverNBlackFan said:

I just didnt believe the prototypical DE in PGs scheme required a top 5 pick. You look at the guys PG and Mike Zimmer had in Cincy - the Carlos Dunlaps, Michael Johnson, Robert Geathers, Wallace Gillbery, Frostee Ruckers of the world  - all solid all around DEs but not elite level players by any means. 

With the 4th pick in the draft, you gotta get a star. I don't believe we got one in Ferrell. He has a chance to be a solid all around player , but he wont be the guy you ideally want to have as your best edge rusher. If he can carve out a career like Dunlap (only one double digit sack season in 9 yr career, but good all around player) I guess I cant be too mad, but I believe Mayock played it way to safe for his first ever NFL draft pick. Devin White is going to be a mega star, and I believe Ed Oliver will be a star as well.

Dude. Preach. This is why I have a bone to pick. I like Ferrell, but not as a top 5 pick. Scheme fit is important but if he is a perfect fit, and he isn't a 12 sack a year guy, then maybe the value isn't there. I acknowledge that I've beaten the trade down horse to death by now, but it's not without merit. Did we really have so much tunnel vision that we had to have him specifically? And if so, why? Are his leadership skills really more important than football skills of other high character guys who were available? I do think Oliver was a smokescreen mask the scent of desire for Q based on the emphasis on intangibles. But for the lack of value in the spot of the pick, lack of top-notch talent (most had him in the 10-15 range at best), and the seeming lack of value in the system (PG DEs are rarely, if ever, top tier)....I don't know....just not in love with the choice. Seems like we were locked into either a DE or him specifically. Granted, if Q was available then who knows

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7 minutes ago, Silver&Black88 said:

It appears we never thought much of Allen. I think the proof is in the pudding at this point.

Dude. Preach. This is why I have a bone to pick. I like Ferrell, but not as a top 5 pick. Scheme fit is important but if he is a perfect fit, and he isn't a 12 sack a year guy, then maybe the value isn't there. I acknowledge that I've beaten the trade down horse to death by now, but it's not without merit. Did we really have so much tunnel vision that we had to have him specifically? And if so, why? Are his leadership skills really more important than football skills of other high character guys who were available? I do think Oliver was a smokescreen mask the scent of desire for Q based on the emphasis on intangibles. But for the lack of value in the spot of the pick, lack of top-notch talent (most had him in the 10-15 range at best), and the seeming lack of value in the system (PG DEs are rarely, if ever, top tier)....I don't know....just not in love with the choice. Seems like we were locked into either a DE or him specifically. Granted, if Q was available then who knows

Most had him top 5 after the national championship game too.

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