1[12]: Rashan Gary [EDGE; Michigan]

[wgbeethree]

50 minutes ago, Pugger said:

We also have to remember he is still rather young.  He just turned 23 last Thursday.

He and Jaire are both younger than multiple rookies. 

[MrBobGray]

One thing that really stands out about Gary in 2020 is how hard he works to not overrun the QB now.  He still does it at times when he thinks he can turn the corner and fails, but just as often he plants hard at depth and cuts back inside.  It's a very good sign, as is his much improved hand usage.  He's still got a lot of growth left there, but he consistently works to get his hands into the OL and he clears the OL's hands pretty reliably now.  If he can stay on this track, that's a legitimate All-Pro in three years time.

[vegas492]

11 minutes ago, MrBobGray said:

One thing that really stands out about Gary in 2020 is how hard he works to not overrun the QB now.  He still does it at times when he thinks he can turn the corner and fails, but just as often he plants hard at depth and cuts back inside.  It's a very good sign, as is his much improved hand usage.  He's still got a lot of growth left there, but he consistently works to get his hands into the OL and he clears the OL's hands pretty reliably now.  If he can stay on this track, that's a legitimate All-Pro in three years time.

Yup.  He's much improved.

I would love to see him counter his rush, though.  Every time I see him, he does the same thing.  Run fast, engage hands, plow through the defender or get pushed wide.

I'd love to see him dip inside and rip his left arm after he's run that wide shoulder rush a few times.

I had hoped to see more out of him this year.  We heard that he was winning "quick" in the summer.  That isn't the case right now.  But, I do feel like he is on the right track.  Much to hopeful for there, and the kid certainly has the work ethic that I questioned when he was drafted.  (meaning his work ethic is better than I had thought)

Edited December 11, 2020 by vegas492

[beekay414]

I was in here preaching during the draft that he had every tool in the book but he'd need time due to how Michigan misused him. You can't teach the ability that Rashan has and it was NEVER about immediate returns with him. Preston will be a cap casualty next year and Rashan will step in as an every down EDGE and kill it. 

Edited December 11, 2020 by beekay414

[Joe]

I agree. He's on the precipice of putting it all together and once that happens, watch out...

[Arthur Penske]

The one thing that was suck with a coordinator switch would be losing Mike Smith to coach Gary and co

[ThatJerkDave]

4 hours ago, beekay414 said:

I was in here preaching during the draft that he had every tool in the book but he'd need time due to how Michigan misused him. You can't teach the ability that Rashan has and it was NEVER about immediate returns with him. Preston will be a cap casualty next year and Rashan will step in as an every down EDGE and kill it. 

Fortunately, he also just turned 23 last week.  So the growth potential is still there, even after two seasons in the league.

[Joe]

On 12/11/2020 at 9:35 PM, Arthur Penske said:

The one thing that was suck with a coordinator switch would be losing Mike Smith to coach Gary and co

Whoever said we'd lose Mike Smith? The problem isn't the coaching, it's the scheme and strategy. Bring in someone from Baltimore, Pittsburgh, or San Fran and keep what works. We kept Jerry Montgomery around and promoted him when Dom left and the same with Jason Simmons last season before he left for Carolina and Jerry Gray was brought in, Luke Getsy's been around forever as an offensive assistant and Ben Sirmans is a holdover as well IIRC. Hell, he may be promoted from within...

Edited December 16, 2020 by Joe

[CWood21]

12 hours ago, Joe said:

Whoever said we'd lose Mike Smith? The problem isn't the coaching, it's the scheme and strategy. Bring in someone from Baltimore, Pittsburgh, or San Fran and keep what works. We kept Jerry Montgomery around and promoted him when Dom left and the same with Jason Simmons last season before he left for Carolina and Jerry Gray was brought in, Luke Getsy's been around forever as an offensive assistant and Ben Sirmans is a holdover as well IIRC. Hell, he may be promoted from within...

I mean, it's a logical train in thought.  Unless you bring in someone who has worked with Mike Smith, you're likely going to see someone who wants to bring in their own guy.  Honestly, I'd like to keep Smith and Grey.

[MrBobGray]

The more Gary I watch, the more I wish they'd just play him standing up in the middle with Z.  I'd love to see them try a five across with Clark head-up over the center, and Smith/Z/Gary/Ramsey all stand-up across the rest of the front.  Gary's biggest issue at this point for me is that he's always trying to either run to space or run through the lineman; he's so focused on his rush plan and using his hands that I think he forgets how big and strong he is.  There's absolutely no reason Gary shouldn't have a sack just forcing himself through the B gap at this point; honestly he could probably feint a single step wide and get tackles selling out on the speed rush, because he tries it so often.  I mean how many RT in the league have the feet to get back to the inside rush on a guy that big with that acceleration?  And he just won't do it, so if he won't do it, force the issue and make him rush inside.  Take away all that space and I'd bet you'd get Gary drawing a hold or three a game just running through double teams.

[vegas492]

19 hours ago, MrBobGray said:

The more Gary I watch, the more I wish they'd just play him standing up in the middle with Z.  I'd love to see them try a five across with Clark head-up over the center, and Smith/Z/Gary/Ramsey all stand-up across the rest of the front.  Gary's biggest issue at this point for me is that he's always trying to either run to space or run through the lineman; he's so focused on his rush plan and using his hands that I think he forgets how big and strong he is.  There's absolutely no reason Gary shouldn't have a sack just forcing himself through the B gap at this point; honestly he could probably feint a single step wide and get tackles selling out on the speed rush, because he tries it so often.  I mean how many RT in the league have the feet to get back to the inside rush on a guy that big with that acceleration?  And he just won't do it, so if he won't do it, force the issue and make him rush inside.  Take away all that space and I'd bet you'd get Gary drawing a hold or three a game just running through double teams.

I agree with you.

But I think we see this same rush from him, time after time, because that is what he learned this off-season and that is where he is comfortable.  He's doing what he knows and it is working to an extent.  With how raw he is/was, that counter move should be something that gets worked on this off-season and used next season.

You wouldn't think it would be too hard to incorporate it now, but I'll guess that they are still bringing him along slowly.  Can't argue with the results so far.

[Arthur Penske]

23 hours ago, CWood21 said:

I mean, it's a logical train in thought.  Unless you bring in someone who has worked with Mike Smith, you're likely going to see someone who wants to bring in their own guy.  Honestly, I'd like to keep Smith and Grey.

Agree on all accounts. But like you said new DC may want his own guys

[Smidgeon]

2 hours ago, vegas492 said:

I agree with you.

But I think we see this same rush from him, time after time, because that is what he learned this off-season and that is where he is comfortable.  He's doing what he knows and it is working to an extent.  With how raw he is/was, that counter move should be something that gets worked on this off-season and used next season.

You wouldn't think it would be too hard to incorporate it now, but I'll guess that they are still bringing him along slowly.  Can't argue with the results so far.

Aaron Kampman talked about the switch to the 3-4 and how it takes a significant amount of time to get the muscle memory right when adjusting to new movements.  I am okay with Gary using what he worked on this offseason.  It's working enough, and his work ethic (and coach) will make sure he doesn't stagnate in the offseason.  But it's a little more difficult than just "try something different today".  That's liable to get someone injured in live fire.

[CWood21]

1 hour ago, Arthur Penske said:

Agree on all accounts. But like you said new DC may want his own guys

I think it's nearly a given unless you want some sort of lame duck situation.  I mean, if you're a DC candidate and LaFleur is demanding you keep Mike Smith (and whoever else), is the job overly appealing?

[PossibleCabbage]

Just now, CWood21 said:

I think it's nearly a given unless you want some sort of lame duck situation.  I mean, if you're a DC candidate and LaFleur is demanding you keep Mike Smith (and whoever else), is the job overly appealing?

Wasn't LaFleur's hiring contingent on keeping Mike Pettine?