Goldfish's Way Too Early Draft Rankings 2019 - Cardinals at 1

[BayRaider]

7 minutes ago, onejayhawk said:

Of the Final four, the remaining team would have been my #4. No problem with the first pick, but they are supposed to draft the best player, so no bonus points either. The rest of the draft is solid but no OMG value like the Bills and Redskins have.

Also, if Miami gets credit for Rosen (they shouldn;t) Arizona should be slapped for the value they got back. Be consistent and treat draft day palyer trades like pre-draft day trades.

J

Cardinals draft was fantastic even if you don’t include Murray. Value and starters everywhere. And I think Murray was a great pick and far and away the best QB of this class. 

[DirtyDez]

31 minutes ago, onejayhawk said:

Of the Final four, the remaining team would have been my #4. No problem with the first pick, but they are supposed to draft the best player, so no bonus points either. The rest of the draft is solid but no OMG value like the Bills and Redskins have.

Also, if Miami gets credit for Rosen (they shouldn;t) Arizona should be slapped for the value they got back. Be consistent and treat draft day palyer trades like pre-draft day trades.

J

Miami traded the pick from their draft so it should credit their ranking but I don’t see why it should discredit Arizona’s.  It’s an extra pick they didn’t have.  Now if @goldfishwars wants to go back and drop AZ’s 2018 ranking then by all means...

[goldfishwars]

2 hours ago, HTTRG3Dynasty said:

You've had us ranked 9th, 6th and 9th in 2016, 2017 and 2018, respectively. Now 2nd.  I guess you kinda like us .

In all seriousness, while Bruce Allen is making his rounds to the national media outlets the last few weeks trying to soak up the credit, the biggest reason for our success in the draft the past few years has been due to our 34-year-old Director of College Scouting, Kyle Smith, son of former Chargers GM, A.J. Smith.  He's running the show in all things draft-related.  The guy is a stud, and has put up a string of very solid drafts since he took over.  We need to promote him to GM soon, and kick Bruce to the curb.  I'd be disgusted if we let another McVay situation happen and watched him get promoted to GM elsewhere.  Probably would completely give up on the team tbh.

Yeah, I guess having good draft classes with a back drop of front office power struggles and that weird top-heavy organisational structure is why it makes little sense to me. Great nugget on Kyle Smith, that’s really interesting. 

[Daniel]

8 hours ago, onejayhawk said:

Of the Final four, the remaining team would have been my #4. No problem with the first pick, but they are supposed to draft the best player, so no bonus points either. The rest of the draft is solid but no OMG value like the Bills and Redskins have.

Also, if Miami gets credit for Rosen (they shouldn;t) Arizona should be slapped for the value they got back. Be consistent and treat draft day palyer trades like pre-draft day trades.

Agreed.  Of course, I'm lower on the Cards draft than goldfish because I don't like the Kyler pick.  You take a QB I don't like No. 1 overall, I'm not gonna like your draft that much.  But yeah, it's pretty hard to find fault with the rest of it, other than the fact that they didn't get O-line help and didn't get the best value for Rosen.

IMO, Cards are somewhere between 5 and 10.  Skins were my No. 1; the best QB at 15 and the biggest steal of the first round (and at a position of high value) is special.

Arizona, on the other hand, had the first overall pick, so they had a ton of capital, and did well with it, but not anything special.  Murphy, Allen, and Butler were steals, but Isabella was a little bit of a reach IMO, and Cody Ford or Greg Little would have been comparable steals to Byron Murphy, and gotten them OL help for their QB.

Of course, I had the Pats as my No. 2, so that's a much bigger deviation than either the Cards or the Skins.

[Chrissooner49er]

Cards are #1, huh? Okay.

 

 

[DreamKid]

15 minutes ago, Chrissooner49er said:

Cards are #1, huh? Okay.

Just on drafting Kyler Murray alone they should be #1. Dude always showed up in the biggest games for the Sooners.

[Chrissooner49er]

5 minutes ago, DreamKid said:

Just on drafting Kyler Murray alone they should be #1. Dude always showed up in the biggest games for the Sooners.

Did he? Alabama would take issue with that...I believe his completion percentage for that game was about 52%. Yuck.

And I am a Sooner fan (and alum), if you missed that.

Edited May 10, 2019 by Chrissooner49er

[Forge]

22 minutes ago, Chrissooner49er said:

Cards are #1, huh? Okay.

 

 

Some people really loved the Cards draft class. Obviously, a huge amount of that will depend on how you feel about Murray. Personally, I didn't love all the assets thrown at the receiver position, and some of the guys they drafted, like Isabella, I didn't particularly love. I though Isabella was basically a 4th - 5th round type. The senior bowl week really soured me on him. I thought it was good value on Butler, though I didn't love him the way many on this board did, but I thought Johnson was overkill. 

Love Allen in the third. During the predraft process, I thought he'd be an ideal fit for a 3-4 DE if he bulked up a little, and I think the Cards are going to run a 3-4 defense, so this makes a lot of sense for me. He does a lot of things that I love for my 3-4 DE to do, and you don't require him to get to the quarterback as much. That being said, I think that is a pick that will bear fruit in year 2 more  so than year 1. Thompson could be a steal in round 5, but he's another guy that needs to sit, and with a degenerative knee condition, it's possible nothing ever comes from that pick. On name value it looks great though. 

[DreamKid]

1 minute ago, Chrissooner49er said:

Did he? Alabama would take issue with that...I believe his completion percentage for that game was about 52%. Yuck.

And I am a Sooner fan, if you missed that.

I was messing with you. I've seen you post this about 30 times this draft season lol.

[MWil23]

I guess it depends on how you view Murray as a prospect. I personally don't love him. He's the definition of Boom or Bust IMO. It's funny to me how people knock Haskins for only being a starter 1 year but seemingly don't apply this to Murray. Regardless, he should thank Baker and Russell Wilson for paving the way to break the mold and get drafted #1 overall (Baker at #1 and Wilson by his performance).

[PossibleCabbage]

My biggest quibble with the Cards at #1 is that Arizona had an absolutely horrendous offensive line last year, and they did precisely nothing to address it before round 6 in the draft.  If you're drafting 3 WRs before one OL, then you had better have one of the best OL units in the league or I'm not going to like your draft much.  Now Kingsbury might say "we're going to get the ball out before rushers can get there" but I am skeptical of that working; after all rushers were getting to Rosen in <2 seconds a lot last year.

[ClutchDJ]

19 minutes ago, PossibleCabbage said:

My biggest quibble with the Cards at #1 is that Arizona had an absolutely horrendous offensive line last year, and they did precisely nothing to address it before round 6 in the draft.  If you're drafting 3 WRs before one OL, then you had better have one of the best OL units in the league or I'm not going to like your draft much.  Now Kingsbury might say "we're going to get the ball out before rushers can get there" but I am skeptical of that working; after all rushers were getting to Rosen in <2 seconds a lot last year.

They got some guys in trades(Marcus Gilbert) & signed some in FA with Max Garcia & JR Sweezy. They don’t mean much, but they’re better than what was thrown out last year. I also doubt every OLine starter gets on IR again. The OL was bad, but I don’t think people realize how predictable Steve Wilks’ staff was last year.

 

Drafting need over BPA is what has shot this franchise to the ground the past few years. I can see someone like Cody Ford over Byron Murphy being a better decision(though I think Byron is the better player), but someone like Greg Little is laughable at best.

Edited May 10, 2019 by ClutchDJ

[goldfishwars]

1. Arizona Cardinals

Selections
1. Arizona Cardinals - Kyler Murray  [ QB ] Oklahoma
33. Arizona Cardinals - Byron Murphy  [ CB ] Washington
62. Arizona Cardinals - Andy Isabella  [ WR ] UMass
65. Arizona Cardinals - Zach Allen  [ DE ] Boston College
103. Arizona Cardinals - Hakeem Butler  [ WR ] Iowa State
139. Arizona Cardinals - Deionte Thompson  [ S ] Alabama
174. Arizona Cardinals - KeeSean Johnson  [ WR ] Fresno State
179. Arizona Cardinals - Lamont Gaillard  [ C ] Georgia
248. Arizona Cardinals - Joshua Miles  [ OT ] Morgan State
249. Arizona Cardinals - Michael Dogbe  [ DE ] Temple
254. Arizona Cardinals - Caleb Wilson  [ TE ] UCLA

Picks Heading In
1.
33. 
65. 
103.
139.
174. 
179.
248.
249.
254.

Favorite Pick 
Hakeem Butler – Okay, it’s a bit weird to put a 4th round pick as your favourite selection and I’m aware there are wide ranging opinions on Hakeem Butler, but even his worst critics would have been surprised by that slide. I admit I was fully in, he was a top ten player on my board and I don’t care who knows it. 6’6 wide receivers aren’t supposed to move or jump that well, or be so good after the catch, have such control over their body and aren’t supposed to average 22 yards per reception - it is freaky. He’s tough and competitive too, this isn’t a finesse receiver – he loves to get after it as a blocker and will fight like hell for extra yards with the ball in hand. 

He does need to get much better against press and he does have far too many concentration drops when working back to the ball. I don’t have a huge concern with his hands, because of the crazy plays he does make and drops aren’t actually very predictive from college to the NFL. I think a good coach gets that out of him. He’s going to have a role to play on this offense early, Kingsbury will be lining up four wide as much as he can and he’ll need guys to rotate in and out. At the very least, Butler is going to be put in favorable situations for him to succeed early – be it as a vertical threat, or a red zone target. 

 

Overview

Steve Keim is on the thinnest ice, the team he built sucked, the man he hired to run that team sucked, the first round quarterback he took last year is already out of time and this is on top of the embarrassing arrest last year. Most GMs would be out of the job by now, probably the ones who are less pally with their owners. I’m not sure I would have trusted a guy to run my draft after a run of really questionable 1st round selections, but man, he could have put some extra years on his contract with this haul. 

Whilst the Cardinals did get excellent value and scheme fits at all of their picks after Murray, you have the question the lack of early investment on the offensive line – a valid question which can be answered in some degree by pointing to how the new offensive system and mobile quarterback might put them under less stress and they also do have key players returning from poor health. The other main quibble on the draft is the botched handling of the Josh Rosen trade. A very late 2nd and 2020 5th round selection for a guy you moved up to select in the top 10 only a year ago doesn’t feel like sensible value in return. 

Onto Kyler Murray then, the rumors were circling from before the Combine that he had received a guarantee from the Cardinals. It’s clear now that the decision was something that Keim had agonized over for almost the entire process. For what it’s worth, I think it was the right move even if it’s highly unusual. I think if you have any lingering doubts about your man and there’s an opportunity to move onto a situation where your new head coach knows this new guy you could take inside-out, you do it. It took a perfect storm for this to make sense and it does somehow make a lot of sense. 

As a quarterback, it’s kind of similar to the Marquise Brown situation. The majority of the criticism about Kyler comes from his lack of size and I get it, thresholds are thresholds for a reason. But it’s hard to point to moments on his film where that really matters. He manipulates the pocket to find throwing lanes, doesn’t escape pressure too early and only had five batted down passes last year. Outside of that, he’s got rare gifts as someone who can be a home run threat as a runner and thrower. That’s an incredibly rare combination of skills and without being hyperbolic, it genuinely might be something we have not seen before in a single quarterback. Perhaps a more valid concern, is whether he’s physically able to reach that potential, there’s a lot hits to absorb and a lot of pressure to evade and teams are going to try and find out early if he is up to it. 

I really like the fit for Byron Murphy, who is going to play on Vance Joseph’s heavy zone scheme which should make good use of his closing speed and easy movements. He’s a little lighter than the modern-day ideal, but feisty and instinctive and this is a good situation for him to flourish. Andy Isabella at 62 becomes the other side the Josh Rosen trade by default. He’s a smaller receiver, who regularly gets called a slot – but generally looks much better playing outside the numbers. He’s got incredible raw speed, gets past safeties in a hurry and gives this passing offense another explosive receiving option. 23 touchdowns and a 167 passes caught over the last two seasons shows he can handle a load, albeit with some concerns about his hands and catching radius. 

Zach Allen had some 1st round attention early on in the process, but his stock took a knock with an underwhelming display at the Senior Bowl – still I wouldn’t have been shocked to see him taken much earlier on day two. He was a TFL monster at BC, with 40 over the past 3 seasons and wins with power and hand technique. He should slot in at five-tech quite nicely. Deionte Thompson is another name recognition selection in the 5th, another who flirted with 1st round attention before slipping back as the process wore on. He could be a nice floating deep safety compliment to Budda Baker if that’s where they plan to use him (which is kind of what he’s good for). 

The Cards kept the value picks up by taking KeeSean Johnson from Fresno. I thought he was vastly underrated in a deep class and unlike his receiver classmates, he’s an absolute technician. Whilst he did not test well, he does his best work underneath and could make a decent living in the intermediate areas which might free up with a bit of deep speed on the outside. With Larry Fitz and Christian Kirk on the roster, it could be while before we see him worked in. 

The next two picks were finally spent on the offensive line, which to be fair – doesn’t look terrible with off-season additions and guys coming back from injury. Lamon Gaillard is actually really solid and I think he could start at center next year with Mason Cole not being able to snap a damn football. He’s tough as hell and was a team captain at Georgia, who loved the man. Joshua Miles is more of a small school project, but played at the Senior Bowl where he improved day by day. He’s a huge dude who could develop to play inside or out. To round the class off, the Cards took Michael Dogbe who I caught onto late. He’s got enough juice and snap to snap energy to round out the depth on that defensive line. I didn’t love Caleb Wilson on film where looks a little labored and deliberate. He ran real fast which was a surprise to most and probably worth a flyer with the last pick in the draft. 
 

[goldfishwars]

Jesus - I always underestimate how long that takes. 

Thanks for reading along guys, really appreciate the reads and feedback. I would imagine the biggest departure for mine and other's rankings would be the Seahawks. I personally love what they did, turning 4 picks into what I would guess is 8 players who can play significant roles for them this year. Plus they've got the goat John Urusa, seriously check this guy out. 

[FinSting]

6 minutes ago, goldfishwars said:

Jesus - I always underestimate how long that takes. 

 

So awesome you did it. Years from now most of us will only remember the 2019 draft as 'wait, the Niners drafted a punter in the 4th rd?'