Ozzy Posted September 25, 2019 Share Posted September 25, 2019 20 minutes ago, NoDakViking said: I assume Herbert will be gone, as well as Tua. Who are the other QBs that have caught your attention so far? I know Burrow is ascending and Vikings scouts were at the Utah State game last weekend for Jordan Love. Any interest in these guys or Eason, Hurts, or Fromm? Burrow for sure is a riser big time with how great he has played this year. Could be a 2nd or 3rd rounder, coming into the year he would have been lucky to be drafted but not now after he has played, he will be arguably one of the top 7 QBs in the draft. I would like Love sure but he is a bit of a project but has a lot of upside, Eason has a ton of upside and a rocket arm. Hurts I would not want honestly unless it was middle of the draft, I still question his overall arm talent in general but is a great leader and high character kid who is very strong mentally and physically. Fromm I would not mind in the 2nd round but not sure I would pick him 1st round, he has a limited arm but is a good game manager and leader. Sam Ehlinger I would not mind 2nd round, love his toughness and leadership ability but not sure he is a great fit for a traditional zone run blocking scheme but his tough and can run. Shea Patterson I used to like but not anymore based on how he has played. Montez physically has a ton to work with but throws an odd ball and does not have great accuracy. Stanley not a huge fan of his, Book could be a decent mid round pick and Khalil Tate I would not mind as a project QB with great athletic ability and a talented throwing arm, but he would be more a mid to late round pick. But again physically for a zone blocking scheme I would like Herbert a lot based on his height and athletic ability. In terms of where the Vikings are picking potentially, Jacob Eason makes a ton of sense. I have not been able to watch any Washington games this year but will a few times and based on the highlights and stats the kid is playing great. He has tons of arm talent and can make all the throws. Has the size as well, not quite the athlete Herbert is and cannot create on the move as well but would make a lot of sense there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 25, 2019 Share Posted September 25, 2019 9 hours ago, Ozzy said: Burrow for sure is a riser big time with how great he has played this year. Could be a 2nd or 3rd rounder, coming into the year he would have been lucky to be drafted but not now after he has played, he will be arguably one of the top 7 QBs in the draft. I would like Love sure but he is a bit of a project but has a lot of upside, Eason has a ton of upside and a rocket arm. Hurts I would not want honestly unless it was middle of the draft, I still question his overall arm talent in general but is a great leader and high character kid who is very strong mentally and physically. Fromm I would not mind in the 2nd round but not sure I would pick him 1st round, he has a limited arm but is a good game manager and leader. Sam Ehlinger I would not mind 2nd round, love his toughness and leadership ability but not sure he is a great fit for a traditional zone run blocking scheme but his tough and can run. Shea Patterson I used to like but not anymore based on how he has played. Montez physically has a ton to work with but throws an odd ball and does not have great accuracy. Stanley not a huge fan of his, Book could be a decent mid round pick and Khalil Tate I would not mind as a project QB with great athletic ability and a talented throwing arm, but he would be more a mid to late round pick. But again physically for a zone blocking scheme I would like Herbert a lot based on his height and athletic ability. In terms of where the Vikings are picking potentially, Jacob Eason makes a ton of sense. I have not been able to watch any Washington games this year but will a few times and based on the highlights and stats the kid is playing great. He has tons of arm talent and can make all the throws. Has the size as well, not quite the athlete Herbert is and cannot create on the move as well but would make a lot of sense there. I am speaking out of great ignorance here, as I have not seen any of these QB's play. I lost interest in college football when the spread offense became popular. By "overall arm talent" are you questioning his arm strength? If so, I would argue that arm strength is overrated when judging quarterback talent. Accuracy is by far a more important characteristic to have, in my opinion. If Hurts is inaccurate, then I agree with you, I wouldn't want him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted September 25, 2019 Share Posted September 25, 2019 12 minutes ago, Virginia Viking said: I am speaking out of great ignorance here, as I have not seen any of these QB's play. I lost interest in college football when the spread offense became popular. By "overall arm talent" are you questioning his arm strength? If so, I would argue that arm strength is overrated when judging quarterback talent. Accuracy is by far a more important characteristic to have, in my opinion. If Hurts is inaccurate, then I agree with you, I wouldn't want him. Arm talent is the ability to throw the ball with ease. Accuracy may be more important, but a strong arm is essential as well. And you don’t need to have Allen/Mahomes arm strength either. But if a QB doesn’t have the arm strength to make every throw look routine, then I’d question their overall effectiveness. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 25, 2019 Share Posted September 25, 2019 37 minutes ago, SemperFeist said: Arm talent is the ability to throw the ball with ease. Accuracy may be more important, but a strong arm is essential as well. And you don’t need to have Allen/Mahomes arm strength either. But if a QB doesn’t have the arm strength to make every throw look routine, then I’d question their overall effectiveness. How do you consider the arm strength of Fran Tarkenton? He was thought to have a weak arm during his career. However, he made up for it with accuracy and an offense geared for him to play within his limits. As you know, he set every meaningful passing record during his career. I would think that any quarterback that might be drafted, would have adequate arm strength and the ability to play to his strengths. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzy Posted September 25, 2019 Share Posted September 25, 2019 8 hours ago, SemperFeist said: Arm talent is the ability to throw the ball with ease. Accuracy may be more important, but a strong arm is essential as well. And you don’t need to have Allen/Mahomes arm strength either. But if a QB doesn’t have the arm strength to make every throw look routine, then I’d question their overall effectiveness. Agreed, sure it is not absolutely needed but yeah give me Josh Allen all day long, his arm talent and upside because of it is gigantic, not to mention his size and athletic ability. That is what makes Herbert interesting, very good athlete, very tall and strong arm, not quite as good as Josh Allen but is accurate and has good play action fake ability and pump fakes well also. He does not need over 40 throws to be successful like some quarterbacks, he can be good with just 20 or so and with how the Vikings have played early this year they need a QB who is ok not throwing the ball all game long. Hurts ball velocity I find to be on the slower side, his release is not smooth either but he has progressed greatly as a passer no doubt. Some think it is OU and maybe it is but honestly he would have done similar things on Alabama this year if he was the starter their instead of Tua because of the weapons around him. The teams Hurts plays it almost does not even matter how he plays because they are all not that impressive, what he does against Texas and Iowa State matters, the rest of the teams not as much because they cannot stop anyone anyways on defense. Hurts I question his ball handling ability as well, did have fumbling issues at Bama and at times is not very natural in the pocket, but he has improved sure a little in that regard. Case Keenum, Jameis Winston, and Marcus Mariota are free agents next year at QB. I could see the Vikings maybe liking Mariota because he is athletic, young and a good leader. But Titans probably give up on him after this season, same with Winston and Case fits the Vikings current offense with his athletic ability. Wouldn't that be crazy if the bring him back but doubt that happens based on giving up on him already once. Vikings should be in the market for the QB no doubt, but will see how the season goes, even if they like Kirk you still need a damn backup who is not freaking Mannion anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted September 25, 2019 Share Posted September 25, 2019 9 hours ago, Virginia Viking said: How do you consider the arm strength of Fran Tarkenton? Irrelevant. Same as when people bring up Joe Montana. It’s 2019, the game has changed considerably. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torchezim Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 What do you guys think it would take for us to get Trevor Lawrence? I know this is the 2020 draft in discussion but I just want to hear your guys’ thoughts. Would you guys be willing to do whatever it took?). Like say we were picking in the mid area of the first round; would you trade: a 1st, the 1st the following year, your 2nd rounder in both years, a player or two and a couple back end draft picks? I would trade all of that without even blinking an eye. Just want to know if I am the only one who feels that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VikeManDan Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 22 minutes ago, Torchezim said: What do you guys think it would take for us to get Trevor Lawrence? I know this is the 2020 draft in discussion but I just want to hear your guys’ thoughts. Would you guys be willing to do whatever it took?). Like say we were picking in the mid area of the first round; would you trade: a 1st, the 1st the following year, your 2nd rounder in both years, a player or two and a couple back end draft picks? I would trade all of that without even blinking an eye. Just want to know if I am the only one who feels that way. I think you’d have to trade out of the 1st in 2020, gaining a 1st in 2021 plus whatever other picks. Then trade... 2021 1st from 2020 trade Original 2021 1st 2022 1st That might get the conversation started but I’m sure additional picks would need to be included. I don’t think you’re the only one that feels that way. It’s not like a Mahomes trade up though, you have to get up to #1. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 Unless you finish with the worst record in football next year, Lawrence is out of reach. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VikeManDan Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 21 minutes ago, SemperFeist said: Unless you finish with the worst record in football next year, Lawrence is out of reach. Most likely the case, it is fun to speculate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Torchezim Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, SemperFeist said: Unless you finish with the worst record in football next year, Lawrence is out of reach. Fingers crossed. I’d trade anything. If we are willing to part with some players as well, it could help. I’m stuck on this. I’d trade anyone not named Smith or Hunter. Edited September 26, 2019 by Torchezim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDBrocks Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 I agree with @SemperFeist. I don’t think any team would be willing to part with Trevor Lawrence for any price. He’s as good and as safe a prospect since Peyton Manning. A cost controlled top 3 QB is worth more than anyone in the NFL could offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 12 hours ago, SemperFeist said: Irrelevant. Same as when people bring up Joe Montana. It’s 2019, the game has changed considerably. I'm not sure that I can agree with you on this. The rules have changed considerably, but the entire game? Today's pro passing game is built on the West Coast Offense, which, in part, was influenced by the offense the Vikings ran with Tarkenton. It's built on timing, precise routes and lots of movement, and YAC. Yes, you have to be able to take shots down field from time to time, but it doesn't require an arm like Brett Favre. It takes accuracy and football intelligence mostly. Arm strength should be a third characteristic that scouts look for after football intelligence and accuracy. I will agree that a quarterback that has a wet noodle for an arm is not likely to make it. But being able to heave the ball 70 yards, or throwing the ball across the field while rolling out is not particularly necessary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SemperFeist Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 Players are faster, windows are tighter, and the ability to still get the ball where it needs to go while throwing off platform is becoming increasingly more important. Accuracy, timing, football IQ, etc are all needed traits, but if a QB needs perfect throwing fundamentals in order to make a throw, it’s just not going to work out well at the next level. A player doesn’t need to have a laser cannon for an arm, but if you’re evaluating a prospect and you question if he’s got the arm strength to make NFL throws? He doesn’t. And if he doesn’t, he’s not worth drafting. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrplChilPill Posted September 26, 2019 Share Posted September 26, 2019 Yes, the game has changed in forty years. It's hard to fathom people think a weak armed QB could be successful in the long run with these athletes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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