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Raiders Offense Thread:

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8 hours ago, NightTrainLane said:

 

Thank you.

The goal should be to keep Carr alive tho.

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3 hours ago, raidr4life said:

The goal should be to keep Carr alive tho.

The goal should be to win games.

Look, I'm not saying I like Cable track record (past tense) and what that could mean for the pass blocking.

I simple want this to work. Which would mean Cable and Gruden find ways to use the players we have to maximize our offensive output to the level necessary to win more games than we lose and hopefully more. I want the changes in personnel and player status (health, development and experience) on the oline and in the backfield to yield dividends. 

 

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5 hours ago, NightTrainLane said:

The goal should be to win games.

Look, I'm not saying I like Cable track record (past tense) and what that could mean for the pass blocking.

I simple want this to work. Which would mean Cable and Gruden find ways to use the players we have to maximize our offensive output to the level necessary to win more games than we lose and hopefully more. I want the changes in personnel and player status (health, development and experience) on the oline and in the backfield to yield dividends. 

 

That's great man we all want success, but to win more games we will have to protect the QB period, if Cable can't reverse that trend we won't win many games, and as i said before I don't want to be blaming our players for Cable failing, because that's what Raider fans will do. All I can say is when someone shows you who they are believe them. I'll gladly eat crow on this if Cable doesn't get Carr killed.

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No faith in cable. Has he been on any team with a top 15 pass blocking line?

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I was going back and watching press conferences. I think the Jacobs pick was even more for receiving ability than I first thought. Legit I think he's going to become Carr's safety valve this year, the way richard was in garbage time last year. The difference is Jacobs is multidimensional and him playing all 3 downs means you won't know when it's a run or pass play. I'm excited to see how much they feed him. He's only 21 and this team can really build with/around him.

My big question will be, who will fill the "jared cook" role (is it waller) because we don't have anyone to reliably bring in contested catches anymore the way cook did. If Waller can do it, watch out...

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13 hours ago, raidr4life said:

That's great man we all want success, but to win more games we will have to protect the QB period, if Cable can't reverse that trend we won't win many games, and as i said before I don't want to be blaming our players for Cable failing, because that's what Raider fans will do. All I can say is when someone shows you who they are believe them. I'll gladly eat crow on this if Cable doesn't get Carr killed.

We'll see...

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On 02/05/2019 at 6:38 AM, Mr Raider said:

I think we will see a good amount of Richard and AB in the slot. Richard was a consistent part of our passing game, arguably our most consistent and he is very shifty and quick. With Jacobs in the fold and Martin back I dont see Jalen getting a ton of carries, but I can still see him catching 40ish passes (down from last year but our WRs are much better). I can see him still being a big part of our offense as the receiving threat from the backfield and the slot. 

Antonio will see a lot of time in the slot as well. Because hes among the best in the league at it obviously. 

Carr really has no more excuses. The OL is worrisome just because of Cable alone, hut they still should be improved. TE is the only spot without sure fire talent, but that should be masked with the huge improvement at WR. If Jacobs can be what he was drafted to be that takes pressure off Carr and makes the OLs job easier in pass protection. The last time he had an offense this talented he was an MVP candidate. I expect him to get back to being closer to that guy again..

It's obviously still very early and there can be further additions but at this moment in time there are still a few big question marks on offence if we're going to say this is a make or break year for Carr (not that everyone is saying that).

TE is a huge ? and looks really, really weak to me
Miller is still a huge doubt at potentially LT
Good played well in relief last year but again he's not a sure thing at G for me 
I'm not totally convinced by Williams, Nelson or Grant at WR though AB is obviously a class player and I like Renfrow
Rookie RB has potential and should produce pretty well but it's certainly not a given as he is a rookie

I know some people will probably think I'm already making excuses for Carr but I think these are legitimate concerns for me if we're expecting a 2016 like season. 

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4
18 hours ago, Darbsk said:

It's obviously still very early and there can be further additions but at this moment in time there are still a few big question marks on offence if we're going to say this is a make or break year for Carr (not that everyone is saying that).

TE is a huge ? and looks really, really weak to me
Miller is still a huge doubt at potentially LT
Good played well in relief last year but again he's not a sure thing at G for me 
I'm not totally convinced by Williams, Nelson or Grant at WR though AB is obviously a class player and I like Renfrow
Rookie RB has potential and should produce pretty well but it's certainly not a given as he is a rookie

I know some people will probably think I'm already making excuses for Carr but I think these are legitimate concerns for me if we're expecting a 2016 like season. 

Playing devil's advocate here:

It could be a lot worse. Moreau is not a bad prospect by any means. Waller has flashed tantalizing athleticism so it's not like there's nothing to work with. Neither guy would be expected to be much more than a #3/4 option either so no biggie either way.

Miller played fine as a rookie until he hurt his knee. He also got a fair bit bigger and it's not like we would dump him after 1 year in the AFC West. This is a wait and see.

Good I agree, but Incognito will probably end up signed at some point and off-field aside (which is a big red flag), purely on field he's been a top guard in the league consistently.

Tyrell Williams was a huge get. I'll argue that to the death with anyone. 

Considering how rookie RB's have produced, it comes down to liking Jacobs or not.  You can almost go so far as to argue that he'll have a bigger impact as a pass catcher than as a runner as a rookie.

 

There are some legit concerns, but if you compare the overall O:

OL: 2016, but with the potential to be better (we never really had solid RT play that year, if Miller, Incognito, Hud, Gabe, and Trent put it together it could be awesome)

WR: 2019 (AB>>>, Tyrell Williams~Crab, anyone>Roberts)

TE: Push, walford wasn't exactly a star.

RB: 2019. I didn't like Murray then (post his rookie year) and I don't like him now. Jacobs I LOVED coming out and you can argue that he's better in every facet compared to Murray except long speed.

2016 is clearly safer. But 2019's O has some serious potential. Granted it may take time to click, but I'm very optimistic.

 

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IF Richie is really in good shape mentally and play wise this OL could be solid DESPITE Cable!!

That interior could keep Carr relatively clean and could open up holes for Jacobs&Co.

 

On another note I think the Jacobs&Richard 2 RB sets should be fun. Both can run routes well, both can catch well and both can run too. 

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19 hours ago, Rolni said:

IF Richie is really in good shape mentally and play wise this OL could be solid DESPITE Cable!!

That interior could keep Carr relatively clean and could open up holes for Jacobs&Co.

 

On another note I think the Jacobs&Richard 2 RB sets should be fun. Both can run routes well, both can catch well and both can run too. 

We talk about surrounding Carr with talent so he can succeed but I think this is the most talent Cable has ever had to work with.  If he can not make this work then he needs to go.  If Gruden can not see that then Davis should throw them out together.

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2 hours ago, drfrey13 said:

We talk about surrounding Carr with talent so he can succeed but I think this is the most talent Cable has ever had to work with.  If he can not make this work then he needs to go.  If Gruden can not see that then Davis should throw them out together.

Yeah Cable is working with his most talented group so far IMO too. However I think he did nothing last year to stick around, so the decision from Gruden to bring him back is questionable at least. With that said he is still here, so let's hope :)

This list won't gives us too much hope tho...pass protection rankings:

Elite OL coach Tom Cable's year-by-year unit rankings in this metric:
2018: 25th
2017: 31st
2016: 26th
2015: 30th
2014: 24th
2013: 32nd
2012: 20th
2011: 24th
2010: 26th
2009: 31st
Elite consistency.

After this list with his best group to work with I would be surprised if we finish better then 20. Then the question is whether you are alright with a below average ranking from a unit, where you have a TOP 15 selection LT, the best paid OT, one of the best paid OC's and another well paid OG...I say no...

What we need to see from the OL to keep Cable? I mean from a fan and anti Cable perspective?

 

TOP 10 run blocking and TOP 15 pass protection would be the line for me. If the unit can get there, I won't care about the Cable man anymore...anything below those marks and I want his head again

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Middlekauff (who is not a Raiders homer) think our O has the potential to be really good.
https://theathletic.com/1153576/2019/08/22/middlekauff-with-antonio-brown-drama-mostly-over-the-pressure-on-the-raiders-expensive-offense-really-begins/?source=dailyemail

He sees some blue chip guys and some impact starters on paper, he likes our WR and RB groups and think Carr and the OL can have a good year.

 

Carr and the OL are the questions and they walk hand in hand IMO.

With that said Carr needs to really show up this year or he could lose his job not just the Cable guy...

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