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2020 Draft Prospects


Bobby816

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20 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Trust me I totally get what you’re saying. And it agitates me to no end we’ve avoided the offense period with quality picks in the draft (not just OL). Our offense has been embarrassing for countless years bc if this. Even when we were good... we won with defense, not with offense. So it’s been decades since we’ve had an offense that is scary.

 

My point is we have 65mill in cap space next year before the cap is raised and we make cuts. So you’re looking at more like 75mill in space with the obvious hole being OL. Our GM loves valuing OL and it’s very obvious that will be the focus of the team. So its not unlikely we fill those needs in FA. Making it to where we can go BA talent at a position of need in the draft. My point being purely on talent Jeudy and Lamb are better than every OLineman in this class (Thomas can be debated). So if we added 3 OLineman in FA and one of those WRs is there for us at 11. It makes sense to draft one of them more so than an OLineman at that point. What good is it to protect Darnold for him to throw to Berrios, Smith and Crowder?

I know we are both on the same page.  Costanzo and Humphries are the only two LT that would be an upgrade to Beachum and both will most likely resign or be tagged.  I just do not want to keep kicking this can down the road and tie up all that salary cap in older OL that will probably not live up to their contracts.  I also think Vaitai is not an upgrade to Shell or Edoga.  Scherf or Thuney - absolutely.  Not sure about FA Centers - McGovern maybe?

 

This is a good class for OT but I feel more will be selected in round 1 than all these mock drafts are predicting.  Teams are realizing a strong OL is paramount to winning.  I do not want to be left with Beachum as our starter because we missed on a player.  I think any second round OT will not be starting material.  That said, I also believe JD will be able to identify OL better than our previous regime.

 

It is also a decent class for WR and I think a couple will fall to us in rd. 2.  Ruggs, Jefferson, Higgins may all be there.  Couple that withe maybe Perriman, Cobb, Demarcus Robinson, etc. and I think our WR corp will be good, not great, but good.

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1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

Group 1 for me.

I also find it odd that they left out Round 2 in this debate.

Michael Thomas, Sterling Shepard, Tyler Boyd, JuJu Smith-Shuster, AJ Brown, DK Metcalf.

 

And like I've stated you can say this about any position group. I'm sure the list of 3rd Round OLIneman that have been successful are right in line with this of WRs. We've just never been a team that finds good talent in mid rounds. Period.

Because 2nd round group is less of debate. I'm easily siding with the 3rd round group in this one. I'd argue DJ Moore is the best out of the round 1, yet I'd definitely rank Godwin and Golladay over him, and even consider Kupp and Gallup as well. Diontae Johnson and Terry McLaurin are going to be fantastic players too. 

As far as OL, not so sure... too early to compare the 2019 class, but for me, it's clear that there has been a bigger talent drop off among OL than there is WR 

Round 1 

  • 2016: Ronnie Stanley 
  • 2016: Jack Conklin
  • 2016: Laremy Tunsil
  • 2016: Taylor Decker 
  • 2016: Ryan Kelly
  • 2016: Joshua Garnett 
  • 2016: Germain Ifedi 
  • 2017: Garrett Bolles 
  • 2017: Ryan Ramczyk
  • 2018: Quenton Nelson 
  • 2018: Mike McGlinchey
  • 2018: Kolton Miller
  • 2018: Frank Ragnow
  • 2018: Billy Price
  • 2018: Isaiah Wynn
  •  

Round 3

  • 2016: Max Tuerk
  • 2016: Shon Coleman
  • 2016: Joe Thuney
  • 2016: Isaac Seumalo 
  • 2016: La'Raven Clark
  • 2016: Graham Glasgow 
  • 2016: Rees Odhiambo
  • 2017: Pat Elfin
  • 2017: Dan Feeney 
  • 2017: Antonio Garcia
  • 2018: Brandon Parker
  • 2018: Geron Christian 
  • 2018: Orlando Brown 
  • 2018: Joseph Noteboom
  • 2018: Chukwuma Okorafor
  • 2018: Alex Cappa 
  • 2018: Mason Cole
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3 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

Because 2nd round group is less of debate. I'm easily siding with the 3rd round group in this one. I'd argue DJ Moore is the best out of the round 1, yet I'd definitely rank Godwin and Golladay over him, and even consider Kupp and Gallup as well. Diontae Johnson and Terry McLaurin are going to be fantastic players too. 

As far as OL, not so sure... too early to compare the 2019 class, but for me, it's clear that there has been a bigger talent drop off among OL than there is WR 

Round 1 

  • 2016: Ronnie Stanley 
  • 2016: Jack Conklin
  • 2016: Laremy Tunsil
  • 2016: Taylor Decker 
  • 2016: Ryan Kelly
  • 2016: Joshua Garnett 
  • 2016: Germain Ifedi 
  • 2017: Garrett Bolles 
  • 2017: Ryan Ramczyk
  • 2018: Quenton Nelson 
  • 2018: Mike McGlinchey
  • 2018: Kolton Miller
  • 2018: Frank Ragnow
  • 2018: Billy Price
  • 2018: Isaiah Wynn
  •  

Round 3

  • 2016: Max Tuerk
  • 2016: Shon Coleman
  • 2016: Joe Thuney
  • 2016: Isaac Seumalo 
  • 2016: La'Raven Clark
  • 2016: Graham Glasgow 
  • 2016: Rees Odhiambo
  • 2017: Pat Elfin
  • 2017: Dan Feeney 
  • 2017: Antonio Garcia
  • 2018: Brandon Parker
  • 2018: Geron Christian 
  • 2018: Orlando Brown 
  • 2018: Joseph Noteboom
  • 2018: Chukwuma Okorafor
  • 2018: Alex Cappa 
  • 2018: Mason Cole

I hear what you're saying and this class is highly talented at WR (I think Jeudy and Lamb with be superstars not just stars) and deep but lets look at just for comparison the last great draft class at WR in 2014. Which was a highly talented group and considered deep as well.

1st Round: Sammy Watkins, Mike Evans, Odell Beckham Jr, Brandon Cooks, Kelvin Benjamin

3rd Round: Josh Huff, Donte Moncrief, John Brown, Dri Archer

 

See the difference?!?!

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1 hour ago, Bobby816 said:

I hear what you're saying and this class is highly talented at WR (I think Jeudy and Lamb with be superstars not just stars) and deep but lets look at just for comparison the last great draft class at WR in 2014. Which was a highly talented group and considered deep as well.

1st Round: Sammy Watkins, Mike Evans, Odell Beckham Jr, Brandon Cooks, Kelvin Benjamin

3rd Round: Josh Huff, Donte Moncrief, John Brown, Dri Archer

 

See the difference?!?!

It’s easily to pick one class and use it to fit the narrative you seek. Throughout the history of the game, there is a severe talent deficiency at premium positions (QB/LT/DE), which is why you see most of the starters around the league come off the board in round 1- it’s hard to find those players later in the draft, whereas there is historically much more depth at others. I’m all for taking the BPA at positions which are historically less valuable - including WR - but not for the sake of getting a flashy player that’s fun to use on madden or has fantasy football appeal... history shows there is far less of a drop off at the skill positions from day 1 to 2 than there is at the premium ones

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28 minutes ago, jetskid007 said:

It’s easily to pick one class and use it to fit the narrative you seek. Throughout the history of the game, there is a severe talent deficiency at premium positions (QB/LT/DE), which is why you see most of the starters around the league come off the board in round 1- it’s hard to find those players later in the draft, whereas there is historically much more depth at others. I’m all for taking the BPA at positions which are historically less valuable - including WR - but not for the sake of getting a flashy player that’s fun to use on madden or has fantasy football appeal... history shows there is far less of a drop off at the skill positions from day 1 to 2 than there is at the premium ones

I didn't just choose any WR class. This WR class is compared to that class all the time.

When has this team been good without good WRs? Late 90s? Keyshawn and Chrebet, Late 2000's? Braylon and Holmes.

I'm by no means saying draft Jeudy or Lamb just to draft them. If you've noticed I've only brought them up with saying before hand that we should only target them if we address OL in FA. Bc I do believe that OL should be the main focus of the offseason. But I do think WR is hands down the 2nd biggest need (Yes more so than Edge or CB). Meaning that unless Chase Young falls (wont happen)... You cant convince me that any player grades out as high of that of Jeudy or Lamb. And from a pure talent perspective Thomas is really the only OLineman that might rate as high as either of them. In essence what I'm saying for us my big board for us before FA is this...

1. Chase Young (I see no way at all he falls to 11)

2. Andrew Thomas

3. Jerry Jeudy

4. CeeDee Lamb

5. Tristan Wirfs

5. Jedrick Wills

 

I'm pretty much saying that there's no way I can be convinced that guys like Okudah, Espensa, Henderson, Fulton, Gross-Matos would be a good pick for us.

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35 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

I didn't just choose any WR class. This WR class is compared to that class all the time.

When has this team been good without good WRs? Late 90s? Keyshawn and Chrebet, Late 2000's? Braylon and Holmes.

I'm by no means saying draft Jeudy or Lamb just to draft them. If you've noticed I've only brought them up with saying before hand that we should only target them if we address OL in FA. Bc I do believe that OL should be the main focus of the offseason. But I do think WR is hands down the 2nd biggest need (Yes more so than Edge or CB). Meaning that unless Chase Young falls (wont happen)... You cant convince me that any player grades out as high of that of Jeudy or Lamb. And from a pure talent perspective Thomas is really the only OLineman that might rate as high as either of them. In essence what I'm saying for us my big board for us before FA is this...

1. Chase Young (I see no way at all he falls to 11)

2. Andrew Thomas

3. Jerry Jeudy

4. CeeDee Lamb

5. Tristan Wirfs

5. Jedrick Wills

 

I'm pretty much saying that there's no way I can be convinced that guys like Okudah, Espensa, Henderson, Fulton, Gross-Matos would be a good pick for us.

I'm with you...unless Andrew Thomas falls I think JJ and Lamb are guaranteed superstars.  More like the Larry Fitz type than the Odell type. I'd rather have one of them than a solid LT/RT.  Part of the reason Watson can be so magical is Hopkins.  Matt Ryan continues to put up monster numbers with Julio. Even with the OL and run game Sanchez needed WRs to throw to.  You can make the argument Brady has a good OL and no one to throw to.  At the moment we have a chance to fill some holes in FA and take a shot at a franchise player.

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Notable guys returning who we could have targeted and will make it harder for good players to fall to us in mid rounds are...

OT: Alex Leatherwood

OT: Walker Little

WR: DeVonta Smith

OT: Alaric Jackson

OG: Wyatt Davis

OT: Samuel Cosmi

WR: Tylan Wallace

Edge: Quincy Roche

Edge: Hamilcar Rashed

Edge: Carlos Basham Jr.

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7 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Notable guys returning who we could have targeted and will make it harder for good players to fall to us in mid rounds are...

OT: Alex Leatherwood

OT: Walker Little

WR: DeVonta Smith

OT: Alaric Jackson

OG: Wyatt Davis

OT: Samuel Cosmi

WR: Tylan Wallace

Edge: Quincy Roche

Edge: Hamilcar Rashed

Edge: Carlos Basham Jr.

Still a while before decisions are official, but somewhat concerned that Wirfs and Jackson still haven't declared. I think one will stay (Jackson) and one will declare (Wirfs). Apparently both are very torn, but I'm not sure Wirfs will get all that much by returning, whereas Jackson can potentially become a top 10 player if he makes the necessary adjustments to his game, hence my predictions. 

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On 1/8/2020 at 7:43 AM, Bobby816 said:

Notable guys returning who we could have targeted and will make it harder for good players to fall to us in mid rounds are...

OT: Alex Leatherwood

OT: Walker Little

WR: DeVonta Smith

OT: Alaric Jackson

OG: Wyatt Davis

OT: Samuel Cosmi

WR: Tylan Wallace

Edge: Quincy Roche

Edge: Hamilcar Rashed

Edge: Carlos Basham Jr.

A little upsetting, I figure, Thomas, Wirfs and Willis would be gone but I was hoping for Leatherwood. He had to grade out as a first round pick so not sure why he went back. I also had Jackson and Smith as possible 3rd round picks and Basham as a 3rd or 4th

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Let's say we get 2 good OLineman in FA and then draft one at 11. What's everyone's thoughts about trading our 2nd and 1 of our 3rds (probably the Giants) for a falling WR in the draft that's a legit 1st round talent that would in most drafts for sure be a top 20 pick? Remember we don't pick until the 16th (48th overall) pick in Round 2. So the odds of these potential star WRs making it to us are slim.

 

I see Jeudy, Lamb and Ruggs all going top 20. Guys that are worth trading up for that more than likely wont make it to us are...

Tee Higgins

Laviska Shenault

Justin Jefferson

 

Something to think about. Bc we still have a 3rd. So we really don't lose much pick wise. We just upgrade that "2nd round pick" to a 1st rounder with a potential #1 WR all while still upgrading the OL. Where as if we sit and wait to see what happens at our pick... there's a significant talent drop off after those 6 guys IMO.

 

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10 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Best C that was thought to declare Creed Humphreys is returning to OU weakening the Cs in the draft. Still some decent mid round guys though

If we're not able to sign a center, I'm willing to bet we're picking one in the 2nd round. 

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43 minutes ago, rickyt31 said:

If we're not able to sign a center, I'm willing to bet we're picking one in the 2nd round. 

Well the issue becomes if a C is worth that draft spot. Biadasz will be gone by then. So the next best available Cs are... Daryl Williams and Lloyd Cushenberry. At 48 it’s a bit of a reach drafting one of them. But not a huge reach. Most have them ranked around 50-60ish. I would be in favor of drafting one of them imo. But depends who has fallen from round 1.

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5 hours ago, Bobby816 said:

Well the issue becomes if a C is worth that draft spot. Biadasz will be gone by then. So the next best available Cs are... Daryl Williams and Lloyd Cushenberry. At 48 it’s a bit of a reach drafting one of them. But not a huge reach. Most have them ranked around 50-60ish. I would be in favor of drafting one of them imo. But depends who has fallen from round 1.

I see what you're saying but we'll be in the position where we will need the center that has the best chance of starting at this point because we missed in free agency. So unless they feel like all the centers in the 2-4 round range are the same talent-wise, they'll have to get their guy pretty early. 

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