NYRaider Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, NightTrainLane said: Expand you mind past what is to what is possible. Simmons isn't the normal WLB. And one pick isn't "that much draft capitol" for the return we'd get. You said we'd give up #80 and #91. So you'd be giving up 3 potential starters for Simmons. I understand Simmons is versatile, has sideline to sideline range, can cover TE/RB. We have pieces like that in place in the middle of our defense now. We've invested like $20M in free agency into two 3 down LB's and a safety and just invested a first round pick into a safety in 2019. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightTrainLane Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 (edited) 18 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Injuries can happen at any position group. Should we draft another QB in case Carr/Mariota both get hurt? Or a first round OT in case Miller/Brown both get hurt? You've said the same about Simmons, that we should draft him in case Littleton and Abram get hurt. Still not getting it. Simmons is different. Edited April 20, 2020 by NightTrainLane Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, NightTrainLane said: Still no getting it. Simmons is different. I like Simmons. I just don't think he improves our defense enough to justify giving up three top 100 picks to go get him. We'll get similar value from Littleton and Abram. Edited April 20, 2020 by NYRaider Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightTrainLane Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, NYRaider said: You said we'd give up #80 and #91. So you'd be giving up 3 potential starters for Simmons. I understand Simmons is versatile, has sideline to sideline range, can cover TE/RB. We have pieces like that in place in the middle of our defense now. We've invested like $20M in free agency into two 3 down LB's and a safety and just invested a first round pick into a safety in 2019. Yes I did and I also said we wouldn't need that much to move up 4 or 5 picks, 12 to 7 or 8. If we had to go up to 4 or 5 then you'd need more but that isn't what I was saying here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 12 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said: I could careless about only looking at SuperBowl winning QBs wonderlics. The sample size is too small. Average starting QB scores Or the scores of QBs who successful in the league (pick your metric) is way better of a indicator. Further, the average isn’t the number I’d be looking for... I’d want to know the interquartile range, L1 specifically, to see what the theshold for success is. all the wonderlic should be used for is to check to see if the player is so stupid it would inhibit his ability to play the position. It’s a pass/fail test to me. and just because Love scored 27 doesn’t mean he can learn to read defenses it just means he’s got enough intelligence that he’s capable of it. the wonderlic is a test that with practice and training a person can really jump their score. Idk how people score very low on it, they must not have put any training in for the test. I’m sure guys with millions on the line are taking it as serious as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NightTrainLane Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: I like Simmons. I just don't think he improves our defense enough to justify giving up three top 100 picks to go get him. We'll get similar value from Littleton and Abram. And I think he will add an incredible amount of versatility and value if we can move up 4 or 5 picks and still keep 3 of our top 100 picks where we could still get a corner and WR/s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 I want to keep all of our 3rd Rounds Picks. Let’s say one of my favorites fall at safety being Terrell Burgess or Ashtyn Davis. Future Starter. Jordan Elliott at DT. Probably future starter. Then you can also get a starter at OG or Nickel CB. Not to mention the Jalen Hurts wildcard as well. 80-81-91 should be a lot of fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimkelly02 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 3 minutes ago, BayRaider said: I’m sure guys with millions on the line are taking it as serious as possible. Yet Tua/Hurts scores 18/19, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Just now, jimkelly02 said: Yet Tua/Hurts scores 18/19, lol. You can take it seriously and still do bad. Which is why it’s a concern. It’s a timed test. Some peoples brains just don’t work as fast as others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drfrey13 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 2 hours ago, jimkelly02 said: No one ever talks about the value of drafting a player at a position it would either cost a high amount of money to sign in FA or the savings of replacing a veteran on the roster. That’s why slot CB is one of my least valued draft positions. They’re always (and still are some in FA) plentiful and cheap in FA. I value the position to the appropriate degree but if I’m picking at 80, for instance, and i can get equally rated players... both guys will be solid starters by year 2, then I’m taking a WR (or LT) over a slot CB (or RB) every time. I’m theoretically getting a $10M WR (Or $12M LT) for $2M and can sign my choice of slot CB for $3-5M (or RB for $2-6M). We all believe in drafting BPA over need is the key to success. Every team has limited resources ( salary cap space and draft picks). It’s important to fill your roster with as many quality draft picks (on cheap rookie deals) at positions that command top dollar in FA as possible. Then you can fill in the cheaper positions (RB, slot CB, S, etc) with free agents on low cost deals. Now i’m not saying don’t draft slot CB, RB, S. What im saying is if you have equal quality of players and believe they both will have equal quality careers it’s better to take the one that at more expensive position to fill in FA. I definitely understand and agree. Opportunity cost is a phrase I have not heard much since I graduated college. Just another perspective of the same problems but gives you more ways to find value. Good job my friend. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 Trying to do a mock for Draft Day, TB is a rough selection if all 4 OTs are gone. You either got a huge reach on Josh Jones, or a super surprise pick like Winfield Jr who is rumored to be a 1st Round selection. TB had the #5 defense according to DVOA but one of the worst safety units in the league. Could be a Top 3 D with a Safety. No one is going to wanna trade with them either. 14 is the worst spot in the draft. Reminds me of the Raiders Picking 14 in 2016. Horrid spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimkelly02 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 2 minutes ago, BayRaider said: You can take it seriously and still do bad. Which is why it’s a concern. It’s a timed test. Some peoples brains just don’t work as fast as others. Are they not smart enough to realize they should answer all b’s or c’s for the last 30ish questions they haven’t gotten to? I mean statiscally your likely to at least get 7-9 points just by doing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimkelly02 Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 4 minutes ago, BayRaider said: Trying to do a mock for Draft Day, TB is a rough selection if all 4 OTs are gone. You either got a huge reach on Josh Jones, or a super surprise pick like Winfield Jr who is rumored to be a 1st Round selection. TB had the #5 defense according to DVOA but one of the worst safety units in the league. Could be a Top 3 D with a Safety. No one is going to wanna trade with them either. 14 is the worst spot in the draft. Reminds me of the Raiders Picking 14 in 2016. Horrid spot. Austin Jackson is pretty underrated imo. He’s a reach but so is everyone else. He’s like 20yo and has high upside. no one (besides us) would take a 5’9 flat S in the top 15. I think they go Delpit before taking a guy like Winfield. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 4 minutes ago, BayRaider said: Trying to do a mock for Draft Day, TB is a rough selection if all 4 OTs are gone. You either got a huge reach on Josh Jones, or a super surprise pick like Winfield Jr who is rumored to be a 1st Round selection. TB had the #5 defense according to DVOA but one of the worst safety units in the league. Could be a Top 3 D with a Safety. No one is going to wanna trade with them either. 14 is the worst spot in the draft. Reminds me of the Raiders Picking 14 in 2016. Horrid spot. A lot of rumors that Jacksonville wants to move out of the 9th spot. They could get that done relatively cheap and move ahead of Cleveland and NY to get their OT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 20, 2020 Share Posted April 20, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said: Austin Jackson is pretty underrated imo. He’s a reach but so is everyone else. He’s like 20yo and has high upside. no one (besides us) would take a 5’9 flat S in the top 15. I think they go Delpit before taking a guy like Winfield. If I'm the Chargers I'm praying for Tua to fall to #6 and then I'd move back up into the first to get Jackson. As a left handed QB there wouldn't be as much pressure on Jackson early on with Turner/Bulaga protecting his blind side. Edited April 20, 2020 by NYRaider 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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