Official 2020 OT/IOL Thread

[goldfishwars]

Kindley is good, want to watch some more. Didn't dislike John Simpson either if huge road graders are your thing. He's really not bad. 

[YogiBiz]

14 hours ago, Ozzy said:

You really like Ruiz that much?  You consider him a 1st rounder?  I never saw him and thought wow he is a 1st rounder or something.  Ok center, not sure he is anything great and no way I would take him over Biadasz.  Depending on the system the movement skills are not always the best thing, look at Bradbury this year, super athletic center in the draft, had a great combine but at times really struggled this year with power.  Did not matter how athletic he was when you are getting pushed around physically.  

Cushenberry I think has some good OG potential but at C he looked pretty bad at that title game in pass pro a few times.  But as a OG he could be something maybe as a mid round pick.

 

I need to watch Keith Ismael more, hard to get a handle on him because the competition level is pretty weak.  

I do like Ruiz. He played at an elite level all season. My biggest thing with him as a sophomore was his pad level. Otherwise he was technically refined enough to start in the NFL as a 19 year old. Well this season he made huge strides in the staying low department, and not adding extra steps to his initial step. 
 

also I agree that Cushenberry would better at OG to start his career, but that would just be to gain more experience. He’s just so new to the sport and with so few starts idk how to grade his inconsistencies with handling OC responsibilities (ie control the line of scrimmage and be able to read rushes) he also takes bad angles not a lot but enough to warrant you to say we need to coach this guy up. I think he will be a very good center. Even without Creed, I am excited for this OL class. 

Edited January 18, 2020 by YogiBiz

[Duffman57]

17 hours ago, Ozzy said:

I watched that little clip up, sure on paper sounds impressive but reality that Clemson DL was not very good this year.  Most of their pressure on the QB this year was blitzing LBs and the coverage behind them and the variety of stuff they do and how they try to confuse the OL. Clearly lost all four starters off last years team 3 went in the 1st round.  If he would have looked like this against Ferrell then maybe you got something, but he did this against #7 and #34 most of the time on Clemson.  I honestly have no clue who either one is and had to look up their names, they are young players on a young D that got pushed around at times.  He did not go up against the best DL on the team Thomas all game I believe, and even he did not have that great of year this season either.  

It was cool watching him push a few dudes down and get them to the ground, good physical play but need to see it against some real competition however.  So what made you watch this guy and or this tape?  

It was a tweet from either Brandon Thorn or Duke Manyweather (I’m a big fan of both, though there’s times where I question Duke a bit because he has a client base, so I can’t tell if they’re his guys or he really thinks they’re great players). They showed a clip of it and I wanted more. Also for whatever it’s worth Duke recently compared Clark’s movement skills to Terron Armstead. I’m not sure about that but I get what he’s saying. Not that I think he’s going to run a 4.6 but the way they move on film looks similar. But I did a deep dive into him and have watched probably 3-4 more games, including vs Memphis in their bowl. Realistically he’s not going to have a crazy high level of competition but the reality is that he dominated his level of play, and shows skills that are very translatable. He did all he could to show that he’s a legit player and has been pretty dominant in what I’ve seen of him so far in the shrine game. Guy seems to just get it done, and I love that kind of player. 

[MagicMT]

21 hours ago, YogiBiz said:

Cesar Ruiz is the best OC in this class. Watch him, he has those movement skills you love and he's just strong, mean guy in the middle. My top five goes:

1. Cesar Ruiz - Rare blend of size and mobility. Is technically sound, and now that he isn't "wasting" steps on the snap he fires off the ball very well.

2. Tyler Biadasz - This guy just isn't the same athlete as Ruiz, but he is gonna be very good center for a long time. He's just not as scheme versatile as Ruiz is imo. 

3. Nick Harris - Scheme specific, but in the right scheme will be special. 

4. Lloyd Cushenberry - Super raw (when was the last Center prospect with so few starts) another big guy who has plus athleticism. If he gets with the right coach he could be the best in the class or the past few classes. The biggest issue I have with him, is that he is too new to the sport and he wasn't the leader of the LSU line. Will have to start at OG to gain more experience, but he will be your teams starting center by the end of his rookie contract. 

5. Matt Hennessy - Solid in every area, just needs to add more functional strength, will be a starter by the end of his second year. 

That would be my exact top 5 as well, except flip Hennessy and Cushenberry. 
I don't know how Ruiz isn't viewed as the best C of this class. That guy is a top 25 prospect for me and I would definitely take him in the first round. 
Very athletic center that doesn't get beat often in pass pro and is very good in the running game as well, opening huge holes for his RB. 
I'd have Biadasz just a tad bit below Ruiz but would draft him in the 1st round too.  
This is shaping up to be a good class for centers

[.Buzz]

It seems like Becton is going to continue to raise on boards. Brugler and Jeremiah seem to think he'll go top 10.

I know there's been some discussions but where do you guys see him fitting in with the Thomas/Wirf/Wills tier? 

[Scoundrel]

4 minutes ago, .Buzz said:

It seems like Becton is going to continue to raise on boards. Brugler and Jeremiah seem to think he'll go top 10.

I know there's been some discussions but where do you guys see him fitting in with the Thomas/Wirf/Wills tier? 

Fourth after those three

[goldfishwars]

 

[jrry32]

On 1/15/2020 at 8:37 PM, jrry32 said:

Is it just me or does this seem like it could be the 2017 TE Draft of Centers (basically, one of the best classes ever in terms of depth and talent)? Thus far, here are the guys I've watched (in order):

1. Tyler Biadasz - I think he'll be a Pro Bowl Center

2. Nick Harris - Could be a quality Center in the right scheme.

3. Darryl Williams - Very solid player with C/OG versatility

4. Jake Hanson - Solid but unspectacular C.

These guys I plan to watch soon are Cesar Ruiz, Matt Hennessy, Lloyd Cushenberry, Keith Ismael, and Cohl Cabral. What blows me away, though, is that the four Centers I've already watched would make a good top 4 in most Center classes. Yet, it's very possible (based on what I've seen around the web and on here) that multiple guys I've yet to watch could end up being better than all four or at least two or three of the four. That's an insanely deep and talented Center class (if it's true).

Okay, after watching other prospects, here's how I'd rank the top 5:

1. Tyler Biadasz

2. Matt Hennessy

3. Cesar Ruiz

4. Lloyd Cushenberry

5. Nick Harris

Although, I will note that I think Harris is the better Center today than Cushenberry in a ZBS. Cushenberry should probably start his career at OG.

[Scoundrel]

2 hours ago, jrry32 said:

Okay, after watching other prospects, here's how I'd rank the top 5:

1. Tyler Biadasz

2. Matt Hennessy

3. Cesar Ruiz

4. Lloyd Cushenberry

5. Nick Harris

Although, I will note that I think Harris is the better Center today than Cushenberry in a ZBS. Cushenberry should probably start his career at OG.

What do you like about Hennessy’s game?

[jrry32]

37 minutes ago, Counselor said:

What do you like about Hennessy’s game?

All of it but his bulk and strength lol. Phenomenal athlete, smart player, technician, grip strength (sustains blocks), etc. Put that kid in a zone scheme, bulk him up a bit, and I think he's a Pro Bowl Center. He's the only guy in this class who has movement skills on par with Nick Harris', but Hennessy doesn't have the length issues that Harris does. 

[Scoundrel]

4 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

All of it but his bulk and strength lol. Phenomenal athlete, smart player, technician, grip strength (sustains blocks), etc. Put that kid in a zone scheme, bulk him up a bit, and I think he's a Pro Bowl Center. He's the only guy in this class who has movement skills on par with Nick Harris', but Hennessy doesn't have the length issues that Harris does. 

I really liked Hennessy as well when I scouted him

[jrry32]

10 minutes ago, Counselor said:

I really liked Hennessy as well when I scouted him

For me, I see the Center as the QB of the OL. That's one of the reasons I put him over Ruiz. I think Ruiz has more potential because of how big and athletic he is, but I felt Michigan's OL didn't play as well as a unit as they could have. I noticed a surprising number of protection mistakes from the OL. Maybe it's Patterson's fault, but without knowing more, that hurt Ruiz in my eyes. Temple's OL, on the other hand, functioned quite well as a unit and did not make many mistakes in the games I watched.

I also think Hennessy is a better technician and bends easier than Ruiz at this point in time. Of course, Hennessy has to add some weight and get stronger, whereas Ruiz is already a large man (although, I was a bit underwhelmed by his power at the POA; he didn't move people like I expected he would). Overall, this is a stacked Center class, though.

[YogiBiz]

On 1/18/2020 at 1:28 PM, Counselor said:

Fourth after those three

I honestly think he's fighting for that top spot. He's as technically sound as Wills, moves better than all three, and he is still at least 40 pounds heavier. 

On top of being just all around heavier, his weight is distributed as well as Thomas and Wirfs. He was playing in the 360's this year, but he definitely doesn't look as tired and out of shape as you would expect someone of his size to be. What is his biggest weakness? He is better in pass protection than Thomas, and bigger and stronger than Wirfs. While being just as mobile as the both. If he can get a tad more consistent on his punch he will absolutely dominate. 

[YogiBiz]

On 1/19/2020 at 12:42 AM, jrry32 said:

For me, I see the Center as the QB of the OL. That's one of the reasons I put him over Ruiz. I think Ruiz has more potential because of how big and athletic he is, but I felt Michigan's OL didn't play as well as a unit as they could have. I noticed a surprising number of protection mistakes from the OL. Maybe it's Patterson's fault, but without knowing more, that hurt Ruiz in my eyes. Temple's OL, on the other hand, functioned quite well as a unit and did not make many mistakes in the games I watched.

I can definitely see why this would be a knock on Ruiz, but I have long felt Michigan has had a lackluster O-Line coaching staff as they always seem to always vastly under perform in that department. 

On 1/19/2020 at 12:42 AM, jrry32 said:

I also think Hennessy is a better technician and bends easier than Ruiz at this point in time. Of course, Hennessy has to add some weight and get stronger, whereas Ruiz is already a large man (although, I was a bit underwhelmed by his power at the POA; he didn't move people like I expected he would). Overall, this is a stacked Center class, though.

I see the bends easier, but the technician part is a toss up at this point in there careers. I think Ruiz has excellent hand usage, and is much improved in getting into his set than he was his Junior year. At best, I would call the technique a wash. 

[YogiBiz]

On 1/18/2020 at 1:24 PM, .Buzz said:

It seems like Becton is going to continue to raise on boards. Brugler and Jeremiah seem to think he'll go top 10.

I know there's been some discussions but where do you guys see him fitting in with the Thomas/Wirf/Wills tier? 

I have him ranked in my top 10, and I think he's gonna be the best LT in this class.