Official 2020 QB Thread

[Chargers]

4 hours ago, Daniel said:

Yeah, I'm not feeling the Eason love either.  I'd be cool taking him bottom of the first or early second, but no sooner.

You guys need a stability at OC before you take a rookie. It's been what 3 OC in 3 years? I bet all my money Titans stay part QB after this year with Tannehill, who I think we'll play well to end the season.

[Tetsujin]

Have we discussed Kellen Mond yet? He seems like a big wildcard in either the 20' or 21' draft that nobody's mentioning.

[HoboRocket]

Who are your top QBs for the 2019 draft? What's your order?

Well, I've gone back and watched hours of tape on each of the top QB prospects this week, trying to sort that very question out. I'd venture at this point to say:

1. Tua Tagovailo'a: Tua just isn't doing enough wrong to push himself down to the level of the other guys, even with the injury. It's not making the other guys look good as it's making him look less good. You understand me? Like, it's like the injury concerns have left the door open for another QB to seize the top spot, but they're all doing their darn-dest to make him stay #1. He has mobility (maybe. I mean, it IS an ankle injury), but the things that really make him special are his accuracy and ability to find the right read. Of course, there's a big talent disparity that makes it harder to evaluate him, especially receivers are running with like ten yards of cushion, but that's just the way of the game unless you're playing at a program like Wyoming, and then people will tear down the prospect for not putting up the same numbers as everyone else (ahem ahem Josh Allen cough). He can throw rainbows downfield and he's an aggressive passer. 

2. Jacob Eason?: MAYBE Eason. Look. There's a lot to question. Has he consistently produced in college? Does he have enough of a pedigree? Is his personality right? Here's what I WILL say: Physically, this guy is probably the most physically-talented QB in the 2020 NFL Draft if he declares. He has an arm that can make any throw, and, on top of that, he's accurate. He throws one of the prettiest footballs that you'll see. He doesn't hesitate to attack defenses downfield. Also, if you follow Washington AT ALL, or even the Pac-12 in general, they easily have one of the worst receiving groups in Power-5 college football, yet Eason is still 2nd in the Pac-12 in yards per attempt. The Huskies are currently producing the second-most 30-plus yard completions under head coach Chris Peterson, behind only the 2016 team that featured both John Ross and Dante Pettis. Again, this is with one of the worst WR corps in college. Watch their games, and the WRs just haven't been able to get open consistently this season. If you look at the loss to Stanford, Aaron Fuller, the team's #1 WR, had three drops, and their starting tight end had at least two, both of which were on third down. The other receivers have struggled with drops pretty much every single week on top of their issues with separation. Eason has shown the ability to read the field, and the ability to make any throw, with pretty consistent accuracy. He just has too often had plays where nobody got open and he has to fit the ball into impossible windows, many of which he STILL completes (see the Oregon and Stanford games). And he's usually making the correct read and throwing to the best target, but sometimes the best option is still a bad option. The issues? I've heard that he doesn't carry the type of spark and intensity that some people like in their QBs. Now, I'm not calling him Cutler, because I've also heard he gets along well with members of the locker room, but he isn't necessarily a Baker Mayfield-type QB. He's also a QB who, in theory, has good mobility, but in practice, isn't very mobile. Similar to Jarrett Stidham last year, who could rip off long runs, but just was kind of a hesitant runner and didn't have the feel for scrambling. Eason is similar. He's not an explosive runner, but he's not an extremely slow QB. I'd probably say he's a bit faster than, or maybe on par with, Jared Goff, who is technically a top-10 starting QB speed-wise. He just doesn't really have any sort of feel for scrambling and seems hesitant as a runner.

3. Justin Herbert?: The issues with Herbert and Fromm are that I expect them to fall in between Bowl Season and the Combine. However, Herbert is someone that people have really liked for a while, and while I haven't been super impressed, he does a lot of things well. He wasn't a train-wreck against a very good Auburn defense. He has excellent ball placement in regards to the target - knows when to throw it high, low, hard, soft, into the receiver's chest, leading the receiver, etc. He has good arm strength, but I don't see him as being top-10 in terms of arm strength when he hits the league (behind Stafford, Mahomes, Allen, Jackson, Rodgers, Flacco, Wentz, Goff, Mayfield, Ryan, and Carr, I'd say). He has shown the ability to be really accurate, but some passes get away from him. He doesn't really feel like he has the intensity of leadership of a top QB, I've specifically read from scouts that he's "soft". He has really nice athleticism overall, with the ability to throw off-platform and on the move, burst and acceleration to hurt defenses scrambling, and an above-average arm. He doesn't seem to get rattled, but that means his mistakes come entirely from lapses of judgment, which also means that you can't hide it like the Rams have with Jared Goff. There are obviously a lot of things to like, which is why he's a first-round prospect. I just don't think there's much to love about him. He just strikes me as an above-average athlete who is complete, but not elite in any department and doesn't have big-time intangibles... essentially the same as Eason, but Eason is just a bit better as far as passing goes, with a higher ceiling in that department, as well, and neither are exactly acing the intangibles evaluation. I think, when it comes to throwing the ball, Herbert is as good as he's going to get - which isn't bad, by the way. 

4. Joe Burrow: Burrow is on an almost cosmic rise in the rankings. There's not much to dislike about the redshirt senior out of LSU. He has a short, quick release that makes it harder for defenses to anticipate where he's throwing the ball and strip the ball during the wind-up. Excellent play-action passer throughout the whole process. He's just as good doing play-action under center, where he has to turn his back to the defense to sell the run, as he is running play-action out of the shotgun, which REALLY opens up an offense. Mentally, he's an extremely quick processor, but I haven't seen him work through a full-field progression very often. He is extremely aware and is always poised. He does not get happy feet and has a very good mental clock. Burrow has excellent toughness to calmly deliver throws to the check-down or outlet man under heavy rush or throw a ball downfield when he knows that he's going to get hit. He's clutch on third-down, and is very efficient as a runner. One of his best traits is the awareness to change up the speed of his throws depending on the situation. He'll put mustard on it or feather it depending on the situation, making it harder for cornerbacks or safeties to anticipate the timing of his throws. Not an elite athlete, and perhaps the sum is greater than the parts when talking about his individual athletic traits. He's not a fast or quick QB, but he has great timing as a runner and a really good feel as a scrambler, exactly the thing that I was saying that Eason lacks. He doesn't have great arm strength, but I'd say it's better than Jake Fromm, Ryan Findley, or Andy Dalton. Still, you're looking firmly at a tier-three or four QB when it comes to arm strength. Has shown steady development and growth throughout college.

5. Jake Fromm: Fromm is a very mixed bag. He was a sensation as a true freshman. He has a great pedigree as a long-time proven winner. He shows the ability to read a defense and work through a full-progression, but once he's in a rut, he stays there for the rest of the game. He doesn't show a tendency to bounce back from bad throws, though. He's gotten a lot of help from a very strong supporting cast at Georgia, though, and doesn't have great production. He's a very cerebral quarterback, though, and understands spacing and timing concepts better than most starting NFL quarterbacks. He's an extremely accurate and dangerous intermediate passer, consistently hitting that area beyond check-downs, but not far enough where the safeties can easily close. He knows best how to use his skill-set. He's athletically-limited. He doesn't have the arm strength to drive the ball and will struggle in a vertical passing offense. He's hesitant to challenge man coverage, and he doesn't have great velocity. However, he will consistently find soft spots in coverage and attack that area mercilessly. He probably requires a creative offensive coordinator that won't just require him to beat the defense on his own. He needs a variety of routes to pick on in order to pass efficiently. He has shown the ability to be really good at delivering the ball on quick out routes and slants, maximizing RAC opportunities for his receivers. He has worked in a classic pro-style offense where he has been required to set and alter protection at the line of scrimmage. He won the job and consistently beat out top prospects (both of which are projecting to be 1st-rounders) for the right to keep it. 

6. Jalen Hurts: With Hurts, there's a lot to like. He, much like Jake Fromm, is a proven winner with a 33-2 record as a starter over the course of his career. However, he hasn't ever had to carry a team in a difficult scheme. And he was ridiculously raw early in his career at Alabama. However, he showed growth after losing the QB competition at Alabama, but he's shown steady improvement every year. With the Crimson Tide, he showed particular growth with good Play-Action and RPO mechanics, and he is one of the most-refined RPO passers I've seen. Over the past two seasons, he has shown really good improvement on the trajectory of downfield throws, demonstrating the ability to split windows. He is very dangerous outside of the pocket and on the perimeter, where he not only will always be able to pick up good yardage on the ground, but he has also shown a greater penchant for keeping his eyes downfield and finding open receivers for deep conversions. He's shown flashes of anticipation, occasionally throwing to receivers just before they got open, hinting at a ceiling that could have GMs and coaches enticed. He had a slow trigger early in his career, where he'd wait to throw the ball until long after his receivers would make breaks, which he could get away with when he had far-superior talent around him, but, as previously stated, his anticipation has steadily improved. There's still not a lot of evidence on tape that it is consistently where it should be - partially due to the schemes that he's played in - but the upside is certainly there. He's playing under a good coach who is a proven QB whisperer. He has elite athleticism and mobility. Occasionally will bail from a clean pocket and trust his legs to make a play, leaving some yards on the field. If you look him up, there aren't many draft profiles on Hurts because he's playing in a wide-open system. Still, he's shown impressive improvements in his accuracy as a Junior and Senior, and has shown a good ability to make half-field and perimeter reads. He's definitely on the rise with great production, a situation that has proven effective at developing quarterbacks, and improvement. However, I'm not ready to crown him quite yet. I want to see what the rest of the season holds for him because, as with all players who are showing improvement, you want to see more tape of the positives to wash away memories of early career negatives.

[DoleINGout]

Hurts is #1 like I've said since last season.

Will probably be the Patriots most sought after QB in the draft. Hopefully they can trade up to get him.

[Chargers]

2 hours ago, DoleINGout said:

Hurts is #1 like I've said since last season.

Will probably be the Patriots most sought after QB in the draft. Hopefully they can trade up to get him.

What does he do so well you have him over Tua and Herbert?

[DoleINGout]

52 minutes ago, Classic said:

What does he do so well you have him over Tua and Herbert?

Lead.

[jrry32]

I wonder if the Saints are going to go after Joe Burrow. He's been impressive this year, and he's playing in a system designed by a Sean Payton protege.

[HoboRocket]

20 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

I wonder if the Saints are going to go after Joe Burrow. He's been impressive this year, and he's playing in a system designed by a Sean Payton protege.

Honestly, after doing all of my scout work, do you know which quarterback that I REALLY want to see in a Sean Payton offense? Jake Fromm. 

Fromm is a system QB, not that he's mentally-limited to any system, more that he will never be anything more than average unless you have him in a timing or spacing-based offense. The Chiefs, Colts, Saints, Eagles (as of the last couple of years, at least; I haven't watched Philly really at all THIS season) are a few teams that I believe have schemes that would be really good for him, specifically (though, really and truly, all of those teams can turn water into wine). Fromm would be like a second offensive coordinator. And let's face it - Teddy B is probably on par arm-wise with Fromm, but Fromm is younger and cheaper with more upside and a deadlier intermediate thrower. Probably better off play-action, as well. Actually, Fromm compares pretty favorably to Brees at this stage of Breesus' career, with the caveat of Brees pretty much always having played in a high-volume passing scheme, and Fromm, well, never playing in a high-volume passing scheme. Still, Fromm, in my mind, projects really, REALLY well to work with Sean Payton.

I'd put Joe Burrow at a close second, though. Both of them just scream Saints with how they play football like pro golfers, well, golf. They both have nice levels of experience and have shown high football acumen, as well.

[jrry32]

21 minutes ago, HoboRocket said:

Honestly, after doing all of my scout work, do you know which quarterback that I REALLY want to see in a Sean Payton offense? Jake Fromm. 

Fromm is a system QB, not that he's mentally-limited to any system, more that he will never be anything more than average unless you have him in a timing or spacing-based offense. The Chiefs, Colts, Saints, Eagles (as of the last couple of years, at least; I haven't watched Philly really at all THIS season) are a few teams that I believe have schemes that would be really good for him, specifically (though, really and truly, all of those teams can turn water into wine). Fromm would be like a second offensive coordinator. And let's face it - Teddy B is probably on par arm-wise with Fromm, but Fromm is younger and cheaper with more upside and a deadlier intermediate thrower. Probably better off play-action, as well. Actually, Fromm compares pretty favorably to Brees at this stage of Breesus' career, with the caveat of Brees pretty much always having played in a high-volume passing scheme, and Fromm, well, never playing in a high-volume passing scheme. Still, Fromm, in my mind, projects really, REALLY well to work with Sean Payton.

I'd put Joe Burrow at a close second, though. Both of them just scream Saints with how they play football like pro golfers, well, golf. They both have nice levels of experience and have shown high football acumen, as well.

Fromm has never done anything for me. We'll see if my opinion changes, but I've always seen him more as A.J. McCarron than a legit top 10 pick.

[HoboRocket]

Whoa. Just did the math, and TWELVE teams could conceivably draft a quarterback in the first round. This is crazy. It's like how in the off-season, I can't think of any teams that would possibly need a QB the next year in the draft, and then once the season rolls around I get flooded with them.

The Dolphins are an obvious team.

The Bengals are one as well. This team isn't getting anywhere anytime fast. Time to move on.

The Titans benched their starting QB.

The Buccaneers should bench their starting QB.

The Bears wish they could bench their starting QB (who was a product of the last regime, anyway).

The Broncos may or may not be confident in Drew Lock long-term. I have mixed opinions on him, and it's not unheard of to draft a 1st-rounder a year after you draft a QB on day two (see: Giants).

The Colts might want to move on from Jacoby Brissett, or at least groom a successor, since he has a very short-term deal. It's possible they draft a rookie in round 1 if he falters over the second-half of the season, but I think Brissett is their starting QB in week 1 of 2020.

The Saints may not have Teddy B long-term, and despite a couple great games, I don't know that he is a franchise QB.

The Patriots are ALWAYS going to be on this list with an ancient QB and uncertain future.

The Chargers need a succession plan for Philip Rivers.

The Packers could start thinking about a succession plan for Aaron Rodgers. I know it was with a different regime, but Rodgers sat for a few years after being drafted round 1. 

The Steelers may not be confident in Mason Rudolph or Devlin Hodges to succeed Big Ben.

 

[-Hope-]

56 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

Fromm has never done anything for me. We'll see if my opinion changes, but I've always seen him more as A.J. McCarron than a legit top 10 pick.

yeah, idk. fromm in a sean payton offense strikes me as the same type of deal as alex smith in an andy reid offense. good, but as we're seeing now with mahomes, it could be so much better.

[CalhounLambeau]

17 hours ago, DoleINGout said:

Hurts is #1 like I've said since last season.

Will probably be the Patriots most sought after QB in the draft. Hopefully they can trade up to get him.

I've got all his 2019 games cut here

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCt2srpYNyoiiBEptuziASpg/search?query=hurts

[Scoundrel]

46 minutes ago, CalhounLambeau said:

I've got all his 2019 games cut here

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCt2srpYNyoiiBEptuziASpg/search?query=hurts

Love it I’ve subscribed 

[VanS]

On 10/24/2019 at 7:39 PM, Tetsujin said:

Have we discussed Kellen Mond yet? He seems like a big wildcard in either the 20' or 21' draft that nobody's mentioning.

I mentioned him a few weeks ago.  He's right now my 3rd favorite QB prospect in college football after Trevor Lawrence and Justin Fields.  He reminds me of a 6'2" Colin Kaepernick.  Great athlete.  Strong arm.  Accurate enough.  He has more potential IMO than all the QBs in the 2020 class everyone else is fawning over.

[CalhounLambeau]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1QbJONz-aRK6WCaSUH4sGS1wAjN_lkg1j7Mrtp1lGJxw/edit?usp=sharing

If you want to watch players we've got thousands of prospect cuts linked here. Including a few hundred for the QB's.

Edited October 27, 2019 by CalhounLambeau