MSURacerDT55 Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 As a Browns fan, I'm not going to sleep on Mitch but I think Baker has better intangibles and instincts for the game. I think he will have some success because of the talent around him, but I don't think he would be as successful without elite tools around him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 TBH, I think Baker has a statline (assuming he's healthy) something like: 4,100 yards 35 TD 15 INT 64% Completion Rate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted June 18, 2019 Share Posted June 18, 2019 If we're defining better season by individual stats, Baker Mayfield. If we're defining better season by regular season wins/postseason success, Mitchell Trubisky. I have more faith in the Bears defense and run game carrying Trubisky further in a kind-of-thin NFC than I do Mayfield and the new look Browns in a very loaded AFC. It's not that I think less of the Browns, I just think that 10-6 is the high mark for them. I think the Bears can sleepwalk into 10-6. Stats wise, it's not a question. Mayfield will obliterate Trubisky, simply because he's got significantly better weapons around him. Antonio Callaway is a potential #1 in Chicago, he's a #3 in Cleveland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman(DH23) Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 18 hours ago, ET80 said: If we're defining better season by individual stats, Baker Mayfield. If we're defining better season by regular season wins/postseason success, Mitchell Trubisky. I have more faith in the Bears defense and run game carrying Trubisky further in a kind-of-thin NFC than I do Mayfield and the new look Browns in a very loaded AFC. It's not that I think less of the Browns, I just think that 10-6 is the high mark for them. I think the Bears can sleepwalk into 10-6. Stats wise, it's not a question. Mayfield will obliterate Trubisky, simply because he's got significantly better weapons around him. Antonio Callaway is a potential #1 in Chicago, he's a #3 in Cleveland. Cmon ET Callaway is not beating out Allen Robinson or Anthony Miller. Be real. There are A LOT of people sleeping on the Bears weapons. They have no idea what's coming this year. Our beat guys cant stop talking about our weapons and how ridiculously deep they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 14 minutes ago, Superman(DH23) said: Cmon ET Callaway is not beating out Allen Robinson or Anthony Miller. Be real. There are A LOT of people sleeping on the Bears weapons. They have no idea what's coming this year. Our beat guys cant stop talking about our weapons and how ridiculously deep they are. He absolutely is. Had he not had off field concerns at Florida, he's probably a top 20 pick last season - he's got that sort of talent. Allen Robinson hasn't been the same since his ACL injury, so I'm not ready to put him back where he was when he was at his peak in Jacksonville. Even if that's an overstatement, it's still Browns >>> Bears by a pretty significant margin in terms of offensive weapons. I don't think there's a team in the league that comes close to what Cleveland has on offense with OBJ and Kareem Hunt added to the mix. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman(DH23) Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 11 minutes ago, ET80 said: He absolutely is. Had he not had off field concerns at Florida, he's probably a top 20 pick last season - he's got that sort of talent. Allen Robinson hasn't been the same since his ACL injury, so I'm not ready to put him back where he was when he was at his peak in Jacksonville. Even if that's an overstatement, it's still Browns >>> Bears by a pretty significant margin in terms of offensive weapons. I don't think there's a team in the league that comes close to what Cleveland has on offense with OBJ and Kareem Hunt added to the mix. Robinson, in fewer games, had more catches, more yards, better avg. And you already admitted that that is him coming back from an ACL. Sorry, but no, Callaway is not beating Robinson. Again, Callaway is likely not beating out Miller who had 7 TDs as a rookie, and probably should have had 10. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 3 hours ago, Superman(DH23) said: Robinson, in fewer games, had more catches, more yards, better avg. And you already admitted that that is him coming back from an ACL. Sorry, but no, Callaway is not beating Robinson. Again, Callaway is likely not beating out Miller who had 7 TDs as a rookie, and probably should have had 10. I think his main point is that we're debating the Browns 3rd or 4th WR with the Bears 1st and 2nd. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pugger Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 On 6/8/2019 at 3:49 PM, patriotsheatyan said: Mayfield has arguably the best supporting cast in the league, so they carry him to above average numbers. I seriously doubt any of us would have said this about the Browns in the past! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman(DH23) Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 3 hours ago, Thomas5737 said: I think his main point is that we're debating the Browns 3rd or 4th WR with the Bears 1st and 2nd. And I'm saying that's ridiculous bc it's not a debate. Callaway would be the #3 on the Bears as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 7 hours ago, Superman(DH23) said: Robinson, in fewer games, had more catches, more yards, better avg. And you already admitted that that is him coming back from an ACL. Sorry, but no, Callaway is not beating Robinson. Again, Callaway is likely not beating out Miller who had 7 TDs as a rookie, and probably should have had 10. Calloway was a 5th round pick who was nothing more than a #4 option on that team for 3/4th the season - I'd like to think the numbers were higher for a #1 WR vs that. My stance is more subjective in nature, based on physical traits - so I get you disagreeing. I'm higher on Calloway as a WR than most, I firmly believe he would have went top 20 had he not been a knucklehead in college. But, take that part out - there is absolutely no universe in which Robinson/Miller are even close to OBJ/Landry. Likewise for Tarik Cohen v Nick Chubb/Kareem Hunt. I'd probably make the same statement for Trey Burton v David Njoku. It's not even a contest, Cleveland's offensive skill players are considerably better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superman(DH23) Posted June 19, 2019 Share Posted June 19, 2019 11 minutes ago, ET80 said: Calloway was a 5th round pick who was nothing more than a #4 option on that team for 3/4th the season - I'd like to think the numbers were higher for a #1 WR vs that. My stance is more subjective in nature, based on physical traits - so I get you disagreeing. I'm higher on Calloway as a WR than most, I firmly believe he would have went top 20 had he not been a knucklehead in college. But, take that part out - there is absolutely no universe in which Robinson/Miller are even close to OBJ/Landry. Likewise for Tarik Cohen v Nick Chubb/Kareem Hunt. I'd probably make the same statement for Trey Burton v David Njoku. It's not even a contest, Cleveland's offensive skill players are considerably better. I'm not arguing Robinson/Miller are better than OBJ/Landry. However your Tarik Cohen comparison is negating the addition of David Montgomery, who is considered by most to be an analog for Kareem Hunt. And the Bears have both, as well as Mike Davis and Cordarrelle Patterson for all 16 games, unlike the Browns who wont have Hunt for half the season. What has Njoku done to warrant such high esteem? I mean their production last year is remarkably similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistakey Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 On 6/11/2019 at 11:49 AM, game3525 said: lol, neither one of them are putting up stat lines like that. youre right bakers throwing for 50 and 5000 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 8 hours ago, Superman(DH23) said: And I'm saying that's ridiculous bc it's not a debate. Callaway would be the #3 on the Bears as well. Miller is better because he had more TDs than Callaway even though he had less yards and less per receptions and Robinson is better than Callaway because he had more receptions for a better average (.1) even though he had less TDs. If those are the reasons each player is better you have some conflicting results.I don't know if I watched a Bears game last year so I can't really say how good either of them were but using statistical data doesn't work because what elevates one dismisses the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted June 20, 2019 Share Posted June 20, 2019 7 hours ago, Superman(DH23) said: I'm not arguing Robinson/Miller are better than OBJ/Landry. However your Tarik Cohen comparison is negating the addition of David Montgomery, who is considered by most to be an analog for Kareem Hunt. And the Bears have both, as well as Mike Davis and Cordarrelle Patterson for all 16 games, unlike the Browns who wont have Hunt for half the season. What has Njoku done to warrant such high esteem? I mean their production last year is remarkably similar. We could bring Higgins and Duke Johnson into the discussion also if you want to dive deeper but it really does seem silly to think the Bears on paper could compete with the talent level of skill positions with the Browns. Offensively speaking of course. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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