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SemperFeist

Rudolph with a Very Shiny New Contract

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1 minute ago, swede700 said:

PS eligibility will make some of that determination, as well as how they perform on special teams.  Obviously Treadwell is not PS-eligible and I'm pretty sure Taylor is not, but I'm not sure Zylstra is either.  But, Beebe, Badet, Mitchell and Johnson definitely all are.  

Of course some may wind up on the practice squad, but when trying to get them on the practice there’s a good chance of losing one or more, especially if they show promise. And being on the practice squad doesn’t really help on game day. 

I doubt a few undrafted players or a couple  of 7th rounds picks will ever really matter, but it does seem like they’ve got a few who have a decent amount of potential. And it’s going to stink to lose any of them. 

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33 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

Why Conklin over Morgan? Morgan is the only reliable blocking TE on the roster. I'd imagine there is still value in that. Usually the Vikes have kept 9 receivers (6 WRs and 3 TEs). I think 9 will still be kept but I'm guessing one more TE and one fewer WR will be kept.

I think they'll keep 4 TEs, including both Conklin and Morgan. 

If they do keep only 3, I think Conklin is more likely to stick than Morgan. He can do a better job backing up both TE positions (Y/inline, H-back/move) than Morgan, who's only a blocking TE and doesn't offer much if anything downfield. 

Morgan wasn't great as a blocker last year (yes, limited by injury). He's in a contract year, and very unlikely to be extended. If they release Conklin this year, and Morgan goes next year, they won't have any depth at the position heading into 2020. 

Conklin wasn't great either, but he did show something as a receiver. TEs are often considerably better in their second year, so I hope he improves from his rookie season. 

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5 minutes ago, SemperFeist said:

Of course some may wind up on the practice squad, but when trying to get them on the practice there’s a good chance of losing one or more, especially if they show promise. And being on the practice squad doesn’t really help on game day. 

I doubt a few undrafted players or a couple  of 7th rounds picks will ever really matter, but it does seem like they’ve got a few who have a decent amount of potential. And it’s going to stink to lose any of them. 

Oh, I know it's not great to lose any of them, but that's a good problem to have.  I'd rather have to lose guys that have potential than have to struggle to fill out the depth chart, like they had to do 5 years ago.   

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12 minutes ago, SemperFeist said:

Choosing only 3 out of Treadwell, Taylor, Beebe, Zystra, Badet, Mitchell, and Johnson is going to be tough.

As much as it pains me to say, I don’t see Beebe making the roster. 

Treadwell's done. Stefanski had him as a healthy scratch late last year. He's not even getting mentioned in the team minicamp/OTA videos and interviews. I expect he'll be released unless someone wants to trade a conditional 7th for him. 

Taylor has a step on Zylstra for the outside WR3 spot (replacing Treadwell's role last year). 

Beebe's got a great chance to win the PR spot. He's also probably the WR4 right now. He'll make it, don't worry. 

WR5 probably comes down to the loser of the Taylor/Zylstra battle vs the better of the 2 rookies, Mitchell or Johnson.

If they keep 6, they can have Mitchell and Zylstra, or Zylstra and Johnson, or both rookies. If one of the rookies doesn't make it, he goes to the PS. 

Badet and the UDFA rookies are long shots to do anything beyond PS.

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Unless he becomes a top special teams play, a la Marcus Sherels, I just don’t see them giving a roster spot to Beebe. He’s a slot only receiver that likely won’t see any snaps in the slot as long as Thielen and Smith are healthy. 

I agree that Treadwell is likely done, but I’m not going to count him out when his only real competition is Taylor for the WR3 spot. I think Zylstra has the WR5 spot locked up because he can back up the split end spot, and he’s a good special teams player. 

I think Badet and Mitchell are prime candidates for WR4. Whoever it is will obviously need to show some ability on special teams, but they both offer something that no one else really does, and that’s deep speed. 

WR1 - Diggs 🔒 

WR2 - Thielen 🔒 

WR3 - Taylor vs Treadwell

WR4 - Badet vs Mitchell

WR5 - Zylstra 🔒 

 

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I hope they can add a veteran to the WR group. It doesn't look good at all after Diggs and Thielen.

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Posted (edited)

Badet just isn't a good WR, no matter how fast he is. 400 yards receiving his senior year with Baker Mayfield as his QB. Only one catch last preseason longer than 7 yards. Wouldn't even bet on him beating out Treadwell, let alone the rest of the group. 

Beebe was ahead of Badet on the depth chart last year, and will be again this year. It's fine having him as slot only, if he's a WR4. Thielen can play outside at least occasionally. I'm not sure who Smith is ("won’t see any snaps in the slot as long as Thielen and Smith are healthy"). The main risk for Beebe not making the team is injuries, he couldn't stay healthy last year. 

Zylstra is no lock, and I say that as someone who was confident at this time last year he'd make the team. Mitchell and Johnson can both play inside and outside. 

I think they'll keep at least one of the rookies on the 53, even if that's as a WR6 who's typically inactive on game days. 

Edited by Krauser

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6 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

I hope they can add a veteran to the WR group. It doesn't look good at all after Diggs and Thielen.

I don't think they need a veteran.  Adding a veteran to this group would be a waste of a spot, as far as I'm concerned.

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8 minutes ago, Krauser said:

I'm not sure who Smith is

Our 2nd round pick. If they run 12 like many expect them to that further lessens the need of a slot only receiver. 

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3 minutes ago, SemperFeist said:

Our 2nd round pick. If they run 12 like many expect them to that further lessens the need of a slot only receiver. 

Oh OK, I see what you mean. 

I doubt that'll factor too much into the decision. If Smith is playing 600+ snaps, they won't need to be too picky about roles for the depth WRs as long as they have backups for Thielen (Taylor) and Diggs (Mitchell or Zylstra).

The main focus should be getting guys on the team who can contribute. Beebe is lethal on whip routes. He's an ideal possession receiver for 3rd downs and in 2 minute drills, get him matched up against the nickel and move the chains. That kind of trump card is valuable, and worth rostering, especially if he can also find a niche as the punt returner (where he was good in preseason last year). 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, swede700 said:

I don't think they need a veteran.  Adding a veteran to this group would be a waste of a spot, as far as I'm concerned.

I don't think any of the holdovers (Beebe, Zylstra, Badet or Treadwell) are worthy of a roster spot. Best case, they are all probably #5 WRs. Most likely case, out of the NFL. Taylor has played some in the NFL so he may be an okay 4 or 5. Basically I see a bunch of #5 quality WRs competing for all the depth spots given how void the team is at talent at backup WR.

It's hard to judge Mitchell, can't count on those late round rookies for anything.

We're a Diggs or Thielen injury away from having a terrible receiving group. I think there is definitely value in having a veteran WR come in and lock down the #3 spot. I'm not sure who is available, Pierre Garcon? Because then you've got all those #5 quality WRs competing for maybe two or three spots and that seems a bit more manageable.

I have no reason to believe that Beebe, Zylstra, Badet, Treadwell, Mitchell and Taylor have the ability to start games if the situation required it. I'd think you'd want one reserve you can feel good about as either having upside to start or having done so in the past.

Edited by vikingsrule

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Posted (edited)
28 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

We're a Diggs or Thielen injury away from having a terrible receiving group.

Atlanta is a Julio Jones injury away from having a terrible receiving group
Oakland is an Antonio Brown injury away from having a terrible receiving group
Houston is a DeAndre Hopkins injury away from having a terrible receiving group
Cleveland is an OBJ or Jarvis Landry injury away from having a terrible receiving group
Cincinati is an AJ Green injury away from having a terrible receiving group

I could keep going, but I think you get the point. An injury to a top 10 player at any position significantly impacts the quality of that position group. You can't have all pros with quality depth at every position. Never mind having two all pro caliber players at a position.

Edited by JDBrocks

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No idea if this works..... But could Treadwell be a TE? I doubt it, but in the open field he's a very good blocker. If he can effectively stand in the way, he's be a better blocker than some TEs. And as a TE, he's probably above average as a receiver.

But, really, he's just not worked out. I thought he'd be average as a WR, give or take. Didn't happen.

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14 minutes ago, PrplChilPill said:

No idea if this works..... But could Treadwell be a TE? I doubt it, but in the open field he's a very good blocker. If he can effectively stand in the way, he's be a better blocker than some TEs. And as a TE, he's probably above average as a receiver.

But, really, he's just not worked out. I thought he'd be average as a WR, give or take. Didn't happen.

Don't see that working. Treadwell's blocking isn't good enough; he would get destroyed by DEs.

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24 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

I don't think any of the holdovers (Beebe, Zylstra, Badet or Treadwell) are worthy of a roster spot. Best case, they are all probably #5 WRs. Most likely case, out of the NFL.

Beebe was really good last year, both in preseason and the little work he got in the regular season. Not sure how much more he could have done with the opportunity. I wouldn't write him off at this stage. The Vikings could absolutely use a possession slot receiver, even if he's undersized -- a Jamison Crowder or Cole Beasley. If he stays healthy, he's going to have an NFL career.

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