Is the Patriots roster actually GOOD? Or is it propped up by coaching?

[PatriotsWin!]

I don't get this perception that the Pats have a weak roster. Id consider it one of the most talented. We might not be top heavy (outside Brady, Gronk, Gilmore, McCourty) but we also don't have what I'd consider 'bad' players. Most teams have expensive superstars with low quality, cheap guys filling out the bottom of their roster. Pats don't have that. They don't fill their roster with those bottom tier players. Instead they sign solid players at average salaries to fill the bottom of the roster. They can afford to do this because they don't overpay for superstar players (and we always spend up to the cap, so it's not the Pats cheaping out, it's the Pats spreading the wealth) . That's why next man up works in NE. Because we have the best depth in the league. 

Of course having the GOAT QB running your offense helps a ton :). Especially when he's signing below market deals with NE all the time, allowing BB to sign better quality players. 

[William Lee]

16 minutes ago, PatriotsWin! said:

I don't get this perception that the Pats have a weak roster. Id consider it one of the most talented. We might not be top heavy (outside Brady, Gronk, Gilmore, McCourty) but we also don't have what I'd consider 'bad' players. Most teams have expensive superstars with low quality, cheap guys filling out the bottom of their roster. Pats don't have that. They don't fill their roster with those bottom tier players. Instead they sign solid players at average salaries to fill the bottom of the roster. They can afford to do this because they don't overpay for superstar players (and we always spend up to the cap, so it's not the Pats cheaping out, it's the Pats spreading the wealth) . That's why next man up works in NE. Because we have the best depth in the league. 

Of course having the GOAT QB running your offense helps a ton :). Especially when he's signing below market deals with NE all the time, allowing BB to sign better quality players. 

They don't have to overpay because Brady has the skills to turn castoffs into playmakers (read my first post on this thread), if other QBs have the skills, their coaches would have tried.

Belichick can try "finding gold among stones" because Brady can score 440 pts and play time-consuming offense with whoever Belichick puts around him. With such an offense that doesn't need expensive players, Belichick is given the time to try.

How often did you see Pats struggled in first half of the season? 

For example, letting go of 2 key players on defense in 2016 might have cost Pats SB against Falcons, but Brady's time-control offense gave the team a slim hope to win that SB, the foolishness from Falcons coaches gave Pats the chance to win.

Quote

Also, in SB against Eagles, Pats #5 point allowed defense played like one of the worst. You know why? because Pats offense played only 26 minutes.

Belichick's defense needs a time-control offense that can score 24+ points, or it will collapse, that is what Brady has given him, since the first day he became the starter.

Since 2009, How often did Belichick's defense played good when offense struggled?

Edited June 19, 2019 by William Lee

[Daniel]

39 minutes ago, PatriotsWin! said:

I don't get this perception that the Pats have a weak roster. Id consider it one of the most talented. We might not be top heavy (outside Brady, Gronk, Gilmore, McCourty) but we also don't have what I'd consider 'bad' players. Most teams have expensive superstars with low quality, cheap guys filling out the bottom of their roster. Pats don't have that. They don't fill their roster with those bottom tier players. Instead they sign solid players at average salaries to fill the bottom of the roster. They can afford to do this because they don't overpay for superstar players (and we always spend up to the cap, so it's not the Pats cheaping out, it's the Pats spreading the wealth) . That's why next man up works in NE. Because we have the best depth in the league. 

Best depth in the league is a stretch.  Belichick gets the best out of his players.  Just look at McCourty.  He was a great corner with the Titans for years, but then he fell off.  Pats sign him, he's suddenly great again.  That's one reason every player they pick up, whether in free agency or the draft, works out so well for them, and why I get so annoyed every time the Titans sign a Pats FA.  They usually fall off because the rest of the league can't use them as well.

[William Lee]

1 minute ago, Daniel said:

Best depth in the league is a stretch.  Belichick gets the best out of his players.  Just look at McCourty.  He was a great corner with the Titans for years, but then he fell off.  Pats sign him, he's suddenly great again.  That's one reason every player they pick up, whether in free agency or the draft, works out so well for them, and why I get so annoyed every time the Titans sign a Pats FA.  They usually fall off because the rest of the league can't use them as well.

He was great before, just didn't have the opportunity to play on big stages.

You should ask why only Pats can try "finding gold among stones".

why do other teams not even try?

Obviously, the defense is not good enough to stop Chiefs. 

[game3525]

2 hours ago, William Lee said:

It is almost all  Brady, very little for a coach who almost never talk to his offense. 

The reason Belichick can make those "genius" move by finding gold among stones, because he has Brady. That is why no other team can even try.

Watch the play in the video below, can you tell what Brady did special?

 

There is nothing special in the design that other team can’t copycat, it is what Brady did that no other QB can do.

Hint:

Why did Colts #52 move towards right? why was Colts #41 one step slower to stop White from getting TD?

other QBs don't have the skills required for this play, so the play wouldn't even be called, as it would lead to 3rd and goal, OC would rather call plays that throw into endzone TWICE.

The skills in this play helped Brady win the first SB in 2002,

This play shows some of the skills that make Brady the GOAT.

BTW,  2008 season proved that without Brady, Pats were just another AFCE team, even with Moss. BTW, Jets, Bills and Phins won 19 out of 30 against non AFCE teams.The worst AFCE team in that year won 7 games.

This has to be a troll post.

There was nothing unique about that final drive. Any competent veteran QB could do this. Zero pass-rush and soft zone coverage, that is easy pickings for any veteran QB. Brady is the greatest QB of all-time, but using this video as evidence to why he is unique is laughable. 

[William Lee]

1 hour ago, game3525 said:

This has to be a troll post.

There was nothing unique about that final drive. Any competent veteran QB could do this. Zero pass-rush and soft zone coverage, that is easy pickings for any veteran QB. Brady is the greatest QB of all-time, but using this video as evidence to why he is unique is laughable. 

Lol, amazingly ignorant.

Brady looked to his right first, which lured Colts #52 to right, and Colts #41 to drop back a little deep into endzone.

then he turned his eyes to his left. Do you see how quickly Brady released ball after turning his head? Colts#41 immediately stepped up to cover James White, but was one step too late.

Go try to turn your head and put ball at exact spot as quickly as Brady did.

Go check Brady's first pass in 2002 SB from 3 yard line, in exact the same way Troy Brown was able to get first down.

Edited June 19, 2019 by William Lee

[Daniel]

1 minute ago, William Lee said:

Lol, amazingly ignorant.

Continuing with personal attacks is a really good way to get banned.  It also doesn't help your case.

[William Lee]

1 minute ago, Daniel said:

Continuing with personal attacks is a really good way to get banned.  It also doesn't help your case.

That is a personal attack after he called me a troll? Ok, my apology.

Edited June 19, 2019 by William Lee

[game3525]

45 minutes ago, William Lee said:

Lol, amazingly ignorant.

Brady looked to his right first, which lured Colts #52 to right, and Colts #41 to drop back a little deep into endzone.

then he turned his eyes to his left. Do you see how quickly Brady released ball after turning his head? Colts#41 immediately stepped up to cover James White, but was one step too late.

Go try to turn your head and put ball at exact spot as quickly as Brady did.

Go check Brady's first pass in 2002 SB from 3 yard line, in exact the same way Troy Brown was able to get first down.

A QB going through his reads....ground-breaking. 

[William Lee]

23 minutes ago, game3525 said:

A QB going through his reads....ground-breaking. 

QB must watch to "through read"

That is NOT through reads, he knows where the opportunities are beforehand, without even looking,  plus extraordinary foot work that allowed him to adjust body position quickly to throw.

That is why Pats receivers must be smart, must be able to identify weak spots and run to spots, as Brady anticipates weak spots and throws extremely quick to those spots, and when defenders realize who his targets are, it is already too late, which leads to "his receivers are always wide open", or ridiculous "BB puts the receivers at right  spots"

That is why no team can play zone against Brady, because defenders will always be one or two steps later.

Edited June 19, 2019 by William Lee

[Daniel]

22 minutes ago, William Lee said:

That is NOT through reads, he knows where the opportunities are beforehand, without even looking,  

....so, he's a system QB.

[y*so*blu]

It doesn't matter. They're winning.

I would say more but we all know this thread is headed nowhere.

Edited June 19, 2019 by y*so*blu

[game3525]

20 minutes ago, William Lee said:

QB must watch to "through read"

That is NOT through reads, he knows where the opportunities are beforehand, without even looking,  plus extraordinary foot work that allowed him to adjust body position quickly to throw.

That is why Pats receivers must be smart, must be able to identify weak spots and run to spots, as Brady anticipates weak spots and throws extremely quick to those spots, and when defenders realize who his targets are, it is already too late, which leads to "his receivers are always wide open", or ridiculous "BB puts the receivers at right  spots"

That is why no team can play zone against Brady, because defenders will always be one or two steps later.

Because it is a zone defense.

Brady has seen every thing, he knows how to attack zone (which is why it is stupid to play that kind of coverage without disguising anything). However, pretty much any vet QB can pick apart zone because of their experience when it comes to reading coverage. Plus, KC generated zero pressure, so it is basically pitch and catch for Brady.

Like I said earlier, Brady is great, but using this as an example of why he is great and how other QB's can't replicate this is nonsense. 

[William Lee]

12 minutes ago, game3525 said:

Because it is a zone defense.

Brady has seen every thing, he knows how to attack zone (which is why it is stupid to play that kind of coverage without disguising anything). However, pretty much any vet QB can pick apart zone because of their experience when it comes to reading coverage. Plus, KC generated zero pressure, so it is basically pitch and catch for Brady.

Like I said earlier, Brady is great, but using this as an example of why he is great and how other QB's can't replicate this is nonsense. 

Show me some plays by Peyton and Rodgers using their eyes to lure defenders to wrong spots.

There is no trick in turning castoffs into playmakers, just throw quickly to give them the spaces to maneuver, which is hard because defenders look at QB in the eyes.

why didn't other QB do it regularly?

BTW, using eyes is just one of the two major ways Brady uses.

Edited June 19, 2019 by William Lee

[William Lee]

17 minutes ago, Daniel said:

....so, he's a system QB.

Brady's system is too hard for Peyton and Rodgers.

The system existed in 2001 since Brady became starter. You want to claim it is Belichick's?

Well, that will make Peyton and Rodgers idiots, as Belichick almost never talked to his offense on sidelines. So if it was Belichick's, it must be quite simple, and other QB should be able to command easily.

Edited June 19, 2019 by William Lee