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Does our defence look as good to anybody else as it does to me?


Hail Mary

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7 hours ago, boratt said:

Btw, I do think Daniels is in for a monster year. Clark as well. Both players are going to benefit from the growth of Lancaster, Lowry and Adams. Both should see more rest and be more impactful in 2019 than 2018. 

Because it's so frequent that players at 30 are more impactful than they were at 29 in schemes that don't fit their skillset?

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7 hours ago, boratt said:

Woodson was 34 years old. He was not in his physical prime, although his skillset was being highlighted in such a way on that team that he still played that way.

If we’re calling 34 Woodson in his prime, we need to call 30 year old Daniels in his prime too. A multi pro bowler in his prime. 

Woodson won DPOY in 2009. It was his best season as a pro. It might not have been his physical prime but it was an incredible season.

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8 hours ago, boratt said:

Williams declining speed will be nullified inside and his savvy highlighted

Alexander and Kings abilities to play man or zone will take pressure off of the rookie Savage

Amos’ experience will take pressure off the rookie Savage

Williams experience inside will take pressure off the rookie, Savage. 

Savage, surrounded by experience, will have his speed and athleticism highlighted and his inexperience covered. 

Its the right fit of talents in the right spots, at the right times in their careers. That’s what I’m saying. 

I don't even know why you're assuming that Savage is going to be the starting FS and not Tramon with a different guy in the slot. This is a position battle that needs to be fought. 

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2 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

I don't even know why you're assuming that Savage is going to be the starting FS and not Tramon with a different guy in the slot. This is a position battle that needs to be fought. 

It's one of the safer assumptions you could make, I don't really think "position battle" needs to be said when it comes to safety. Our starters are Amos and Savage. They put him in the starting defense on day 1 of OTAs, he's the starting safety.

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17 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

It's one of the safer assumptions you could make, I don't really think "position battle" needs to be said when it comes to safety. Our starters are Amos and Savage. They put him in the starting defense on day 1 of OTAs, he's the starting safety.

I really don't think Day 1 starter in OTAs is nearly the crowning you're reporting it as.

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Daniels is underrated not overrated. He’s had to play most of his career with a declining Matthews as his pass rush compliment and an oft injured Perry as the other. He’s had to do it himself.

This year he has Clark, Z, Preston and Gary so he’s going to get the flash plays and stats that will make a less knowing person like you understand his value. 

I’ve enjoyed the banter this offseason. I’m especially excited to have some lines in the sand with Gary and Daniels and the defense as a whole. Now we get to wait and see how it plays. 

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20 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

I really don't think Day 1 starter in OTAs is nearly the crowning you're reporting it as.

If I remember correctly Jaire came in behind King and Tramon last year, HHCD who was probably the most obvious round 1 starter we've ever taken played behind the UDFA scrub safeties we had back then up until the preseason games started. I can't recall a rookie that we instantly slotted as a starter from day 1.

My take is, if they slot a vet ahead of you as a round 1 pick, that's a temporary positioning until the took is ready. If the rook is instantly put in there ahead of the vet, that's not changing until play in a game dictates as such. I don't see it becoming a position battle unless Savage is bad when it counts.

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59 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

If I remember correctly Jaire came in behind King and Tramon last year, HHCD who was probably the most obvious round 1 starter we've ever taken played behind the UDFA scrub safeties we had back then up until the preseason games started. I can't recall a rookie that we instantly slotted as a starter from day 1.

My take is, if they slot a vet ahead of you as a round 1 pick, that's a temporary positioning until the took is ready. If the rook is instantly put in there ahead of the vet, that's not changing until play in a game dictates as such. I don't see it becoming a position battle unless Savage is bad when it counts.

Agree. Obviously I cant say Savage will start from day one - but I certainly hope he is. The pairing of him and Amos provides the best talent mix IMO.

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1 hour ago, Packerraymond said:

If I remember correctly Jaire came in behind King and Tramon last year, HHCD who was probably the most obvious round 1 starter we've ever taken played behind the UDFA scrub safeties we had back then up until the preseason games started. I can't recall a rookie that we instantly slotted as a starter from day 1.

My take is, if they slot a vet ahead of you as a round 1 pick, that's a temporary positioning until the took is ready. If the rook is instantly put in there ahead of the vet, that's not changing until play in a game dictates as such. I don't see it becoming a position battle unless Savage is bad when it counts.

I think you're viewing this thing through the lens of Capers. Savage is the starter long term and everybody knows it. He'll get his shot. There's no reason in walk throughs to have him sitting. It's just going to be a different game when camp opens.

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1 hour ago, boratt said:

Daniels is underrated not overrated. He’s had to play most of his career with a declining Matthews as his pass rush compliment and an oft injured Perry as the other. He’s had to do it himself.

This year he has Clark, Z, Preston and Gary so he’s going to get the flash plays and stats that will make a less knowing person like you understand his value. 

I’ve enjoyed the banter this offseason. I’m especially excited to have some lines in the sand with Gary and Daniels and the defense as a whole. Now we get to wait and see how it plays. 

You're running two years too late, Daniels is definitely not underrated anymore. 

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12 hours ago, boratt said:

Mike Daniels > Pickett

Kenny Clark > Raji

Amos > Peprah

Preston > Zombo

Lowry/Gary/Fackrell > Bishop (they played 2-4 defense compared to our 3-3)

 

Martinez = Hawk

Alexander = Tramon

 

2010 rookie shields > king

Matthews > Zadarius

Collins > Savage

Woodson > Tramon

 

 

I think this defense has a chance to be similar to that one, honestly. Both in talent and also in fit. It’s a good fit of guys, who’s talents will be highlighted and weaknesses minimized, similar to in 2010.

2019 should have a better pass rush, 2010 a better secondary. But I do see this defense as being near the top of the league. 

And I see the 2019 secondary as being a really good mix of talents and skills that will compliment each other in a way that the sum together is greater than the individual parts.

Man, I really dig your optimism.  And I hope you are right!

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1 hour ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

You're running two years too late, Daniels is definitely not underrated anymore. 

He had a little bit of attention when he first came on but his sack numbers have never been what they could have been if he had better supporting cast. 

Clark, Zadarius, Preston, Gary and Fackrell in certain matchups give him a better supporting cast this year.

I could see a 8+ sack season from Daniels with more one on ones and having squeezed pockets from Gary/Zadarius instead of having Matthews overrunning QBs and leaving escape routes. 

Daniels and Gary are the two guys I think benefit most from the current fit. Those two and Savage. 

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7 hours ago, boratt said:

He had a little bit of attention when he first came on but his sack numbers have never been what they could have been if he had better supporting cast. 

Clark, Zadarius, Preston, Gary and Fackrell in certain matchups give him a better supporting cast this year.

I could see a 8+ sack season from Daniels with more one on ones and having squeezed pockets from Gary/Zadarius instead of having Matthews overrunning QBs and leaving escape routes. 

Daniels and Gary are the two guys I think benefit most from the current fit. Those two and Savage. 

Let's pose the question, currently in the NFL, where does Daniels rank among 3/5T?

Also, good chance Daniels gets left off the pressure package if Gary is as good as you think. 

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4 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Let's pose the question, currently in the NFL, where does Daniels rank among 3/5T?

Also, good chance Daniels gets left off the pressure package if Gary is as good as you think. 

I’d say Daniels is a top 20 interior DL. Clark is top 10.

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5 hours ago, boratt said:

I’d say Daniels is a top 20 interior DL. Clark is top 10.

Just among primary 3/5T I'm not sure Daniels is top 20.

Aaron Donald

JJ Watt

Cameron Heyward

Akiem Hicks

Jonathan Allen

Calais Campbell

Fletcher Cox

Chris Jones

Deforest Buckner

Geno Atkins

Sheldon Rankins

Jurrell Casey

Jarran Reed

Kawann Short

Malik Jackson

Sheldon Richardson

Then you've got a couple of guys who are close in Grady Jarrett,  Suh, McCoy, Stephon Tuitt, Matt Ioannidis, Leonard Williams and Michael Bennett if you count him.

This isn't even talking about Ideal 0/1T guys like:

Clark

Brandon Williams 

Linval Joseph

Eddie Goldman

Damon Harrison

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