ET80 Posted September 29, 2017 Share Posted September 29, 2017 1 hour ago, BayRaider said: Check out Ripple guys. It's the cryptocurrency that is for Banks. Yes, kind of defeats the purpose of cryptocurrency but it's more realistic. Ripple might replace the program banks currently use (Swift) which takes 3-5 days to process transactions. Ripple is instant. Ripple is currently used by 70 banks and I believe one is Bank of America. They still have nearly a 1,000 banks to go. Right now it's 0.22 cents per Ripple. Just imagine buying $200 worth now and in 10 years it's $1,000. You'd be a millionaire. Ripple is having a press conference October 16th. Buy before that. Hmm. Interesting. Edit - seems like a blockchain based payment model, not necessarily a currency (unless I'm reading this wrong). Agnostic to currency. Initial competition to guys like Syncada, Arriba, etc. Private Label, perhaps? EDIT: Ok, the coin in use with Ripple is XRP. So not exactly currency agnostic. Don't see BoA as a listed FI, and that would be a flagship brand to tout on any white paper. Mostly international, but RBC is huge in its own right, so there's weight to this one. EDIT: BMO, UBS, BBVA - ok, some hitters in this lineup. I probably won't invest, but there seems to be some interesting aspects to this. Following. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heimdallr Posted September 29, 2017 Share Posted September 29, 2017 I'm definitely gonna throw a few hundred into XRP. Ripple seems to be legit. Huge potential. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DontTazeMeBro Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 (edited) On 9/3/2017 at 9:46 AM, BayRaider said: - If the U.S. Government felt endangered by this currency, they cannot shut it down. Nobody "owns" Bitcoin and it has no servers. Bitcoin was made by an anonymous figure in 2010 named Satoshi Nakamoto. Cool name, but certainly fictional. Could they just go after companies that accept it is payment? Basically make it impossible to use and render it worthless? I don't think they ever actually shut down online poker. They just made it a pain in the balls to get money on and off the sites. If the US government wants to put a stop to something, they can usually find a way. Edit: ok. Just after posting this I immediately thought of several things the government has been trying to put an end to for years and even decades. Still wondering the first part though Edited September 30, 2017 by DontTazeMeBro Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jrry32 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 On 9/3/2017 at 7:46 AM, BayRaider said: - If the U.S. Government felt endangered by this currency, they cannot shut it down. Nobody "owns" Bitcoin and it has no servers. Bitcoin was made by an anonymous figure in 2010 named Satoshi Nakamoto. Cool name, but certainly fictional. The U.S. government can't shut it down, but they can shut it down for Americans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted September 30, 2017 Author Share Posted September 30, 2017 No they can't shut it down at all. It's a currency. It's not like many companies currently accept bitcoin. Definitely wouldn't render it useless if no company accepted it. People treat this stuff like digital gold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 5 hours ago, BayRaider said: No they can't shut it down at all. It's a currency. It's not like many companies currently accept bitcoin. Definitely wouldn't render it useless if no company accepted it. People treat this stuff like digital gold. Gold has value because you can turn it into currency. If I have an ounce of gold, I can take that to one of the Federal Banks and get roughly $1300 for it. As I've been asking since the start of this thread - can I say the same about any cryptocurrency? What IS it? What can I do with it? How does that hold value to me? If enough governments want to shut it down, it'll get shut down - very quickly, might I add. We've already seen China take a very hard line on it, the #1 economy in the world just put restrictions on coin. All it would take is the US or EU to follow suit and coins would be worth as much as those Beanie Babies we all bought in the 90s. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 11 hours ago, jrry32 said: The U.S. government can't shut it down, but they can shut it down for Americans. how? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 11 minutes ago, incognito_man said: how? Take a page out of China's playbook. Shut down all ICOs. Then you tighten the noose by restricting trades on current coins on the market. You constricict movement until even the smallest transaction is a burden to end users. It's like being a bouncer in Vegas. You don't punch anyone, it's illegal to punch someone without reason. You close in on their personal space until they want to leave, OR they give you reason to throw a punch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, EliteTexan80 said: Take a page out of China's playbook. Shut down all ICOs. Then you tighten the noose by restricting trades on current coins on the market. You constricict movement until even the smallest transaction is a burden to end users. It's like being a bouncer in Vegas. You don't punch anyone, it's illegal to punch someone without reason. You close in on their personal space until they want to leave, OR they give you reason to throw a punch. https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-02-24/even-china-can-t-kill-bitcoin Still wouldn't shut it down, IMO. There's no way to 'actually' shut it down short of controlling the internet completely. They can make it more difficult to use, but that sort of behavior might make even more people flock to it to avoid an oppressive government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 49 minutes ago, incognito_man said: https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-02-24/even-china-can-t-kill-bitcoin Still wouldn't shut it down, IMO. There's no way to 'actually' shut it down short of controlling the internet completely. They can make it more difficult to use, but that sort of behavior might make even more people flock to it to avoid an oppressive government. I'm not really putting too much stock in an op-ed written eight months ago, during an planned, temporary stoppage. I'm more interested in events afterwards... https://www.google.com/amp/s/api.cointelegraph.com/amp/v1/news/more-bad-news-ahead-for-chinese-bitcoin-ico-cryptocurrency-markets And most importantly, the "final boss" of this whole exercise: http://www.investopedia.com/news/ripple-china-central-bank-cryptocurrency/ Note the timing - one day AFTER banning all new ICOs. It's not that China is shutting down coins - it's that they're declaring a winner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 3 minutes ago, EliteTexan80 said: I'm not really putting too much stock in an op-ed written eight months ago, during an planned, temporary stoppage. I'm more interested in events afterwards... https://www.google.com/amp/s/api.cointelegraph.com/amp/v1/news/more-bad-news-ahead-for-chinese-bitcoin-ico-cryptocurrency-markets And most importantly, the "final boss" of this whole exercise: http://www.investopedia.com/news/ripple-china-central-bank-cryptocurrency/ Note the timing - one day AFTER banning all new ICOs. It's not that China is shutting down coins - it's that they're declaring a winner. I don't think Ripple is a competitor of Bitcoin whatsoever. Completely different target markets. Also, the markets have since increased upward (within days/weeks) of the Chinese issues as well. It's a robust market. In order for it to be shut down, many central governments would have to work together to ban not only exchanges into the 'meat market', but also peer-to-peer transactions (likely effectively impossible). I have no idea if bitcoin will survive or not, but the concept of a de-centralized cryptocurrency is next to impossible to shut down by any central authority by its very nature. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 29 minutes ago, incognito_man said: I don't think Ripple is a competitor of Bitcoin whatsoever You're right. Ripple is a network, like Visa, MC, Discover, AMEX. XRP is the coin to traverse down said network. Ergo, the coin that traverses down the network would be the winner. 29 minutes ago, incognito_man said: Also, the markets have since increased upward (within days/weeks) of the Chinese issues as well Which is akin to alcohol distribution increasing shortly after the announcement of prohibition in the US circa 1920. You'll see an uptick before you see the regulated drop - then you'll see the "speaksey" level activity, where you give the Vegas bouncer a reason to punch you. It's been 26 days since the law was enacted, in the largest economy in world history. It might take a while before you see the screws tightened, but they will. 29 minutes ago, incognito_man said: In order for it to be shut down, many central governments would have to work together to ban not only exchanges into the 'meat market', but also peer-to-peer transactions (likely effectively impossible). When the most powerful economy takes a stand, you see others fall in line. Like South Korea just did: https://gizmodo.com/cryptocurrency-speculators-watch-nervously-as-south-kor-1818992106 That's 26 days across two economies in the Pacific - economics is a theater of war where change is measured over decades, so this is the equivalent of a a few millionths of a second in scale. 29 minutes ago, incognito_man said: I have no idea if bitcoin will survive or not, but the concept of a de-centralized cryptocurrency is next to impossible to shut down by any central authority by its very nature. I don't understand cryptocurrencies, but I understand moving money. Ultimately, I see this as very similar to the gold vs silver standard in the 1900s. Once a centralized entity declares "the gold standard" the remainder will fall to the wayside (valuable in some capacity, but a fraction of overall value). In the 1900s, the US economy was the heavyweight, and declared the gold standard. In 2017, China is the heavyweight, and declares... ...well, all I can say is keep an eye on XRP. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 10 minutes ago, EliteTexan80 said: You're right. Ripple is a network, like Visa, MC, Discover, AMEX. XRP is the coin to traverse down said network. Ergo, the coin that traverses down the network would be the winner. Which is akin to alcohol distribution increasing shortly after the announcement of prohibition in the US circa 1920. You'll see an uptick before you see the regulated drop - then you'll see the "speaksey" level activity, where you give the Vegas bouncer a reason to punch you. It's been 26 days since the law was enacted, in the largest economy in world history. It might take a while before you see the screws tightened, but they will. When the most powerful economy takes a stand, you see others fall in line. Like South Korea just did: https://gizmodo.com/cryptocurrency-speculators-watch-nervously-as-south-kor-1818992106 That's 26 days across two economies in the Pacific - economics is a theater of war where change is measured over decades, so this is the equivalent of a a few millionths of a second in scale. I don't understand cryptocurrencies, but I understand moving money. Ultimately, I see this as very similar to the gold vs silver standard in the 1900s. Once a centralized entity declares "the gold standard" the remainder will fall to the wayside (valuable in some capacity, but a fraction of overall value). In the 1900s, the US economy was the heavyweight, and declared the gold standard. In 2017, China is the heavyweight, and declares... ...well, all I can say is keep an eye on XRP. XRP and Bitcoin aren't competitors. They serve different markets. I was not distinguishing between Ripple and its underlying "currency". Bitcoin is a true P2P blockchain network, Ripple is not. They serve different markets completely. There needn't be a single winner between them (or among other true cryptocurrencies either for that matter). Bitcoin, Ripple and Ethereum all serve completely unique markets respectively. All 3 could survive and be huge, all 3 could be replaced by some other future tech that does each of their functions better. I also think you are confusing Bitcoin and ICOs. Bitcoin certainly doesn't need unregulated/trash ICOs to be 'allowed' to continue to survive & thrive. Even within the industry, people agree the scammy ICOs are bad. Yes the market reacts wildly to really news of any type, but an ICO ban doesn't really mean much for bitcoin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 2 hours ago, incognito_man said: Bitcoin is a true P2P blockchain network, Ripple is not. https://ripple.com/solutions/send-payments/ Ripple absolutely IS a P2P blockchain network. One that rivals Visa in terms of how much volume it can handle per second, one that can facilitate fiat currencies. If Bitcoin is "true" P2P, Ripple/XRP is "evolved" P2P. 2 hours ago, incognito_man said: They serve different markets completely. There needn't be a single winner between them (or among other true cryptocurrencies either for that matter). The nature of unregulated markets - be it phone companies, electric companies, etc - is competition. If they're not competing now, they will be soon, and the first one to throw the first punch will probably end up winning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted September 30, 2017 Share Posted September 30, 2017 2 hours ago, incognito_man said: Yes the market reacts wildly to really news of any type, but an ICO ban doesn't really mean much for bitcoin. Do you really think China's ban of ICOs is the end of their stance on cryptocurrencies? This is just the beginning of them dictating the market. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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