2019 WR Corps

[Leader]

44 minutes ago, Rainmaker90 said:

I’m starting to think a WR is going to be kept in favor of M Lewis.

Could be that'll be the bone they throw to Kumerow's fans so they can keep him on and them happy

[ReadyToThump]

7 hours ago, deathstar said:

To be fair I think the catches were during the teams portion; but it just goes to show how much stuff you have to go through to get any useful info.

You are right on that my man. I recently just joined the twitter feed thing myself. Following the Packer players/reporters makes for some quick good reading while on the can. 

[incognito_man]

If Moore even shows hints of getting it the rest of camp, he's a no-brainer keep over Kumerow.

We should all be rooting for this.

[pacman5252]

1 hour ago, Cheesehawk said:

J'Mon Moore doesnt make it to week 2 on our PS if we try to stash him this year.

Unless he completely shows out in the next 3 preseason games, I highly doubt it. The fact is there are a lot of talented guys who can't play on practice squads. Moore was pick 133 last year. Some people need to stop making him out to be a better more sought after prospect than he was. A good chunk of 4th+ round picks are out of the league before their first contract is up.

[Cheesehawk]

4 minutes ago, pacman5252 said:

Unless he completely shows out in the next 3 preseason games, I highly doubt it. The fact is there are a lot of talented guys who can't play on practice squads. Moore was pick 133 last year. Some people need to stop making him out to be a better more sought after prospect than he was. A good chunk of 4th+ round picks are out of the league before their first contract is up.

Moore can play though...he looks significantly better running the field than any other guy outside of the top 4 imo. 

[deathstar]

27 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

If Moore even shows hints of getting it the rest of camp, he's a no-brainer keep over Kumerow.

We should all be rooting for this.

Moore’s not competing against Kumerow at this point, he’s competing against Davis, Shepherd, and Lazard. If Kumerow is competing against anyone it’s MVS. 

I’m not a fan, it’s just how training camp has shaked out.

[pacman5252]

28 minutes ago, Cheesehawk said:

Moore can play though...he looks significantly better running the field than any other guy outside of the top 4 imo. 

Maybe in shorts

[SSG]

21 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Rodgers was awful against Arizona.  Making any other claim is simply inaccurate.  He was awful regardless of what the receivers were doing.

Rodgers played like a coward last year. Wouldn't make a risky throw. Wouldn't stand in and take a hit to deliver a ball. 

It's ridiculous the extent some fans are willing to go to shield Rodgers.

It's not Rodgers, it's the receivers, it's McCarthy, it's the knee injury,  blah blah blah

No more ridiculous than making Rodgers out be be an inept, garbage QB.  He gets talked about like he's trash because he wasn't willing to be a reckless QB who's going to lose you more games than win.  I'm sure Jamis Winston could careless what his WRs were doing and if the outcome was 3 or 4 INTs a game.  

The idea that we had this WR core loaded with talent and a garbage QB who was trying to lose is ridiculous.  By saying he's picking throw aways instead of throwing it to "wide open" WRs is essentially accusing him of intentionally throwing football games.  

No one ever said Rodgers played great but I wish people would stop acting like it's routine for elite NFL offenses to turn 5th round rookies, 6th round rookies or random practice squad players into high end NFL starting WRs overnight.  

Edited August 15, 2019 by SSG

[Mazrimiv]

The legend of how good Moore can become grows by the day.  If nothing else, it will make for some entertaining fire Gute material when Moore doesn't make the 53.

[AlexGreen#20]

4 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

The legend of how good Moore can become grows by the day.  If nothing else, it will make for some entertaining fire Gute material when Moore doesn't make the 53.

I feel like the fact that we had an NFL scout tell us his ceiling was "Davante Adams but 2 inches taller" is fairly meaningful.

Doesn't mean he's ever going to play with the down to down intensity, fix the concentration drops, or diversify his skillset so he can play everywhere, but if those are the red flags, lord knows they're all fixable.

[skibrett15]

packers offense was more than good enough to be a playoff team last year.  Sure, they weren't top 5, but they were solidly top 10.

Arguing whether its because of rodgers or mm or the WRs when it is just so obvious that it was all 3 and more.

[incognito_man]

2 hours ago, deathstar said:

Moore’s not competing against Kumerow at this point, he’s competing against Davis, Shepherd, and Lazard. If Kumerow is competing against anyone it’s MVS. 

I’m not a fan, it’s just how training camp has shaked out.

Kumerow is fighting for a roster spot just like Moore and Davis and Shepherd.

[incognito_man]

Late add for Moore on the poll.

[SSG]

7 hours ago, CWood21 said:

There isn't anything to disagree about.

https://www.pff.com/news/pro-aaron-rodgers-set-to-shatter-throwaway-record

He was on pace to shatter that previous record, and even though I can't find an exact number for how many he finished.  You saw this throughout his games.  If Davante Adams wasn't being thrown to, he was probably the throwing the ball away.  He's incredibly risk-adverse and he's more likely to throw the ball away than trying to squeeze it in tight quarters.  If you can't watch that Arizona game and come away with the conclusion that Aaron Rodgers mailed it in, you're not trying to.

You mention how many offenses haven't had much success with lower drafted players, but let's look at last year.

Kansas City: Tyreek Hill (5th round pick), Sammy Watkins (1st round pick), Chris Conley (3rd round pick)
Los Angeles Rams: Brandin Cooks (1st round pick), Robert Woods (2nd round pick), Cooper Kupp (3rd round pick)
Los Angeles Chargers: Keenan Allen (2nd round pick), Mike Williams (1st round pick), Tyrell Wiliams (UDFA)
New Orleans: Michael Thomas (2nd round pick), Ted Ginn Jr. (1st round pick), Cameron Meredith (UDFA), Tre'Quan Smith (3rd round pick)
New England Patriots: Chris Hogan (UDFA), Philip Dorsett (1st round pick), Coradarelle Patterson (1st round pick)

All of those players who were drafted in the first round with the exception of Mike Williams were drafted by a different team.  And if their talent was as good as you think it was, they wouldn't have let them walk as FAs.  But what do they all have in common?  Exceptional QB play.  You've got Patrick Mahomes, Philip Rivers, Jared Goff, Drew Brees, and Tom Brady.  That's some of the best QBs in the NFL last year.  That's the common denominator.  Not the WRs.  If you're argument against our WRs has to do with their draft status, you're not going to hold much weight because there's actual video evidence of Rodgers refusing to throw to young WRs when they were open.  If they weren't being thrown to when they were opening, they sure as hell weren't going to be thrown to when it was a contested throw.

I never said Rodgers played good but to ignore how awful the rookies looked against Arizona is crazy.  There is a reason that MVS seen his snap count cut in half and his starting spot stripped from him until injuries forced them to put him back into the starting lineup. 

That's not what I mentioned at all.  I said low end ROOKIEs which is entirely different than talking about all pro caliber players who were drafted lower.  I'd be interested if anyone can find me an elite offense in any year that got 20 starts from low end ROOKIE draft picks.  I  went back and looked at seasons with some high profile rookie seasons and none of those teams got 20 starts out of rookies muchless bottom of the draft rookies.  Gotta wonder if Rodgers job was so easy and WR talent had nothing to do with his season then why isn't there a long list of QBs who have high end seasons with multiple low end rookie WRs starting.  

You lost me when you referred to Jared Goff as an exceptional QB?  Before Robert Woods, Sammy Watkins, Cooper Kupp and Brandin Cooks came to town he was a 55% passer who had more INTs than TDs.  There were serious concerns that he was going to be one of the biggest busts in NFL history.  The best offensive mind in the NFL came to town and the first thing he did was throw a MASSIVE amount of draft assets and money at the WR position to overhaul it. He overpaid Woods, traded a 1st rounder, 2nd rounder and starting DB for Sammy Watkins and Brandin Cooks.  He also spent a 3rd and early 4th round pick on WRs in that whirl wind.  I'd argue that there isn't a position group that McVay invested more into than WR. 

Nothing to do with the WR conversation, just a funny observation.  I smirked when I read your comment about a player's talent being questionable because they were allowed to leave in UFA.  That certainly hasn't been the standard in 100% of the Packer UFA signings.  Not only is the talent not questioned it's down right praised.    

My argument about our WR core isn't about where the WR was drafted.  I don't think it's an overly talented group past Adams and it's an opinion I've had since last year.  I'm never going to agree that Michael Thomas or Tyreek Hill are the same caliber of WR talents as MVS and EQ because they were drafted in the same range in the draft.

I could give two flying ****s about GIFS or the idea that a fan thinks he can see exactly what the QB is seeing based on a video clip.  I find the idea that Aaron Rodgers is intentionally trying to lose games to be unrealistic. That's essentially what you are accusing him of doing if you think he's picking a throwaway instead of a wide open WR running free.  If that's the case and we do indeed have a QB who's trying harder to lose games than win them then we've got bigger issues than WR.  

[SSG]

6 hours ago, Outpost31 said:

So sick of this, "We had crap receivers..." argument. 

Do people not remember the **** throws Rodgers had to MVS only to **** MVS out?  The Seattle game?  Missing him wide open literally 5 times?  The times he threw out of bounds 17 times when a receiver was open instead of hitting them in stride?

Rodgers had a crap season last year.  It was middle of the league at best.  MVS still had a top 30 season all-time for a rookie WR drafted after the 4th round. 

MVS literally ranks 172nd since the merger in receptions for a rookie receiver. 

172nd.  Since 1970. 

People need to quit acting like Rodgers had to rely on a rookie WR.  MVS was not like rookie receivers. 

MVS, since 1970, ranks 172nd in rookie receptions out of 2060 receivers. 
MVS, since 1970, ranks 154th in rookie yards out of 2060 receivers.

Rodgers did not "have to rely" on rookie receivers.  He had an elite rookie receiver since 1970 and he frequently missed him.  Wide open. 

"An elite rookie WR" who was less productive than Jarrett Boykin was in his first opportunity to start in that same #2 roll.  

Looking at production and ignoring the situation isn't all that important to me.  The fact that Jarrett Boykin was a better, more productive WR in his first opportunity to start in that #2 roll (with fewer snaps) has me questioning why production and only production is paid attention to.  

I wasn't here in 2014 but was the word elite being thrown around when JB was being discussed?  

Edited August 15, 2019 by SSG