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Dak Thread....still debating, beating a dead horse


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1 hour ago, Matts4313 said:

No he wasnt. Thats where you want that ball with a safety coming from the middle. 

Yes Gallup STOPPED then jumped and made a good catch but ball was not underthrown like Whites was later in game big difference.  If Dak has thrown it farther down field it would have allowed safety to make a play.  

Do all 22 you want I use eye test and results and after watching Football for over 40 plus years I’ve seen enough to tell a QB who can win games when needed and not make critical errors and generally throws the ball where it needs to be more often then not

Most Of the time it is a combined effort between receiver and QB. Receiver needs to learn how to run routes hold up in spaces run to the open spot and it’s up to the Qb to make the correct pass  I thought about a third deep balls missed were Gallup error BUT YES that means DAK was wrong the other times which was more often 

Obviously Dak is no where yet a complete QB especially in reading defenses but very very few young QB are  

Just like young receivers need time to adjust to the speed of the NFL game. Gallup made a lot of mistakes last year in route running  which is one of the reasons there was such a huge difference between his target/catch rate and almost all the other receivers.  I posted the numbers a long time ago in a different thread.   It was like 90% to RB TE. High 70-low 80 Cooper and Beasley. Gallup was like 58 don’t remember the exact figure

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1 hour ago, quiller said:

I thought about a third deep balls missed were Gallup error BUT YES that means DAK was wrong the other times which was more often 

Daks accuracy, according to the people who study film, was considered "Excellent" when targeting Gallup. Higher than Cooper or Bease IIRC.

So why was their connection so underwhelming?

Well, they had 13 missed opportunities (total, for the year). Of those a handful are credit to the defense. A handful were poor routes by Gallup. A handful were the fact that they were high degree of difficulty passes (20+ yards downfield). And, YES, a handful were just bad throws by Dak.

The problem is, the "hot take"/lazy people on the internet want to blame 100% of them on Dak. 

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1 hour ago, quiller said:

I’ve seen enough to tell a QB who can win games when needed and not make critical errors and generally throws the ball where it needs to be more often then not

I think this is a fair assessment of Dak even from those who hate him. Or at least it should be. 

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On 8/16/2019 at 2:53 AM, Matts4313 said:

Definitive Guide to Defending Dak to the Haters

Step 1 - Show that he is pretty good:

Daks league-wide rankings in 2016-18, 32 games played minimum

  • 8th in passer rating

  • 11th in ANY/A

  • 6th in CMP%

  • 5th in INTs

  • 7th in combined TDs

  • 2nd in wins

  • 1st in GWD

 PFR

Step 2 - Refute "the best supporting cast ever" argument:

  1. Starting Falcons '17 through 2018 the pressure rate on Dak DOUBLED

  2. F.O. ranked us the #28 worst pass blocking OL in 2018

  3. PFF ranked us #22 pass blocking OL in 2018, but the 27th worst at giving up sacks/pressures

  4. NFL.com rated our WR's DEAD LAST at getting open in 2018, excluding Amari Cooper

  5. Zeke was #22 in facing a stacked box (25% of the time). The notion that "Dak has it easy because defenses focus on Zeke" is verifiable false.

Step 3 - Show how the above affected him:

Source 1

Source 2

Step 4 - If they bring up Romo:

Prescott’s stats 2016-18: 96 passer rating, 66.1% completion percentage, 67 passing touchdowns, 7.52 adjusted yards per attempt

Tony Romo’s stats 2010-12: 95.7 passer rating, 66.4% completion percentage, 70 passing touchdowns, 7.57 adjusted yards per attempt

Source

Step 5 - Accolades:

  • Rookie of the Year (2016)

  • 32-16 regular season record

  • 1-2 playoff record

  • Been to Divisional Round twice

  • 2 NFC East titles

  • 2-Time Pro Bowler

  • First player in NFL history with 20+ passing TDs & 5+ rushing TDs in each of his first 3 seasons

  • 7th most wins all time for a 3rd year QB

  • 5th most TDs all time for a 3rd year QB

  • Highest passer rating when tied in the 4th/overtime in the past 25 years

  • Most game winning drives since entering the league on the 8th fewest opportunities

Step 6 - the Meme:

Explain that you know he isnt worth $40m/yr. Thats not the point. The point is that he is a franchise QB and deserves a contract that pays him as such.

You know if you remove Dak's name from these stats and ask should this QB get a "franchise" QB contract I think most people would say yes.  I don't think the Cowboys have much choice but to pay Dak.  It will probably land somewhere in the $35-40 million per year.  I am biased.  I like Dak.  I like his leadership.  I clearly remember the post Danny White era and the post Aikman era.  Personally I don't want to go back there.  Finding QB's who can lead a team and win is rare.  Finding those QB's and expecting a discount contract vs. current market conditions is rarer.

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2 hours ago, Northland said:

You know if you remove Dak's name from these stats and ask should this QB get a "franchise" QB contract I think most people would say yes.

Strongly disagree. I think his name is probably the coolest thing about him.

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26 minutes ago, DaBoys said:

“I have a lot of respect for, you know, most agents,” Jones told reporters. “I really do. I think they’re trying to do their job for these players. But I do think sometimes they don’t have the end game that maybe the players should and we do.”

"My employees should care more about my enterprise's bottom line than their individual welfare."

It's great when guys like Jaylon and Tyron take our extremely team-friendly deals. It's less great when Dez and Murray end up going for more than twice the cheap-*** offers Stephen gave them entering the 2014 season. I doubt 2015 would have gone quite so poorly had we settled those situations a year early. The idea that playing for the Cowboys is an honor and a privilege and if you're not willing make sacrifices to do so then you can go, sells very easily to fans who suck up Cowboys' and Texas in general exceptionalism... but I assure you that message falls on deaf ears to your actual players when your team has independent marketing deals/revenue streams outside of the league's revenue sharing but still operates under the same spending budget as everyone else. As a matter of fact, the Cowboys are actually well below league average in real cash spent on their roster over the last 3-5 years.

Telling Dak, Zeke and Amari that they have to take this sort of deal to stay (which for Zeke means no guarantees beyond the years he's already signed for) is not being well-received. At all.

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1 hour ago, WizardHawk said:

I was thinking it was definitely aimed at Zeke’s camp since both sides have made comments thru the media. 

“I think sometimes our players have to realize that their representatives don’t always have what’s in the best interest, getting the very most they can for the players may not be in the interest of their long-term future if they want to – and I’m totally [convinced] all our players do — want to win championships and keep these young players right now. I don’t think the representatives, and they’re all good ones, feel like that’s their problem.”

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Probably talking about all three in general but the thesis is keeping the team intact...

I would think Zeke's contract impacts that the least as his is the cheapest.

And he has brought this up when specifically talking about Dak in the past.

 

Giving 35 or 40 million to Dak will hurt the team more than 15 or 16 to Zeke

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Even as a big Dak supporter and believer of his abilities and potential to grow, I believe Dallas needs to play hard ball with him. Offer nothing more than 30 per now, or just stay the course and franchise him. I keep saying there has to be a way to meet in the middle. Lower guaranteed money with a huge spike if individual and team incentives are reached. playoffs,Probowl etc.. 

yeah I know, his agent wouldn't allow for that, but if Dak truly has confidence in what/will he can do, maybe JJ should try to "gamble' with that approach.

my poor example would be 30 mill per but 5-8 million bonus per year if incentives are reached type of deal.

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36 minutes ago, DaBoys said:

Probably talking about all three in general but the thesis is keeping the team intact...

Giving 35 or 40 million to Dak will hurt the team more than 15 or 16 to Zeke

Probably.

I’d disagree that paying Dak his amount hurts the team more than paying Zeke his. Zeke is easily replaced, Dak is not .... and that is all the further I’ll go on the topic.

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While I am fully on board the Zeke is easier as is any RB to replace then Dak    Looking just at $.  It is easier for the team to say give Zeke 90% say 14.5. Cooper 90% say 15.5 Then Dak 90% 36.     The trickle down is if have to go 37 to Dak.   No way will Coop or Zeke be happy with 13.5 or 14.5 respectively.   Same goes for Jones.  Get Dak done at 35.  Then Zeke will take 14.5 Coop 15.5 seeing that Dak didnt demand the moon and stars.  and maybe can get Jones signed 

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