Is Chase Daniel cause for concern?

[soulman]

1 hour ago, Tyty said:

Oh, I am incredibly comfortable and confident having Chase Daniel as our backup qb, but only if he never actually plays a down on the field. 

How much do you charge for your cynicism or because we're all friends here are you gifting it? 

[soulman]

1 hour ago, AZBearsFan said:

I think Daniel’s ability to keep us competitive against top opponents if forced into action in 2019 will find its foundation in the effectiveness of our revamped running game. Last year when forced in he was playing with a limited primary RB which limited Nagy’s ability to help him out in a lot of ways. If Montgomery is what is being billed from HH that changes a whole lot IMO. 

With that and the defense playing out of it's mind yes, it's possible.

I don't deny Daniel's knowledge of the scheme but with him playing two huge threats disappear.  He can't scramble well or threaten with read options and he's not much of a threat to go deep against you.  So everything he faces defensively tightens up with smaller windows.

IMHO we actually need a vastly different game plan that Daniel can run in order for him to be most effective.

Edited August 28, 2019 by soulman

[topwop1]

For me it's not a huge concern right now because I'm more concerned with Trubisky and how he puts together a good season, which I have full faith he'll do btw.

But as for Chase, outside of him being a great teammate and mentor he is not very good at what he does.

#1 he cannot see the field all that well due to his height, and he doesn't have great feet or running ability so that's not an ideal mix for an NFL QB.

#2 he holds on to the ball way too long and takes bad sacks which result in a lot of negative plays.

Let's hope he doesn't have to see the field at all this year outside of garbage time.

[AZBearsFan]

42 minutes ago, topwop1 said:

For me it's not a huge concern right now because I'm more concerned with Trubisky and how he puts together a good season, which I have full faith he'll do btw.

But as for Chase, outside of him being a great teammate and mentor he is not very good at what he does.

#1 he cannot see the field all that well due to his height, and he doesn't have great feet or running ability so that's not an ideal mix for an NFL QB.

#2 he holds on to the ball way too long and takes bad sacks which result in a lot of negative plays.

Let's hope he doesn't have to see the field at all this year outside of garbage time.

I’m all for finding a backup next year that’s more a skill set comp for Mitch and less a mentor. I think that’s where we should be at going forward. 

One or both of Mariota or Tannehill should be UFA next year and would fit such a mold if they’re looking for an experienced backup who can run the Nagy offense from the standpoint of a mobile, athletic QB. 

[BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW]

IF things go well this season, and we are trying to get a QB with similar skills and traits as Trubisky, we should draft a developmental guy.  I think this team is going to have hard financial decisions to make, so going cheap at backup QB would be a good-if somewhat risky-way to have a body on the bench.  And who knows, maybe he'll be able to throw left or something.

[WindyCity]

Daniel literally did the job he was required to last season.

If Mitch is hurt for more than 2-3 games the season is over.

[blkwdw13]

4 hours ago, WindyCity said:

Daniel literally did the job he was required to last season.

If Mitch is hurt for more than 2-3 games the season is over.

Who cares about last year, the Bears need to go younger, cheaper and better next year.

[Heinz D.]

17 hours ago, soulman said:

I could make that same argument but I can also make another that asks can he win that big game for all the chips against a division rival if needed? I don't feel comfortable that he can.

He's certainly capable, I don't see any reason why that's a question.  It's the odds of that that are the fuzzy part. And while Daniel is familiar with Nagy, it was still he first year on that newly revamped Bears squad, too. Did he do as well as Mitch? Well, no. But he's not a franchise quarterback. 

8 hours ago, soulman said:

Nick Foles which is why Philly won a Super Bowl.

Am I suggesting we need a #2 as good as Foles was?  You're damn right I am. 

Wait until Pace has more draft picks to work with. He'll try to get there. 

6 hours ago, soulman said:

With that and the defense playing out of it's mind yes, it's possible.

I don't deny Daniel's knowledge of the scheme but with him playing two huge threats disappear.  He can't scramble well or threaten with read options and he's not much of a threat to go deep against you.  So everything he faces defensively tightens up with smaller windows.

IMHO we actually need a vastly different game plan that Daniel can run in order for him to be most effective.

You're actually asking for quite a lot, there. Trubisky's athleticism is top notch. Having a backup approach that level is...unlikely. 

Edited August 28, 2019 by Heinz D.

[soulman]

4 hours ago, Heinz D. said:

He's certainly capable, I don't see any reason why that's a question.  It's the odds of that that are the fuzzy part. And while Daniel is familiar with Nagy, it was still he first year on that newly revamped Bears squad, too. Did he do as well as Mitch? Well, no. But he's not a franchise quarterback. 

Wait until Pace has more draft picks to work with. He'll try to get there. 

You're actually asking for quite a lot, there. Trubisky's athleticism is top notch. Having a backup approach that level is...unlikely. 

I realize I'm dealing mostly with the negatives of having to use Daniel for more than a single game but I also believe we need to be honest with ourselves and recognize that for the most part it would be negative. 

Even last year as Mitch was still learning that offense it was obvious that Daniel despite knowing the offense inside out was a significant step down from Mitch.  We've also had worse but it's still an issue.

From my perspective we're paying a #2 QB $5 mil mostly as a mentor to Mitch and I'm at the point of believing for $5 mil we should be getting a better caliber QB not a better caliber teacher.  But that's me.

This team is now squarely in it's SB window and among a few other issue such as depth at OT I feel the #2 QB spot must be upgraded. If somehow Daniel can prove he's capable of that all the better but so far he hasn't.

I feel it's way too early to begin predicting a 2020 draft list but I will say that OT and QB are two positions who should be on Pace's offseason shopping list.  The likelihood of attracting vet UFAs at both positions has risen dramatically due to our resurgence and also due to the completion of the new Halas Hall facilities.  We should at least be taking a shot at guys in that group.

Beyond that, and due to the difficulty in finding good, affordable, UFAs at those positions both are positions we should be focusing on drafting for.  We need better depth at OT and #2 QB than we currently have.  JMHO.

Edited August 29, 2019 by soulman

[WindyCity]

4 hours ago, blkwdw13 said:

Who cares about last year, the Bears need to go younger, cheaper and better next year.

Young, cheaper and better will require a pretty high pick. Which we don’t have a ton of.

Some random 5th round pick at QB is not going to wander in here and be a good backup QB. There is a reason 95% of those guys flop.

[AZBearsFan]

15 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

Young, cheaper and better will require a pretty high pick. Which we don’t have a ton of.

Some random 5th round pick at QB is not going to wander in here and be a good backup QB. There is a reason 95% of those guys flop.

Backup QBs are like tattoos - good ones are not cheap and cheap ones are seldom good. 

[soulman]

53 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

Young, cheaper and better will require a pretty high pick. Which we don’t have a ton of.

Some random 5th round pick at QB is not going to wander in here and be a good backup QB. There is a reason 95% of those guys flop.

True but we do have two second round picks and Pace's legendary ability to swap picks for a player he wants.

Windy I don't believe anyone can deny the time has come to start shopping for another younger QB.  Belicheat drafted both Jimmy G (late 2nd) and Jacoby Brissett (4th) while Brady was still nowhere near retirement.  Then he traded both and they're starting elsewhere.

The flop rate for QBs is higher than other positions no matter where they were drafted which is why you keep drafting them in hopes of scoring one who doesn't bust.  Some have even succeeded who weren't high picks or were UDFA.

How many rookie CBs, WRs, OLBs, OL, etc. do we bring in each year?  Why ignore QB?

[soulman]

45 minutes ago, AZBearsFan said:

Backup QBs are like tattoos - good ones are not cheap and cheap ones are seldom good. 

Kinda like women? 

[blkwdw13]

1 hour ago, WindyCity said:

Young, cheaper and better will require a pretty high pick. Which we don’t have a ton of.

Some random 5th round pick at QB is not going to wander in here and be a good backup QB. There is a reason 95% of those guys flop.

Yes and the Bears need to start drafting QBs to try and find that player, but finding some one better than Daniel shouldn't be that hard.

[Sugashane]

2 hours ago, blkwdw13 said:

Yes and the Bears need to start drafting QBs to try and find that player, but finding some one better than Daniel shouldn't be that hard.

Especially since he was an UFA...

 

I don't think younger, cheaper, AND better is a likely scenario. But younger, cheaper, and with more upside is a definite possibility.

Seriously, people were talking about cutting one of a few guys to get a 4th round pick, so obviously they trust Pace's judgement on draft picks, but don't think he could find a system QB to groom? Daniel was undrafted, Fitz was 7th, Mullens was undrafted, Hoyer was undrafted, McCarron was in the 5th, Keenum was undrafted, Tyrod Taylor was undrafted, etc. Starting QBs are obviously usually picked in the top two rounds but depth guys can be found later. Just as Pace has done repeatedly he drafts on upside, traits, and how coachable they are (usually a sign through leadership roles as well) and then try to train them up. Worked wonderfully for Cohen, Jackson and several others, failed for Shaheen (it seems) and a number of others.

 

But if you have a HC that is a QB, and OC that works with athletic QBs, and a QB coach in Ragone that is getting respect.... why the hell wouldn't you want to take a swing to see if you can develop? I would have been fine with Eason Stick, Minshrew, or Tyree Jackson in the 7th. If you don't believe in those guys then don't take the swing but even if you miss you never get fired for missing on a 5th round pick. Especially since there isn't a single of the 22 base positions with a good hit rate that late in the draft.

 

Draft a kid you like the upside on, keep a vet that has some real game experience for 1-2 years and then trust that your coaching staff develops your 3rd string QB in those 2 years. You aren't looking for a starter, just a guy who runs the system similarly to the starting QB and can keep from blowing the game for you.