The "Kick the Tires" Thread (Other Teams Cuts)

[beekay414]

13 minutes ago, cannondale said:

Ben is injured. That Steelers pick could be valued as high as in the 1300 range. The Packers pick looks like it may be worth 740 or less. which means our second round pick could be in the ballpark of 340. So yeah. Do the math

Yeah, good thing the ONLY thing you can use in trades are draft picks. Even then, spare me the trade value chart bullcrap. I highly doubt NFL GMs sit down and go over that chart as the sole way to gauge the value they are getting.

Whatever, I don't really care anymore. We definitely, absolutely, totally MUST use our 1st on our future right tackle. Considering 75% of NFL starters at RT weren't taken in that round.

Edited September 17, 2019 by beekay414

[cannondale]

Just now, beekay414 said:

Yeah, good thing the ONLY thing you can use in trades are draft picks. Even then, spare me the trade value chart bullcrap. I highly doubt NFL GMs sit down and go over that chart as a way to gauge the value they are getting. 

I can guarantee you the Packers deal wouldn't have taken their 1st and 2nd but you do you.

Are you serious ? The Dolphins don't want players. They are tanking. They want picks. And yes, GMs do consult a value chart for every single trade. The more you talk about this the more you are showing a lacking of the basics

[beekay414]

4 minutes ago, cannondale said:

And yes, GMs do consult a value chart for every single trade

Yep. I'm sure they do. I'm sure the absolute only way to up the package would've been to upgrade only one of the picks involved. You can't tell me a 2020 1st, a 2020 3rd and a 2021 3rd isn't a better package than what the Steelers offered. 

2020 1st, 2020 3rd, 2021 conditional 3rd for what the Steelers received is a better return. Totally would've cost us our 2nd. 

Doesn't matter anymore. We absolutely must take our future RT with our 2020 1st. It's an absolute must. I mean, we cannot possibly think about going another route with that pick. 

Edited September 17, 2019 by beekay414

[beekay414]

37 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

Starting NFL Right Tackles by draft position
Arizona - Justin Murray (2016, UDFA)
Atlanta - Kaleb McGary (2019 - 1.31)
Baltimore - Orlando Brown (2018 - 3.83)
Buffalo - Cody Ford (2019, 2.38)
Carolina - Taylor Moton (2017, 2.64)
Chicago - Bobby Massie (2012, 4.112)
Cincinnati - Bobby Hart (2015, 7.226) - Jonah Williams on IR (2019, 1.11)
Cleveland - Chris Hubbard (2013, UDFA)
Dallas - La'el Collins (2015, UDFA) - 1st round prospect; fell because of unwarranted off field stuff
Denver - Ja'Wuan James (2014, 1.19)
Detroit - Rick Wagner (2013, 5.168)
Green Bay - Bryan Bulaga (2010, 1.23)
Houston - Seantrel Henderson (2014, 7.237)
Indianapolis - Braden Smith (2018, 2.37)
Jacksonville - Jawaan Taylor (2019, 2.35)
Kansas City - Mitchell Schwartz (2012, 2.37)
Los Angeles Chargers - Sam Tevi (2017, 6.190)
Los Angeles Rams - Rob Havenstein (2015, 2.57)
Miami - Isaiah Prince (2019, 6.202)
Minnesota - Brian O'Neill (2018, 2.62)
New England - Marcus Cannon (2011, 5.138)
New Orleans - Ryan Ramczyk (2017, 1.32)
New York Giants - Mike Remmers (2012, UDFA)
New York Jets - Brandon Shell (2016, 5.158)
Oakland - Trent Brown (2015, 7.244)
Philadelphia - Lane Johnson (2013, 1.4)
Pittsburgh - Matt Feiler (2014, UDFA)
Seattle - Germain Ifedi (2016, 1.31)
San Francisco - Mike McGlinchey (2018, 1.9)
Tampa Bay - Demar Dotson (2009, UDFA)
Tennessee - Jack Conklin (2016, 1.8)
Washington - Morgan Moses (2014, 3.66)

A whopping EIGHT starting NFL right tackles were selected in the 1st round. Definitely gotta make sure we pidgeonhole ourselves into taking our future RT in the 1st!

We absolutely, positively have to take our future RT with our mid-to-late 1st. That's where 9% of the league found their RT!

Edited September 17, 2019 by beekay414

[cannondale]

2 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

Yep. I'm sure they do. I'm sure the absolute only way to up the package would've been to upgrade only one of the picks involved. You can't tell me a 2020 1st, a 2020 3rd and a 2021 3rd isn't a better package than what the Steelers offered. 

2020 1st, 2020 3rd, 2021 conditional 3rd for what the Steelers received is a better return. Totally would've cost us our 2nd. 

Doesn't matter anymore. We absolutely must take our future RT with our 2020 1st. It's an absolute must. I mean, we cannot possibly think about going another route with that pick. 

Yeah I'm done here. Just press triangle circle square to override the system and make the trade so you can be happy.

[beekay414]

3 minutes ago, cannondale said:

Yeah I'm done here. Just press triangle circle square to override the system and make the trade so you can be happy.

Yeah, I'm totally approaching this from a madden perspective. Give me a ******* break. Someone disagrees with you and you immediately go the "I'm smarter than you" route. Get the **** outta here with that nonsense.

You're of the idea that we absolutely have to take our future RT with our mid-to-late 1st despite the fact that a whopping 4 starters (including Bulaga) in the league were taken in that range. In fact, more RT starters were found on day 2 than in that range. But, yeah, sure, you know better than I do.

Edited September 17, 2019 by beekay414

[cannondale]

Just now, beekay414 said:

Yeah, I'm totally approaching this from a madden perspective. Give me a ******* break. Someone disagrees with you and you immediately go the "I'm smarter than you" route. Get the **** outta here with that nonsense.

You're of the idea that we absolutely have to take our future RT with our mid-to-late 1st despite the fact that a whopping 3 starters (including Bulaga) in the league were taken in that range. In fact, more RT starters were found on day 2 than in that range. But, yeah, sure, you know better than I do.

I'm not the one clueless about the trade value chart. 

[beekay414]

2 minutes ago, cannondale said:

I'm not the one clueless about the trade value chart. 

lol okay. I forgot, it's the be all, end all. 

Get off your high horse. Love how you're ignoring the post about NFL RTs. 4 of 32 NFL starters were taken in the draft range we're projected to be in yet we absolutely have to take our future RT with that pick. Yep. I'm clueless. Based on what I'm seeing, we're better off trading out of the 1st into the early 2nd to make that pick and acquiring more assets. But, sure, we need to take a tackle in the 1st.

Edited September 17, 2019 by beekay414

[deathstar]

If anyone wants to learn more about how GMs operate, there’s some really good videos that show the Colts’ GM during the draft this year. Really interesting how he goes about trades and communicates with his staff. 

[cannondale]

2 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

lol okay. I forgot, it's the be all, end all. 

Get off your high horse. Love how you're ignoring the post about NFL RTs. 4 of 32 NFL starters were taken in the draft range we're projected to be in yet we absolutely have to take our future RT with that pick. Yep. I'm clueless. 

I don't own a horse. 

[beekay414]

1 minute ago, cannondale said:

I don't own a horse. 

Yep. Keep ignoring it. Ignorance is bliss.

[pacman5252]

57 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

Starting NFL Right Tackles by draft position
Arizona - Justin Murray (2016, UDFA)
Atlanta - Kaleb McGary (2019 - 1.31)
Baltimore - Orlando Brown (2018 - 3.83)
Buffalo - Cody Ford (2019, 2.38)
Carolina - Taylor Moton (2017, 2.64)
Chicago - Bobby Massie (2012, 4.112)
Cincinnati - Bobby Hart (2015, 7.226) - Jonah Williams on IR (2019, 1.11)
Cleveland - Chris Hubbard (2013, UDFA)
Dallas - La'el Collins (2015, UDFA) - 1st round prospect; fell because of unwarranted off field stuff
Denver - Ja'Wuan James (2014, 1.19)
Detroit - Rick Wagner (2013, 5.168)
Green Bay - Bryan Bulaga (2010, 1.23)
Houston - Seantrel Henderson (2014, 7.237)
Indianapolis - Braden Smith (2018, 2.37)
Jacksonville - Jawaan Taylor (2019, 2.35)
Kansas City - Mitchell Schwartz (2012, 2.37)
Los Angeles Chargers - Sam Tevi (2017, 6.190)
Los Angeles Rams - Rob Havenstein (2015, 2.57)
Miami - Isaiah Prince (2019, 6.202)
Minnesota - Brian O'Neill (2018, 2.62)
New England - Marcus Cannon (2011, 5.138)
New Orleans - Ryan Ramczyk (2017, 1.32)
New York Giants - Mike Remmers (2012, UDFA)
New York Jets - Brandon Shell (2016, 5.158)
Oakland - Trent Brown (2015, 7.244)
Philadelphia - Lane Johnson (2013, 1.4)
Pittsburgh - Matt Feiler (2014, UDFA)
Seattle - Germain Ifedi (2016, 1.31)
San Francisco - Mike McGlinchey (2018, 1.9)
Tampa Bay - Demar Dotson (2009, UDFA)
Tennessee - Jack Conklin (2016, 1.8)
Washington - Morgan Moses (2014, 3.66)

A whopping EIGHT starting NFL right tackles were selected in the 1st round. Definitely gotta make sure we pidgeonhole ourselves into taking our future RT in the 1st!

Yes the data here (as does many positions) says you don’t need to be pigeon holed into a tackle high (or any position). You can develop one. Our biggest issue though is we don’t have a viable development option that deserves the job (unless you really like Alex Light). Our planned hedge (Spriggs) was a complete whiff. The realistic 2020 options right now are all less than ideal;

- Alex Light

- Extending Bulaga 

- Multiple pick trade for someone ready

-FA (which good tackles don’t typically become available, unless they are in year 10 or have had injuries like an Okung).

-Billy Turner (who sucked at tackle in Denver)

-Draft pick 

 

No offense to Alex Light but pretty much all of these look like  major negative options with the exception of drafting one round one.

[cannondale]

29 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

Yep. Keep ignoring it. Ignorance is bliss.

Oh you want to cling to your final hope ?

Your list is irrelevant. If Bulaga leaves, replacing him is necessary in the span of one off season. There is no time to groom someone. I highly doubt Gute spends $10m per on a OT in FA with Clark's contract pending and the money already invested in Bak and Turner. OT on a budget in FA is going to get you someone like Spriggs. So that pretty much leaves the draft. Because of the need to have an immediate starter, it's probably advisable to draft someone in a higher round since the better players are drafted first. Wishing upon a star to grab a Tauscher in the 7th ends in a dumpster fire 99 times out of 100.  I already know you hate the idea because you'd rather have a sparkly, twinkly, shiny, pick at a glamour position. That's on you to come to terms with

Edited September 17, 2019 by cannondale

[beekay414]

25 minutes ago, cannondale said:

 I already know you hate the idea because you'd rather have a sparkly, twinkly, shiny, pick at a glamour position

Oh yeah? You know what I'd go with? BPA. Talent. It has nothing to do with a "shiny" position. If I had a choice between our QBotf and our RTotf, I'm going with the QB because those are far more difficult to find than a friggin' RT. If you've looked at literally anything I've ever posted on here, I've already said we aren't going to take a WR, ILB or TE with that pick. I also said, if we ARE going to take a tackle with that pick, trade back into the early 2nd and grab another asset. That range has proven to be the best area to land a RT. Pidgeonholing yourself into a certain pick is just bad business. LIS before, we're also getting too far ahead of ourselves automatically thinking Bulaga leaves because of Ted Thompson's past principles. Gute has proven he's not TT. LIS before, if Gute was so worried about Bulaga's replacement, he would've done something about it last draft when there were ample opportunities to land a RTotf in our draft range. I highly doubt he thought about the 5th year option and made that the key point into why we would or wouldn't take the tackle last year. 

But yeah, keep pretending you know my thought process. 

Edited September 17, 2019 by beekay414

[cannondale]

2 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

Oh yeah? You know what I'd go with? BPA. Talent. It has nothing to do with a "shiny" position. If I had a choice between our QBotf and our RTotf, I'm going with the QB because those are far more difficult to find than a friggin' RT. If you've looked at literally anything I've ever posted on here, I've already said we aren't going to take a WR, ILB or TE with that pick. I also said, if we ARE going to take a tackle with that pick, trade back into the early 2nd and grab another asset. That range has proven to be the best area to land a RT. Pidgeonholing yourself into a certain pick is just bad business. LIS before, we're also getting too far ahead of ourselves automatically thinking Bulaga leaves because of Ted Thompson's past principles. Gute has proven he's not TT. LIS before, if Gute was so worried about Bulaga's replacement, he would've done something about it last draft when there were ample opportunities to land a RTotf in our draft range. I highly doubt he thought about the 5th year option and said "man, we need to put this off because we gotta have that option."

But yeah, keep pretending you know my thought process. 

Well you also highly doubted he worried about a trade value chart, so I'll end it right there.