Mind Character Posted November 5, 2019 Share Posted November 5, 2019 2 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: Yeah the turnaround has been wild. People always talk about players regressing once teams get film, but Baker wasn’t using smoke and mirrors last year, just reading defenses and making plays. That’s what makes this year so weird. Someone is not communicating or understanding or adapting and we have the most disjointed offense I can recall relative to talent. You're right. It's a truly strange season. Last year though we had so many designed plays that involved QB movement that would essentially give Baker half-field reads so he could be decisive. It's very strange that we have moved away from those. We also keep running the same over route OBJ/Callaway with Jarvis underneath on a drag route 1 to 2 read plays. So, even when Baker goes to progression 1, the defense through film study knows that ultimately know where his eyes are coming back to and where he's going with the ball. It's surprising that we never take any deep shots to keep the defense honest and increase box spacing. We never threaten the defenses with anything so they all just sit on underneath routes and make it hard for Baker to sift through the noise. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 1 hour ago, Mind Character said: You're right. It's a truly strange season. Last year though we had so many designed plays that involved QB movement that would essentially give Baker half-field reads so he could be decisive. It's very strange that we have moved away from those. We also keep running the same over route OBJ/Callaway with Jarvis underneath on a drag route 1 to 2 read plays. So, even when Baker goes to progression 1, the defense through film study knows that ultimately know where his eyes are coming back to and where he's going with the ball. It's surprising that we never take any deep shots to keep the defense honest and increase box spacing. We never threaten the defenses with anything so they all just sit on underneath routes and make it hard for Baker to sift through the noise. The idea behind keeping Freddie was to keep progressing the offense obviously, but this offense looks nothing like that offense last year. Freddie took more deep shots last year per game than we’ve seen all season, and I don’t think that’s hyperbole. We we’re attacking on all fronts and now we look like a disjointed, timid group. How that happens when you add OBJ is beyond me. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted November 6, 2019 Share Posted November 6, 2019 1 hour ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: The idea behind keeping Freddie was to keep progressing the offense obviously, but this offense looks nothing like that offense last year. Freddie took more deep shots last year per game than we’ve seen all season, and I don’t think that’s hyperbole. We we’re attacking on all fronts and now we look like a disjointed, timid group. How that happens when you add OBJ is beyond me. Truth. It also tells me that Monken maybe should get a chance at play-calling before the season is up because he's the only person that has pushed back against Freddie and Baker's points suggesting that "we can't force it to OBJ" as Monken explicitly has said repeatedly in public statements "sometimes OBJ is doubled but often he's not and we have to take advantage of those potential explosive plays no matter what." Explosive deep shots mixed in with the quick rhythm game along with a lot of play action was Monken's calling card as an OC. That's what got me excited about his hiring. If we really are going to get rid of Freddie, the rest of the offensive coaches are likely to go with him out the door so before that eventuality I'd at least like to see what Monken does with the play-calling. The problem for Freddie would then be that he doesn't have the track record for the players to respect him as the head guy after he's been demoted for essentially not doing his OC job well. Will be interesting to see where stuff goes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 (edited) Jarvis Landry was wide open if Baker is on time on our final offensive play. As much as it would've been great to go to OBJ one on one, it was an easy completion to Jarvis if Baker isn't late with bringing his eyes off the RB and doesn't hitch shuffle twice before throwing it to Jarvis. The troubling part is that the entire defense declared Man including the safeties. So, if he was reading it correctly he would know that OBJ would've been 1 on 1 and Callaway would be clearing out for Jarvis to have 1 on 1 underneath. No disguises nothing crazy. Set Hut, ball snapped, Baker's eyes go to the RB at the Mesh route with OBJ. The eyes stay on the RB for a long time as the 1st read then come back to Jarvis late. If he throws it right away, it's good and Jarvis gets more yards. His eyes are slow and his feet are slow and the ball comes out late. End of game. The really troubling thing to me is the fact that when the coverage is simple, when the pockets are clean, and the moment is big for some reason Baker isn't seeing it well or processing it well. He's in a funk. Something is going on. He never had eyes this bad even when he wasn't reading things well. I'm starting to really worry that Ryan Linley or some other thing is ruining Baker. We need to help him break out of this so things down become longterm habits. Edited November 7, 2019 by Mind Character 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 THIS is an absolute embarrassment and it's not just play-calling/play design. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 1 hour ago, MWil23 said: THIS is an absolute embarrassment and it's not just play-calling/play design. Bu...bu...but Freddie! He’s the one who designed a play where the defensive guys are blocked knowing damned well Baker doesn’t do well when no under pressure. Fire him now! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgpoun8017 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 What’s wrong with baker.... he’s a 2nd year QB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 4 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: Bu...bu...but Freddie! He’s the one who designed a play where the defensive guys are blocked knowing damned well Baker doesn’t do well when no under pressure. Fire him now! Exactly! It's time for people to understand Baker needs to own his deficiencies. I'm not giving up on him, but his regression is ALARMING, and it's not on his OL/WR to the degree that we've made it. He's holding onto the ball too long because he can't read coverages and is slow getting to his secondary WR. He doesn't know where his primary WR should be coming out of the huddle and he's consistently late across the middle of the field (that's about worst case scenario too...late across the middle is a disaster waiting to happen). He's got 1 dynamic WR and another really good one, with a great running game. He should at least be hovering around "average" range as a young QB, and he's been a dumpster fire. I'm giving him 3 full offseasons and another 24 games to figure it out, but this regression is alarming and is more than "herp/derp coaching, herp derp OLine, herp/derp 2nd year struggles". 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 12 minutes ago, Dawgpoun8017 said: What’s wrong with baker.... he’s a 2nd year QB I think this is a lot of it. I also think Freddie, Monken and the rest of the world assumed he was further along in his development and put too much on his plate too quickly. Scale things back, half field progressions, easy completions, run the ball and build his confidence again. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 It's funny to me how savvy coaches like Andy Reid/McVeigh gave Mahomes and Goff a condensed version of the gameplan/playbook as 2nd and even 3rd year guys and decided to break the huddle soon and diagram/create mismatches with motions and in the slot to help these guys out. The "experts" criticize Reid and McVeigh for their lack of 2 minute success early on, but these coaches realize that these young QB's aren't ready for this type of offensive gameplan/situation, and so they end up getting about 56 minutes of quality QB play out of their young guys instead of 60, whereas we essentially get almost zero. It's infuriating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mind Character Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 (edited) 6 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said: I think this is a lot of it. I also think Freddie, Monken and the rest of the world assumed he was further along in his development and put too much on his plate too quickly. Scale things back, half field progressions, easy completions, run the ball and build his confidence again. So you're saying that we should design the offense as if our 2nd year QB is actually a 2nd year QB? Fascinating... It's crazy that we don't give Baker easy completions to get his rhythm going and flowing. Flow can be established even with deep shots as it let's the QB let it go and energizes the offense and threatens the defense. The entirety of the Eagles, Chiefs, and Patriots offenses are about designing Easy completions to give the offense some momentum building and rhythm. Flow is real. Natural ability and talent take over when the flow is going. Our offense has not pace nor rhythm. I remember a time when we would go no huddle just to vary pace. That's dead as is so much other positive stuff we used to do. Edited November 7, 2019 by Mind Character 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kiwibrown Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 8 hours ago, MWil23 said: THIS is an absolute embarrassment and it's not just play-calling/play design. Some of it is his wrs hands 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 15 minutes ago, Mind Character said: So you're saying that we should design the offense as if our 2nd year QB is actually a 2nd year QB? Fascinating... That’s why they pay me the big bucks chief. 15 minutes ago, Mind Character said: It's crazy that we don't give Baker easy completions to get his rhythm going and flowing. Flow can be established even with deep shots as it let's the QB let it go and energizes the offense and threatens the defense. Completely agree. 15 minutes ago, Mind Character said: The entirety of the Eagles, Chiefs, and Patriots offenses are about designing Easy completions to give the offense some momentum building and rhythm. Flow is real. Natural ability and talent take over when the flow is going. Our offense has not pace nor rhythm. I remember a time when we would go no huddle just to vary pace. That's dead as is so much other positive stuff we used to do. Agree with all of this. Im not sure if they’re trying to show that Baker can run advanced concepts or the depth of a playbook or what, but the end product looks disjointed and as if they’re making it harder than it has to be. It’s just such a 180 from last year when Freddie seemed to understand and incorporate everything we’re talking about. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LETSGOBROWNIES Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 13 minutes ago, Kiwibrown said: Some of it is his wrs hands True story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomas5737 Posted November 7, 2019 Share Posted November 7, 2019 We need a quick pace offense, that's where Baker thrives. Even in college once the game was out of control and they played the run the clock offense you could see him get out of rhythm. Now we are almost always lining up with 7 or 8 seconds on the play clock and from there everything seems rushed. I'm not necessarily saying have a base hurry up offense but I'm not not saying it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.