Packers Trade Trevor Davis to Raiders

[Uffdaswede]

46 minutes ago, ReadyToThump said:

@Uffdaswede

Why can't we be piranhas? Or for more geographical accuracy, muskellunge? Why do we have to be the **** eating catfish??

On the one hand no analogy is perfect. On the other hand, having answered my stupid post, describe the taste in your mouth. 🤪

As other posters had mentioned, the most puzzling aspect of the Davis trade is that he looked like a potential contributor at WR really for the first time in the preseason. Also, though I know not everyone agrees, I thought he was a good returner.

 Whether due to loyalty or an overabundance if patience, Ted the GM didn’t churn the bottom of the roster much in season. Whether moves like this are smart or not I don’t know, but Gute’s approach is sure entertaining.

 

[Cheech]

17 minutes ago, Uffdaswede said:

On the one hand no analogy is perfect. On the other hand, having answered my stupid post, describe the taste in your mouth. 🤪

As other posters had mentioned, the most puzzling aspect of the Davis trade is that he looked like a potential contributor at WR really for the first time in the preseason. Also, though I know not everyone agrees, I thought he was a good returner.

 Whether due to loyalty or an overabundance if patience, Ted the GM didn’t churn the bottom of the roster much in season. Whether moves like this are smart or not I don’t know, but Gute’s approach is sure entertaining.

 

I haven't paid nearly enough attention...  are there guys on the 53 that have come from churning the bottom of the roster the last 2 years?  

Will Redmond comes to mind - any more?  Was Raven Green another?

[Uffdaswede]

8 minutes ago, Cheech said:

I haven't paid nearly enough attention...  are there guys on the 53 that have come from churning the bottom of the roster the last 2 years?  

Will Redmond comes to mind - any more?  Was Raven Green another?

Good question. Tremon Smith may be demonstrative. Is he plugged in and contributing on teams from the get go or first one released when the next fish is hooked

[TheGreatZepp]

11 minutes ago, Uffdaswede said:

Good question. Tremon Smith may be demonstrative. Is he plugged in and contributing on teams from the get go or first one released when the next fish is hooked

Well I definitely think he could be the next one released again, he’s needs to prove it everyday and contribute or what is he doing here? The bottom 10 players on the roster can never take their foot off the gas. It’s kinda unfair that one bad day could cost them their job but that’s a lot of places

[ThatJerkDave]

1 hour ago, ReadyToThump said:

@Uffdaswede

Why can't we be piranhas? Or for more geographical accuracy, muskellunge? Why do we have to be the **** eating catfish??

You know why WE have to be the **** eating catfish.  

[deathstar]

1 hour ago, Cheech said:

I haven't paid nearly enough attention...  are there guys on the 53 that have come from churning the bottom of the roster the last 2 years?  

Will Redmond comes to mind - any more?  Was Raven Green another?

Lazard and Vitale. 

[firstdown]

5 hours ago, incognito_man said:

add in heart arythmia. had a heart ultrasound today. Was the youngest one in that waiting room today by a few decades

Get off the salt right away. Salt is in almost everything. Chips, salad dressing, restaurant food, avocado dip, even cheese curds haha. it's everywhere. Be careful. It messes up the electrical pulses of your heart, especially when you consume a lot of salt on an empty stomach. Restaurants are notorious for piling on the salt.

[incognito_man]

Just now, firstdown said:

Get off the salt right away. Salt is in almost everything. Chips, salad dressing, restaurant food, avocado dip, even cheese curds haha. it's everywhere. Be careful. It messes up the electrical pulses of your heart, especially when you consume a lot of salt on an empty stomach. Restaurants are notorious for piling on the salt.

Thanks. Im actually a very health conscious eater. My CBC came back very good, doc actually thinks a virus may be causing it (I guess that's a thing).

Anyway, had an ultrasound today and should know more tomorrow too (if theres any mechanical concern anyway).

[Sasquatch]

10 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

Thanks. Im actually a very health conscious eater. My CBC came back very good, doc actually thinks a virus may be causing it (I guess that's a thing).

Anyway, had an ultrasound today and should know more tomorrow too (if theres any mechanical concern anyway).

Tell your Doctor you think it’s EFSSS.  It affects millions of folks every year at this time.  He’ll know how to treat it.

[ThatJerkDave]

4 hours ago, Cheech said:

I haven't paid nearly enough attention...  are there guys on the 53 that have come from churning the bottom of the roster the last 2 years?  

Will Redmond comes to mind - any more?  Was Raven Green another?

Are you talking about guys that have worked their way up the depth chart, or players from other teams added mid season?

We have quite a few.  I am not going to be too strict on the 2 years, but these players all joined the team by UDFA or practice squad, and (I think) didn't make the opening day roster their rookie season (I italicized players that I think may have made their first roster) :

Offense:  Jake Kumerow, Alan Lazard, Alex Light, Lucas Patrick, Robert Tonyan, Geronimo Allison, Darrius Shepherd, Tim Boyle, Danny Vitale, Evan Baylis, Lane Taylor

Defense:  Fadol Brown, Tyler Lancaster, Tony Brown, Chandon Sullivan, Tramon Williams, Tremon Smith, Will Redmond

You also have Curtis Bolton, Raven Greene, Malcolm Johnson, and Ibraheim Campbell on IR/PUP

Take away the TT guys (I think Light, Patrick, Tonyan, Allison, Taylor, Brown, Williams) and we have 11 players from this roster churning directly from Gute.  I'm sure it cycles with draft pick accumulation as well.  We just replaced a roster churn guy, Reggie Gilbert, with Rashan Gary.  Next season we will probably replace Kyler Fackrell with a roster churn guy like Randy Ramsey.

[craig]

Dave, I think most of those are our own UDFA, signed originally by us.  I think we all understand that some UDFA's make it, and that in the National Injury League that injured guys need to be replaced from the practice squad.  

But I think the question is more maybe whether midseason pickup guys have much record of impact?  

Or perhaps to phrase it differently, if a guy is judged unworthy by his previous team and is then released, how often do those guys end up being pretty useful players who get used extensively and used productively by the Packers?  

I'm thinking some of the names of released-elsewhere and picked up include:  Kumerow, Vitale, Fadol, Redmond, and now Tremon.  (I may not be remembering, maybe somebody like Sullivan was released elsewhere and then we snagged him, beats me.)  

I may be forgetting some, but it's not clear yet that Kumero, Vitale, Fadol, or Tremon will actually contribute much to a winning team.  So if those are the proof-of-principle "victories" that "churning" produces and pays off, I'm not sure all of the posters will find it super convincing!

Or was Tony Brown a "churn" guy, rather than just an UDFA who we signed first and kept?  He's definitely a snaps guy, and while he's crazy, he's not bad and is better than next-man-up.  

With Josh Jones gone and Raven Green injured, Redmond is now a guy who might play A LOT.  I'm not scout enough to know, but on Sunday he didn't look to be outstandingly incompetent.  So, he could end up being a pretty significant and functional payoff for the "churn"?    

[craig]

So, we've gotten enthusiastic posts about Tremon Smith:  very fast, maybe faster than Tyreke; excellent return guy; gunner (I think I read that); 6th round talent....

So, answer me this:  *IF* he's so talented and promising and athletic, then why did his bosses release him?  1.  Because whatever his 40-time may be, that he's got no capacity or future potential to be able to ever play from scrimmage, and he's clearly limited to being ST only, both now and forever?   2.  Because his decision-making is problematic?  3.  Because whether it's smart or dumb,  KC just chooses not to use roster spots on ST-only guys, and either dumbly or wisely we do?   4.  Or does he have bad hands, so that he can run fast if he can catch it, but they viewed him as unreliable?  5.  Or are there off-field professionalism baggage issues in play?  

I always just wonder, because I think the tendency of teams is to appreciate their own guys, and to extra-patient developmentally with both draft picks and with exceptionally fast guys.  That his own team dumped him so quickly despite his speed; and despite being a draft pick; and despite only camp-plus-2-weeks of 2nd-year-jump opportunity, makes me assume the evaluators at KC perceived some show-stopper problem with him... and odds are they'll be right.  

But maybe KC's roster is just so much deeper than ours that they can't fit all of their talent and developmental prospects, beats me.  

[vegas492]

1 minute ago, craig said:

So, we've gotten enthusiastic posts about Tremon Smith:  very fast, maybe faster than Tyreke; excellent return guy; gunner (I think I read that); 6th round talent....

So, answer me this:  *IF* he's so talented and promising and athletic, then why did his bosses release him?  1.  Because whatever his 40-time may be, that he's got no capacity or future potential to be able to ever play from scrimmage, and he's clearly limited to being ST only, both now and forever?   2.  Because his decision-making is problematic?  3.  Because whether it's smart or dumb,  KC just chooses not to use roster spots on ST-only guys, and either dumbly or wisely we do?   4.  Or does he have bad hands, so that he can run fast if he can catch it, but they viewed him as unreliable?  5.  Or are there off-field professionalism baggage issues in play?  

I always just wonder, because I think the tendency of teams is to appreciate their own guys, and to extra-patient developmentally with both draft picks and with exceptionally fast guys.  That his own team dumped him so quickly despite his speed; and despite being a draft pick; and despite only camp-plus-2-weeks of 2nd-year-jump opportunity, makes me assume the evaluators at KC perceived some show-stopper problem with him... and odds are they'll be right.  

But maybe KC's roster is just so much deeper than ours that they can't fit all of their talent and developmental prospects, beats me.  

Take that to the KC board and let us know how they answer it.

I don't know the player, like at all, but on the surface, it seems like he was bouncing between playing on offense and defense.  No real home.  

On specials, you gonna use him or Hill?  Yah, easy call to use Hill.  And they just drafted another super fast WR that I assume has some return ability.

Could just be that he wasn't a great fit on offense or defense and he wasn't the primary specials guy.  

To be fair, I'm unsure if he is our specials guy either.  Sounds like Shepherd is going to do that.  My guess is that someone on our staff kept a good file on him from the draft and thinks they have something to work with.  Kind of how the bottom of the roster works.  Always looking for the upside.

[pacman5252]

15 hours ago, craig said:

So, we've gotten enthusiastic posts about Tremon Smith:  very fast, maybe faster than Tyreke; excellent return guy; gunner (I think I read that); 6th round talent....

So, answer me this:  *IF* he's so talented and promising and athletic, then why did his bosses release him?  1.  Because whatever his 40-time may be, that he's got no capacity or future potential to be able to ever play from scrimmage, and he's clearly limited to being ST only, both now and forever?   2.  Because his decision-making is problematic?  3.  Because whether it's smart or dumb,  KC just chooses not to use roster spots on ST-only guys, and either dumbly or wisely we do?   4.  Or does he have bad hands, so that he can run fast if he can catch it, but they viewed him as unreliable?  5.  Or are there off-field professionalism baggage issues in play?  

I always just wonder, because I think the tendency of teams is to appreciate their own guys, and to extra-patient developmentally with both draft picks and with exceptionally fast guys.  That his own team dumped him so quickly despite his speed; and despite being a draft pick; and despite only camp-plus-2-weeks of 2nd-year-jump opportunity, makes me assume the evaluators at KC perceived some show-stopper problem with him... and odds are they'll be right.  

But maybe KC's roster is just so much deeper than ours that they can't fit all of their talent and developmental prospects, beats me.  

Based on a few articles I read, Smith was cut because he didn’t have a position (moved around from corner to HB) and KC thinks they have a wr who can contribute and return.

I totally get it. It’s hard to justify a spot for a dedicated returner. I’m personally not expecting much from Smith. Slight margin gain on kr (doesn’t really matter), questions at pr. Maybe Smith develops into a spot corner or rb. We’ve seen many guys like him never pick up a position though

[Greg C.]

16 hours ago, craig said:

Dave, I think most of those are our own UDFA, signed originally by us.  I think we all understand that some UDFA's make it, and that in the National Injury League that injured guys need to be replaced from the practice squad.  

But I think the question is more maybe whether midseason pickup guys have much record of impact?  

Or perhaps to phrase it differently, if a guy is judged unworthy by his previous team and is then released, how often do those guys end up being pretty useful players who get used extensively and used productively by the Packers?  

I'm thinking some of the names of released-elsewhere and picked up include:  Kumerow, Vitale, Fadol, Redmond, and now Tremon.  (I may not be remembering, maybe somebody like Sullivan was released elsewhere and then we snagged him, beats me.)  

I may be forgetting some, but it's not clear yet that Kumero, Vitale, Fadol, or Tremon will actually contribute much to a winning team.  So if those are the proof-of-principle "victories" that "churning" produces and pays off, I'm not sure all of the posters will find it super convincing!

Or was Tony Brown a "churn" guy, rather than just an UDFA who we signed first and kept?  He's definitely a snaps guy, and while he's crazy, he's not bad and is better than next-man-up.  

With Josh Jones gone and Raven Green injured, Redmond is now a guy who might play A LOT.  I'm not scout enough to know, but on Sunday he didn't look to be outstandingly incompetent.  So, he could end up being a pretty significant and functional payoff for the "churn"?    

Pete Dougherty of packersnews mentioned in a couple of his chats during the preseason that Gutekunst likes to "churn" the bottom roster. Maybe that's where the idea came from in this thread. At the time, Dougherty was referring mainly to the various running backs who were being brought in for tryouts, and I think this was happening with some other positions as well. Dougherty said that Gutekunst does this more than Ted Thompson did, and it was something that Ron Wolf used to do, as a way of getting good looks at more players and preventing complacency from setting in among the players who were already on the roster. Dougherty seemed to think this was a sensible idea, but he never claimed that it was very impactful on the team's success. It's just one of those nuances of the GM job.