Week 3 GDT: Saints (1-1) @ Seahawks (2-0)

[Dome]

5 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

Dome, that's weak as heck, and you know it.

Nope. It’s the truth. 

5 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

Oh, and I thought we weren't supposed to be comparing Teddy to Brees. Yet, here we go....

Huh? That’s not comparing the players.

thats a contrast of how the fans treat the players,

but it’s not a comparison of the players because it contained zero player analysis. 

 

Not sure how your could’ve thought it was. Maybe you misread.  

Either that, or intellectual dishonesty. Which is why I said I’ll bow out 

Quote

Catch ya next week after we spend a thread forgiving Teddy for taking on that tough Cowboys defense.

Yeah, not like Brees has ever crapped the bed against them

oh wait 

 

Edited September 25, 2019 by Dome

[sammymvpknight]

11 hours ago, Dome said:

Seahawks game in the rain is definitely the type of game Brees has crapped the bed for in the past... if we’re being honest. 

Like I said, if Brees had the exact same game as Teddy nobody would’ve said a word about it. Over 100 rating, no turnovers, win, two touchdowns.

That’s a fine game on the road in a tough stadium and bad conditions. 

I think the concern is that may be Teddy’s ceiling. Even outside of those rough conditions I am not convinced we see him play as well going forward, and there’s a chance he could be much worse. Everything went well for him last week. He was REALLY shaky to start the game...you could tell the entire offense has a tough time gelling with him. But they did get it figured out after the first few drives but there is no way you can expect career games from: Kamara, Morstead, and Davis, on a weekly basis. You can’t expect expect a punt and defensive TD every week...heck, they may not get one the rest of the season. I’m very skeptically of Teddy if he isn’t in absolutely ideal conditions...and let’s face it...even Brees RARELY gets those conditions. 

[Dome]

14 minutes ago, sammymvpknight said:

He was REALLY shaky to start the game...

Shakiness will happen. He’s a young QB who had been the full time starter for exactly 7 days, and Seattle is one of the hardest environments to play in even if you ignore the weather. Now don’t ignore the weather, it was raining. 

Some people call these “excuses” ....  thats fine, but they’re also all facts. None of them are subjective. 

 

14 minutes ago, sammymvpknight said:

there is no way you can expect career games from: Kamara, Morstead, and Davis, on a weekly basis. You can’t expect expect a punt and defensive TD every week...heck, they may not get one the rest of the season.

Agreed. First thing I text my dad after the game was “flukey” win. 

I just haven’t ever seen these complaints by winning teams until now, and it feels like convenient timing.

Every team ends up winning games on fluke plays or just having “weird” overachieving games from time to time. We had our fair share last year. Plenty in 2009 as well. 

Generally the team on the losing end is the one pointing out it was a fluke. Not the team with the 2 TD 0 turnover backup. 

 

Sean Payton beamed and said he was proud of the way Teddy played. Have some faith, people. 

Edited September 25, 2019 by Dome

[sammymvpknight]

22 minutes ago, Dome said:

Shakiness will happen. He’s a young QB who had been the full time starter for exactly 7 days, and Seattle is one of the hardest environments to play in even if you ignore the weather. Now don’t ignore the weather, it was raining. 

Some people call these “excuses” ....  thats fine, but they’re also all facts. None of them are subjective. 

 

Agreed. First thing I text my dad after the game was “flukey” win. 

I just haven’t ever seen these complaints by winning teams until now, and it feels like convenient timing.

Every team ends up winning games on fluke plays or just having “weird” overachieving games from time to time. We had our fair share last year. Plenty in 2009 as well. 

Generally the team on the losing end is the one pointing out it was a fluke. Not the team with the 2 TD 0 turnover backup. 

 

Sean Payton beamed and said he was proud of the way Teddy played. Have some faith, people. 

You haven’t heard it because Drew Brees is an elite QB. He could have dominated or completely sucked and it wouldn’t have changed anyone’s mind. Bridgewater on the other hand has a mediocre track record (at best). We was a solid, low-upside game manager type for the Vikings but that was a life ago before a catastrophic leg injury. He played a solid preseason game for the Jets and got traded here. Since he’s been here he’s been mediocre at best in his preseason showings, often looking worse than Hill. He puts up a “let’s get this game over with” type of performance against the Rams (can’t blame him), and then was blessed by the football Gods against the Seahawks. So no I’m not saying he sucks...I’m saying that I’m very skeptical that he can win with his arm. If Kamara is covered up and the run game is slowed, can he lead the team to more than one TD per game? I’m not sure. It’s going to take a full team effort every week for Bridgewater to win...and I’m not sure how realistic that is. How often has Brees received those type of games from the defense and special teams in his entire Saints career?

[Dome]

49 minutes ago, sammymvpknight said:

You haven’t heard it because Drew Brees is an elite QB. He could have dominated or completely sucked and it wouldn’t have changed anyone’s mind.

I'm just talking about a game per game basis. If Brees has a down game in a win, nobody even brings it up. See the other Teddy thread for examples of this. 

People are assuming that this isn't a down game for Teddy but we haven't seen him running this offense at full force in the dome. We have Payton grinning saying how proud he was of Teddy talking about how he's looking forward to getting everything tailored to him and reminding us that Teddy has already proven he can win at every level.

Let's give it some time.

49 minutes ago, sammymvpknight said:

I’m saying that I’m very skeptical that he can win with his arm

Teddy doesn't have to win it with his arm. The Saints have to win. 

Last year plenty of us were all excited about this team moving forward, saying our next QB will have a great defense and weapons to rely on. They won't have to throw for 350 yards for us to get the win.

 How many times have we heard that over the last year and a half? I know I've seen several of us here bring it up.

We finally saw what that looked liked, and some people hate it lol

 

That said, Teddy went 11-5 with the Vikings. He's already proven he can win with his arm if the team around him plays like a winning team. 

And before any of you point out that the Vikings had Adrian Peterson to carry them, I'd like to point out that I know some of you have called Kamara elite or even the best RB in the league. So that should fit into the "Teddy is good enough for us" narrative just fine.

 

Am I saying he's the future? No. I'm just saying the criticisms have been too harsh based on what we've seen exactly 1 week into life without Drew.

I've said it a few times, and I'll say it again.

Let's give it some time.

Edited September 25, 2019 by Dome

[Jlowe22]

2 hours ago, sammymvpknight said:

I think the concern is that may be Teddy’s ceiling. Even outside of those rough conditions I am not convinced we see him play as well going forward, and there’s a chance he could be much worse. Everything went well for him last week. He was REALLY shaky to start the game...you could tell the entire offense has a tough time gelling with him. But they did get it figured out after the first few drives but there is no way you can expect career games from: Kamara, Morstead, and Davis, on a weekly basis. You can’t expect expect a punt and defensive TD every week...heck, they may not get one the rest of the season. I’m very skeptically of Teddy if he isn’t in absolutely ideal conditions...and let’s face it...even Brees RARELY gets those conditions. 

His ceiling probably isn’t very high, that’s for sure.  It only has to be high enough until Brees gets back.  Whether it is or isn’t, I don’t know, no one here has seen enough meaningful games from him as a Saint to know for sure.  But to say he sucks after a road game in Seattle in the rain is a bit unfair.  Especially when we won the game, and in such a fashion that he only needed to not screw it up.  

 

[SWATcha]

5 hours ago, Mid Iowa said:

Teddy's average "air yards" on completed passes was 1.9 yards.
All of last season this stat was 2.8 yards.

 

Cowboys have LBs that are fast and can cover. If Teddy can't get it downfield, it's gonna be a long day for the Saints.

[SWATcha]

5 hours ago, Mid Iowa said:

Trust me, man, I wan't to believe in Teddy, but as I've said for years now, he doesn't believe in himself, and I don't want a guy like that running my team's offense.

I believe there is some truth in this. He just doesn't look comfortable and composed to me. There were plenty of plays where receivers had 3-5 feet of separation, and it looked like Teddy thought about throwing it, but didn't trust himself and ultimately checked it down. It's like he's afraid to fail.

Teddy, dude, you got nothin to lose. Chuck the rock. That Thomas guy, he's kinda good, he'll catch it.

[Dome]

5 minutes ago, SWATcha said:

Cowboys have LBs that are fast and can cover. If Teddy can't get it downfield, it's gonna be a long day for the Saints.

This is true for any QB and why so many (Brees included) have struggled against the cowboys recently.

the whole team needs to step up. WRs need to get separation and the line needs to block well every single snap, Kamara needs to run hard and teddy needs to keep the defense honest.

defense has to come out nasty like it did against the Seahawks 

[Dome]

6 minutes ago, SWATcha said:

I believe there is some truth in this. He just doesn't look comfortable and composed to me. There were plenty of plays where receivers had 3-5 feet of separation, and it looked like Teddy thought about throwing it, but didn't trust himself and ultimately checked it down. It's like he's afraid to fail.

Teddy, dude, you got nothin to lose. Chuck the rock. That Thomas guy, he's kinda good, he'll catch it.

I don’t think that all teddy.

im sure that considering the lead, the conditions and the confidence in the defense, these things all played a role in play-calling and what Payton was telling teddy to look for. 

Let’s see what happens in the dome 

Edited September 25, 2019 by Dome

[Mid Iowa]

7 hours ago, Dome said:

Let's give it some time.

5 years in the league. How much time do you need?

7 hours ago, Dome said:

We finally saw what that looked liked, and some people hate it lol

Please find the person who "hate" that we won in Seattle (other than Seahawks fans, who are crying like babies, almost literally).

7 hours ago, Dome said:

That said, Teddy went 11-5 with the Vikings. He's already proven he can win with his arm if the team around him plays like a winning team. 

And before any of you point out that the Vikings had Adrian Peterson to carry them, I'd like to point out that I know some of you have called Kamara elite or even the best RB in the league. So that should fit into the "Teddy is good enough for us" narrative just fine.

He went 11-5 with a top 5 defense that lead the league in least points allowed per game (about 17). So I'm not sure we can call that winning with his arm, but rather a lot of help from a suffocating defense, and a 1700+ yard running back. All the while, throwing only 14 TD's and 9 INT's.

7 hours ago, Dome said:

I saying he's the future? No. I'm just saying the criticisms have been too harsh based on what we've seen exactly 1 week into life without Drew.

False, kind of. All of last season, and 1 start. 1 start this season.
Luke McCown had 1 start for the Saints and went 31 for 38 and 310 yards. We lost by a muffed punt that was returned for a TD. He was Captain Checkdown, not throwing a long pass until late in the 2nd quarter, and that was incomplete. In fact, he didn't complete a deep pass until midway through the 4th quarter. Why didn't we put him on a pedestal?

Oh, and McCown's salary was $1,069,334

3 hours ago, Dome said:

Let’s see what happens in the dome 

I'm looking forward to it. As I've said numerous times, I want the guy to succeed!! AND I don't think he will.
And my brother and his son are both (barf in my mouth here) Cowboys fans. They circle this one on the calendar every year. If the 'boys lose, it's "yeah but" and if they win I'll hear it until the next time we play them. 

[Dome]

3 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

8 hours ago, Dome said:

Let's give it some time.

5 years in the league. How much time do you need?

Brees was in his 6th year when he joined us. 

Just sayin' 

Teddy has had starter reps with the first team for about 10 days now.

4 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

8 hours ago, Dome said:

We finally saw what that looked like, and some people hate it lol

Please find the person who "hate" that we won in Seattle (other than Seahawks fans, who are crying like babies, almost literally).

That's not what I'm saying.

I'm saying they hate how what it looked like. (See the bolded above, and reference the rest of my quote that you cut out for the context)

Directing your rebuttal to an argument I'm not actually making has happened a couple times now. It gets us nowhere.

11 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

He went 11-5 with a top 5 defense that lead the league in least points allowed per game (about 17). So I'm not sure we can call that winning with his arm, but rather a lot of help from a suffocating defense, and a 1700+ yard running back. All the while, throwing only 14 TD's and 9 INT's.

I already addressed this, but here it is again.

8 hours ago, Dome said:

Teddy doesn't have to win it with his arm. The Saints have to win. 

Last year plenty of us were all excited about this team moving forward, saying our next QB will have a great defense and weapons to rely on. They won't have to throw for 350 yards for us to get the win.

And before any of you point out that the Vikings had Adrian Peterson to carry them, I'd like to point out that I know some of you have called Kamara elite or even the best RB in the league. So that should fit into the "Teddy is good enough for us" narrative just fine.

 

13 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

False, kind of. All of last season, and 1 start. 1 start this season.

"All of last season" was exactly 1 start with half the first team in a meaningless game.

And one start this game that looked just as good as some of Brees tough road games (demonstrated in the Teddy thread if you need the examples)

What else is there to judge him on other than those two starts? (Which isn't enough to see how Sean Payton will develop the offense for him, btw)

13 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

Luke McCown had 1 start for the Saints and went 31 for 38 and 310 yards. We lost by a muffed punt that was returned for a TD. He was Captain Checkdown, not throwing a long pass until late in the 2nd quarter, and that was incomplete. In fact, he didn't complete a deep pass until midway through the 4th quarter. Why didn't we put him on a pedestal?

Who is putting Teddy on a pedestal? I've called him a backup and a stopgap. 

Other's have said he sucks, and that's what I'm arguing against. That's not a pedestal.

13 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

Oh, and McCown's salary was $1,069,334

That was almost 5 years ago.... kinda like what I said when I told you your salary expectations are reminiscent of 5 years ago.

Luke McCown had never earned a full time starter role on any team he played for, he didn't show enough upside to earn a shot to be the guy with any team.

Luke McCown was drafted in the 4th round not traded up into the 1st for, he didn't show enough upside to be worth more than that for any team.

Luke McCown never threw for more than 5 touchdowns in a season but he did throw 7 interceptions once.

Luke McCown was 32 when he was here, not 26. That makes a bit of a difference when evaluating potential. 

So you guys wanna talk about low upside sucky QBs, it's Luke McCown.

 

13 minutes ago, Mid Iowa said:

I'm looking forward to it. As I've said numerous times, I want the guy to succeed!! AND I don't think he will.

He did on Sunday, but it wasn't good enough I guess and can't get the credit. Unless you think he showed more bad than good?

If Brees plays that exact game we chalk it up as a success and move on. I don't believe anyone who says different. 

 

[Matts4313]

Come join us. Someone put this in your GDT whenever its made.

Ignore all the Packers talk. We have a unique tradition in the Cowboys forum. Basically the first day the thread is up, we make it for the next opponent on our schedule. 

[Dome]

Who forgot to lock up last night?

[Matts4313]

48 minutes ago, Dome said:

Who forgot to lock up last night?