Chris Harris Jr Trade?

[thebestever6]

3 minutes ago, French Fan said:

I am agree except for Yiadom. When he replaced Bausby , Rivers attacked 2 times Yiadom and each time he was too far to defend a pass. We conceded 2 big 1st down. For me it s time to move on from him.

 

He is still on a cheap rookie deal so bpa makes sense if that's the case in the draft. Signing a nice bargain free agent also would be cool. I'm not sure if he contributes to special teams at all. Yiadom could be a 4th or 5th corner that's just playing above his skill grade right now sue to injuries. 

Edited October 7, 2019 by thebestever6

[thebestever6]

18 hours ago, Broncofan said:

Gotta say we should be big LAC fans for this week - lose the battle, win the war by selling early and NOT at the trade deadline

I think that win yesterday makes it more likely we sell asap. The team got the taste of victory, and the bread crumb also looks very well coached. That was one of the best games I've seen Miller play since drafting Chubb. Idc what anyone says he's on the block.

Hopefully gms around the league start taking the bait. Elway knows what this team is, but he believes in Fangio that was the high water mark of the team this year hopefully. 

Edited October 7, 2019 by thebestever6

[French Fan]

1 hour ago, thebestever6 said:

I think that win yesterday makes it more likely we sell asap. The team got the taste of victory, and the bread crumb also looks very well coached. That was one of the best games I've seen Miller play since drafting Chubb. Idc what anyone says he's on the block.

Hopefully gms around the league start taking the bait. Elway knows what this team is, but he believes in Fangio that was the high water mark of the team this year hopefully. 

We are 2 kicks away to be 3-2 team. But we play like a 1-4 team. We can be a 8 or 9 wins with a little more chance. But PO .....no way !!!!

CHJ , Sanders and Wolfe can be on the block. Except a major trade offer for Miller he will stay here. Less than 2 first round (2020 and 2021) and a 2nd will be disapointing. 

[thebestever6]

11 minutes ago, French Fan said:

We are 2 kicks away to be 3-2 team. But we play like a 1-4 team. We can be a 8 or 9 wins with a little more chance. But PO .....no way !!!!

CHJ , Sanders and Wolfe can be on the block. Except a major trade offer for Miller he will stay here. Less than 2 first round (2020 and 2021) and a 2nd will be disapointing. 

I always had the mindset you are what your record says you are right or wrong that's the National Football league for ya. Those games matter one game win doesn't change the depth/injury issues.

As far as Miller goes I would be jumping for joy if we received a second and a 2021 first from the right team. Heck the Colts have Washington's second round pick that looks intriguing in and of itself. Two firsts and a second are a pipe dream though imo. He was talking to his agent last week and he wants out I really hope they get the right deal. That will be a deadline kind of move though if it happens getting the right deal takes a great amount of poker playing. 

I don't know how dead money works I know Vons is high for the rest of the year but isn't that money you'd be paying him anyway?

Edited October 7, 2019 by thebestever6

[French Fan]

48 minutes ago, thebestever6 said:

 

I don't know how dead money works I know Vons is high for the rest of the year but isn't that money you'd be paying him anyway?

19m  in 2019

11,75m in 2020

4.1 in 2022

[thebestever6]

27 minutes ago, French Fan said:

19m  in 2019

11,75m in 2020

4.1 in 2022

I know the numbers I'm saying that's money onto our salary cap whether Von is here or not correct? 

So a bidding team has to make it worth while for us to eat the 19 million in 2019? Either we pay that money for Von's services the rest of the year or we're paying a piece of the remaining contract because it was signing bonus money(6 year deal) for him to play for his next suitor. That's how I take dead cap so a 1st is a going rate for Von, and anything over that is a premium spent in the dead cap number? 

A first and a second would be a decent haul anything over that is a luxury tbh. If OBJ had a price Von should have a price, and if someone is willing to pay it good luck Von go win another ring.

Edited October 7, 2019 by thebestever6

[The Helicopter]

I'd rather we keep these vets around...unless they aren't acting like leaders and/or don't want to be here. We talk about needing an infusion of leadership and we'll be devoid of talent. I remember how excited we were about the pics from the Cutler trade...the draft is not easy to hit. I don't think we come out ahead.

[thebestever6]

4 minutes ago, The Helicopter said:

I'd rather we keep these vets around...unless they aren't acting like leaders and/or don't want to be here. We talk about needing an infusion of leadership and we'll be devoid of talent. I remember how excited we were about the pics from the Cutler trade...the draft is not easy to hit. I don't think we come out ahead.

Totally different circumstance Mac and his big down fall were only having 100 players on his big board. This coaching staff is grooming leaders on D by letting the long term guys who will be here coach on the field.

"You miss 100%of the shots you don't take."

[The Helicopter]

1 hour ago, thebestever6 said:

Totally different circumstance Mac and his big down fall were only having 100 players on his big board. This coaching staff is grooming leaders on D by letting the long term guys who will be here coach on the field.

"You miss 100%of the shots you don't take."

"A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush"

[thebestever6]

47 minutes ago, The Helicopter said:

"A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush"

Von, Chris Harris, D Wolfe, Sanders have cumulatively 12 years of playing time in the NFL left imo and that's being generous. That's time spent between the 4 of them to be key contributors on playoff teams. You could easily get 25+ years of cumulative talent brought in at the very least you could replace those 12 years. Lets not forget the value of added picks to control your draft board.

If Elways drafting the past two years combined with the coaching ability of this staff doesn't make you want more talent brought in to coach up I can't convince you .

I'm impressed by the growth of Sutton, Lindsay, Bausby, AJ Johnson, Dawson, Chubb. 

 

[Broncofan]

1 hour ago, The Helicopter said:

"A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush"

Except the 3 birds in question aren't coming back next year (CHJ for sure, and given Sanders & Wolfe are getting 8-figures, a big no thanks there - Wolfe's just not a fit in Fangio's scheme).   

I get your point but these are guys we are better getting something for than losing them anyways.   It would be shocking if Wolfe gets 8-figures at this stage, so the comp pick would be a 5th likely at best, and 2021...so a 2020 5th being the bird in the hand is far better than hoping for a 2021 5th or worse, given who we bring in.

Now if it's Von you're talking about, then it's about the return.   Absolutely fair that picks can whiff hard, it's just a matter of the return being worth it.  But it's a calculated risk for sure.  But orgs like us have to take future risks to get better, the status quo with vets and no real solutions at key positions is more of the status quo.  It just can't be a panic sell-off that doesn't give a legit shot at real roster transformation.

Put another way - if the picks acquired resulted in us locking down QBOTF with a legit talent in 2020, I suspect no one would blink an eye, realizing where we are at.  In the end, it's about the return justifying a Von trade - which is why Elway's gone on record saying even if the team goes into sell mode, Von's not one of them.   

Edited October 8, 2019 by Broncofan

[thebestever6]

1 hour ago, Broncofan said:

Put another way - if the picks acquired resulted in us locking down QBOTF with a legit talent in 2020, I suspect no one would blink an eye, realizing where we are at.  In the end, it's about the return justifying a Von trade - which is why Elway's gone on record saying even if the team goes into sell mode, Von's not one of them.   

Whole post is spot on I think this is lining up perfectly for Elway to cash out a nice hand at some point. This team playing competitive, and the culture that's being created knowing that players are being coached up are great building blocks to get a nice return.

The slow burn with Von is also a brilliant strategy 1) respect earned mutually both ways . 2) Vons value is going up I saw him being switched sides during the game and it seemed he had a lot of juice. 

 

[Broncofan]

 

 

 

 

2

7 minutes ago, thebestever6 said:

Whole post is spot on I think this is lining up perfectly for Elway to cash out a nice hand at some point. This team playing competitive, and the culture that's being created knowing that players are being coached up are great building blocks to get a nice return.

The slow burn with Von is also a brilliant strategy 1) respect earned mutually both ways . 2) Vons value is going up I saw him being switched sides during the game and it seemed he had a lot of juice. 

 

The whole idea that Chubb was going to play the Mack role and  Von the Floyd role seemed nuts.  As ppl know my take on Chubb (great Robin, but not a Batman-type), it's not post-ACL revisionism.  It sucks that Chubb is hurt, but hopefully the one blessing is that they put Reed (and assuming the injury is just a bruise, Hollins in relief) in the Floyd role, and put Von where he belongs - in the disruptor role.  It's clear he's still an alpha player.   

I have zero problem with trading Von if we get a huuuuuge return.  But we don't need to sell at all costs.  Selling even just a 1st to a playoff contender is a 20's pick.  No thanks, not enough.    Von will still play in his prime barring injury, and you can't trade on that fear.   CHJ, Sanders & Wolfe - totally different story, their time in DEN is coming to a close so best to get what we can with Sanders/Wolfe (as long as Sanders isn't a pure giveaway, take what we can get for Wolfe TBH), while CHJ should net us a decent Day 2 pick at worst (and if not, then we should hold, because an end of 3rd IMO is very possible, so you only deal him if you get a day 2 pick a year earlier).

I just hope Elway realizes his window to sell as the only CB seller likely ends once P-Pete is back Week 7.   Even if JAX is waffling on Ramsay, our position gets a lot less leverage than if we deal CHJ between now and Week 7.

[thebestever6]

1 hour ago, Broncofan said:

I just hope Elway realizes his window to sell as the only CB seller likely ends once P-Pete is back Week 7.   Even if JAX is waffling on Ramsay, our position gets a lot less leverage than if we deal CHJ between now and Week 7.

I feel like once the first trade domino falls everything else will fall into place. The sooner the better it can be wolfe, Harris, or Sanders. I prefer Harris moved sooner rather than later because that will net us the highest return barring a freak injury or 2 around the league .

The quicker this team actually sells a player the more likely it is Von goes in my opinion. 

My love for Von runs deep, but the coaching job has been phenomenal so far. Or maybe I'm used to VJs staff.

 

[germ-x]

If Von can be moved for a 1st he needs to be moved.  This isn’t a team or a time to play that hard of ball.  Again, by the time this team can legitimately compete Von will be declining more than he is now.  He had a great game vs the Chargers, but they also had a terrible game plan and left him 1 vs 1 against Sam Tevi for the majority of the game.