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On 12/7/2020 at 4:57 PM, NightTrainLane said:

So do you let Morrow walk in FA instead of rewarding a homegrown guy that plays his tail off and knows the defense better than anyone else in the room currently? Watch him go to Den, Cle or Miami and ball out?

I don't have the answers and I agree that Littlton's best position is WILL. But you don't let Morrow walk if you don't have a plan to replace the SAM position.

Can McMillian or Beasley be the guy? Do you go after Minny's Eric Wilson or Philly's Alex Singleton?

It depends on what Morrow gets as offers.  I use to be allllll about keeping homegrown talent like Morrow.... then I grew up and realized there’s no loyalty amongst players to teams.  If you can find a better player or better value (player / contract) then you move on.  Morrows played beyond expectations but is still very limited and really a team would want him to be their 4th LB.  

Morrow is barely a starter talent and with what we have invested into Littleton I think it just makes sense to move him to WILL, not to mention the potential for him to return to his ‘19 form with the Rams.

The thing is we ABSOLUTELY have to go into the offseason with a plan to upgrade and finalize the LB unit.  That IMO means bringing in a SAM.  Ideally we bring in a Lengthy LB who can get pressure off the edge too.  
 

I’d try and bring McMillian back near the vet minimum to backup MLB and ST.

hopefully Tanner Muse isn’t a total bust and can be a ST Captain who replaces Kyle Wilber, at worst, and at best shows signs of being a Matt Milano type WILL.  If he could ever learn to stack+shed at a high level and set the edge Id even like to see him as a situational SAM and used for cover TEs.  
 

I don’t consider Beasley a LB.  he’s a DPR aka 3rd down speed rushing DE.  I have little to no expectations for him.  I highly doubt he’s retained.

but he’s I wouldn’t let Morrow walk without a replacement / upgrade in the picture.  I’ve been a huge fan of his since his first PS.  But he’s likely maxed out.  I don’t see him consistently playing better than he is now.  And that means, unless he resigns for a prove it deal or a good value, he’s unlikely to outperform his 2nd contact.  Sometimes you have to be okay with moving on.  There’s no nostalgia value in contracts.  He exceeded his contract and that was great, but we can’t overpay him.  And we must realize he’s a replacement level starter.

There’s a lot of good projected Rd 2-5 talent at LB in 2021.  I wouldn’t be against drafting a LB in the 2nd and 4/5th if there’s good value.  I’ll say it again..... I wouldn’t mind a lengthy SAM with pass rush skills..... kinda what Beasley should have been.  I won’t list prospects cuz that’ll end up being 20 pages.

but to sum it up..... we need to upgrade one starting spot and add some depth, which ideally had situational skillsets.  And we really need to maximize the talent and investment in Littleton..... that could come from a scheme change and different role or a move to WILL.  
the good thing is LB is a position where there will be lots of good options.  We shouldn’t lock Onto anyone player.  There’s usually something equal or better at a better price at some point in the offseason..... so fill out the roster with a plan And bring in competition.

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17 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

It depends on what Morrow gets as offers.  I use to be allllll about keeping homegrown talent like Morrow.... then I grew up and realized there’s no loyalty amongst players to teams.  If you can find a better player or better value (player / contract) then you move on.  Morrows played beyond expectations but is still very limited and really a team would want him to be their 4th LB.  

Morrow is barely a starter talent and with what we have invested into Littleton I think it just makes sense to move him to WILL, not to mention the potential for him to return to his ‘19 form with the Rams.

The thing is we ABSOLUTELY have to go into the offseason with a plan to upgrade and finalize the LB unit.  That IMO means bringing in a SAM.  Ideally we bring in a Lengthy LB who can get pressure off the edge too.  
 

I’d try and bring McMillian back near the vet minimum to backup MLB and ST.

hopefully Tanner Muse isn’t a total bust and can be a ST Captain who replaces Kyle Wilber, at worst, and at best shows signs of being a Matt Milano type WILL.  If he could ever learn to stack+shed at a high level and set the edge Id even like to see him as a situational SAM and used for cover TEs.  
 

I don’t consider Beasley a LB.  he’s a DPR aka 3rd down speed rushing DE.  I have little to no expectations for him.  I highly doubt he’s retained.

but he’s I wouldn’t let Morrow walk without a replacement / upgrade in the picture.  I’ve been a huge fan of his since his first PS.  But he’s likely maxed out.  I don’t see him consistently playing better than he is now.  And that means, unless he resigns for a prove it deal or a good value, he’s unlikely to outperform his 2nd contact.  Sometimes you have to be okay with moving on.  There’s no nostalgia value in contracts.  He exceeded his contract and that was great, but we can’t overpay him.  And we must realize he’s a replacement level starter.

There’s a lot of good projected Rd 2-5 talent at LB in 2021.  I wouldn’t be against drafting a LB in the 2nd and 4/5th if there’s good value.  I’ll say it again..... I wouldn’t mind a lengthy SAM with pass rush skills..... kinda what Beasley should have been.  I won’t list prospects cuz that’ll end up being 20 pages.

but to sum it up..... we need to upgrade one starting spot and add some depth, which ideally had situational skillsets.  And we really need to maximize the talent and investment in Littleton..... that could come from a scheme change and different role or a move to WILL.  
the good thing is LB is a position where there will be lots of good options.  We shouldn’t lock Onto anyone player.  There’s usually something equal or better at a better price at some point in the offseason..... so fill out the roster with a plan And bring in competition.

Are you sure Lttleton isn't already playing the WILL right now and just not performing well. From several depth charts and the eye test the last two games it loks like he is...which is...I don't know which word to use. Disheartening. Maddening. Disappointing. Confusing.

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22 minutes ago, NightTrainLane said:

Are you sure Lttleton isn't already playing the WILL right now and just not performing well. From several depth charts and the eye test the last two games it loks like he is...which is...I don't know which word to use. Disheartening. Maddening. Disappointing. Confusing.

He's avoiding contact you can look it up on the internet there's videos of him stopping before makes contact.

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34 minutes ago, NightTrainLane said:

 

I think fans have way to high of expectations for Littleton. He's on a bad defense. A defense that can't rush the passer. Until this team can consistently apply pressure on QBs, we're going to have problems with the LBs and secondary. We need the Dline to compliment the defense and it's just not happening right now. 

 

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16 hours ago, big_palooka said:

I think fans have way to high of expectations for Littleton. He's on a bad defense. A defense that can't rush the passer. Until this team can consistently apply pressure on QBs, we're going to have problems with the LBs and secondary. We need the Dline to compliment the defense and it's just not happening right now. 

 

This in a nutshell. I believe our coverage guys are pretty good mostly and Mullen, Arnette, Lawson, Johnson and Joyner have been from good to decent but they simply cant cover for 4 or 5 seconds plus playing off coverage and soft zones too often is not playing to their strengths. A difference maker at DT and a rangy, ball player at FS would make a huge difference IMO.

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On 12/8/2020 at 5:30 PM, jimkelly02 said:

It depends on what Morrow gets as offers.  I use to be allllll about keeping homegrown talent like Morrow.... then I grew up and realized there’s no loyalty amongst players to teams.  If you can find a better player or better value (player / contract) then you move on.  Morrows played beyond expectations but is still very limited and really a team would want him to be their 4th LB.  

Morrow is barely a starter talent and with what we have invested into Littleton I think it just makes sense to move him to WILL, not to mention the potential for him to return to his ‘19 form with the Rams.

The thing is we ABSOLUTELY have to go into the offseason with a plan to upgrade and finalize the LB unit.  That IMO means bringing in a SAM.  Ideally we bring in a Lengthy LB who can get pressure off the edge too.  
 

I’d try and bring McMillian back near the vet minimum to backup MLB and ST.

hopefully Tanner Muse isn’t a total bust and can be a ST Captain who replaces Kyle Wilber, at worst, and at best shows signs of being a Matt Milano type WILL.  If he could ever learn to stack+shed at a high level and set the edge Id even like to see him as a situational SAM and used for cover TEs.  
 

I don’t consider Beasley a LB.  he’s a DPR aka 3rd down speed rushing DE.  I have little to no expectations for him.  I highly doubt he’s retained.

but he’s I wouldn’t let Morrow walk without a replacement / upgrade in the picture.  I’ve been a huge fan of his since his first PS.  But he’s likely maxed out.  I don’t see him consistently playing better than he is now.  And that means, unless he resigns for a prove it deal or a good value, he’s unlikely to outperform his 2nd contact.  Sometimes you have to be okay with moving on.  There’s no nostalgia value in contracts.  He exceeded his contract and that was great, but we can’t overpay him.  And we must realize he’s a replacement level starter.

There’s a lot of good projected Rd 2-5 talent at LB in 2021.  I wouldn’t be against drafting a LB in the 2nd and 4/5th if there’s good value.  I’ll say it again..... I wouldn’t mind a lengthy SAM with pass rush skills..... kinda what Beasley should have been.  I won’t list prospects cuz that’ll end up being 20 pages.

but to sum it up..... we need to upgrade one starting spot and add some depth, which ideally had situational skillsets.  And we really need to maximize the talent and investment in Littleton..... that could come from a scheme change and different role or a move to WILL.  
the good thing is LB is a position where there will be lots of good options.  We shouldn’t lock Onto anyone player.  There’s usually something equal or better at a better price at some point in the offseason..... so fill out the roster with a plan And bring in competition.

Great breakdown, and exactly the way I see it. Morrow has earned a new contract, but I wouldn’t spend much. The way I see 2021 LB unit

WLB: Littleton, Muse/White 

MLB: Kwit, McMillen(brought back for depth) 

SLB: ? , 

As Jim said, a big SLB who can add pass rush and be a plus athlete. Could also add one more LB for depth via draft or Draft. 

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8 hours ago, Darbsk said:

This in a nutshell. I believe our coverage guys are pretty good mostly and Mullen, Arnette, Lawson, Johnson and Joyner have been from good to decent but they simply cant cover for 4 or 5 seconds plus playing off coverage and soft zones too often is not playing to their strengths. A difference maker at DT and a rangy, ball player at FS would make a huge difference IMO.

Johnson needs to get more playing time. Outside the mental mistakes, he's super long and fast. I'd rather even have him in the slot than Joyner, as crazy as that sounds.

He even made some plays at free safety. 

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9 hours ago, MrOaktown_56 said:

Johnson needs to get more playing time. Outside the mental mistakes, he's super long and fast. I'd rather even have him in the slot than Joyner, as crazy as that sounds.

He even made some plays at free safety. 

I agree, if Arnette is out (or even if he's any kind of doubt in fact with the head/neck injury) I wouldn't rush him back but play Mullen and Johnson on the outside where their length and speed works best and Lawson at slot corner where I think he's best. That frees up Joyner for FS, though I don't think we'll actually do that of course 😁 

I'm actually quite high on our corners, we have a lot of talent there, albeit some latent.

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24 minutes ago, Humble_Beast said:

Hope you get over it in warp speed... 

Not out of the woods yet.  Today is my best day since Saturday.  But me and the wife are just riding it out.  Thank you

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