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Succession - *spoiler warning from ET + Ty*


Ty21

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1 minute ago, MikeT14 said:
15 hours ago, ET80 said:

- Another parallel: Ep 1.1 had Kendall furiously negotiating to buy out and merge Vaulter with Waystar. We know how that ended… will Waystar/Gojo go the same direction (or… in a similar direction)?

I feel like it more or less has to, you know? 

Shiv called it in the S3 finale - once the sale is completed, the Roy kids would basically be executed as a sign that Lukas Mattson is the new patriarch. My question would be about Karl, Gerri, Frank (those outside the ATN bubble): Are they in danger, did they double cross the kids only to be led to the firing squad? This almost has to be a yes… right?

Karl’s not gonna like that.

Hbo Panic GIF by SuccessionHBO

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4 minutes ago, ET80 said:

Shiv called it in the S3 finale - once the sale is completed, the Roy kids would basically be executed as a sign that Lukas Mattson is the new patriarch. My question would be about Karl, Gerri, Frank (those outside the ATN bubble): Are they in danger, did they double cross the kids only to be led to the firing squad? This almost has to be a yes… right?

Karl’s not gonna like that.

I actually think one of those three (probably Frank), switches over to the kids side at some point. They've all waffled at some point with Logan for one reason or another so I think it makes sense. 

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3 hours ago, MikeT14 said:

I actually think one of those three (probably Frank), switches over to the kids side at some point. They've all waffled at some point with Logan for one reason or another so I think it makes sense. 

If I had to power rank this:

1. I’d say Gerri is the one the kids want - equal parts competent and ruthless and she has a weird mommy/slimeball fetish for Roman. Her and Shiv will always keep the other one in check simply because they don’t trust each other and Gerri/Kendall are at least competent with one another during Ken’s run as interim CEO. In this vein, she’s probably the one they could trust the least; She’s admitted that she’s out for herself and is willing to be a dangerous enemy. Her competency would be worth the risk if you’re in a ground war vs Logan.

2. Frank is next and Roman would flat out balk at the idea of leveraging Frank for anything more complex than a crude joke. Shiv also shows slight discontent with Frank, throwing him up on stage to sing and dance at the Shareholders’ Meeting while she did the actual work. Ken has always had a soft spot for Frank, always there to pick up anytime after Frank was fired by Logan. Ken trusts Frank, for some odd reason. Ken would bring him in but Roman and Shiv would ignore him completely.

3. Karl is worthless. One of the original boars on the floor, nobody takes Karl seriously. If he defected, the kids would send him back. The only way I see this working is if it’s through a proxy (specifically, Stewy and Sandi - if he gets in with them, he’s got a seat at the table). 

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1 minute ago, ET80 said:

3. Karl is worthless. One of the original boars on the floor, nobody takes Karl seriously. If he defected, the kids would send him back. The only way I see this working is if it’s through a proxy (specifically, Stewy and Sandi - if he gets in with them, he’s got a seat at the table). 

Karl revenge season would be a funny alt season to follow. 

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4 minutes ago, MikeT14 said:
6 minutes ago, ET80 said:

3. Karl is worthless. One of the original boars on the floor, nobody takes Karl seriously. If he defected, the kids would send him back. The only way I see this working is if it’s through a proxy (specifically, Stewy and Sandi - if he gets in with them, he’s got a seat at the table). 

Expand  

Karl revenge season would be a funny alt season to follow. 

Great… Karl, vamping. 

 

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I have to watch yesterday’s episode again, because there was so much to love in it all. The bar scene when the three realize they all have their own agenda, the karaoke scene where Logan walks in and they have their first face to face discussion since Italy, Willa finally admitting this whole wedding is a disaster waiting to happen, Logan’s impromptu speech in the middle of the newsroom - there was so much in terms of dialogue and acting, it was a tremendous episode from everyone involved.

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A lot of thoughts on this episode because I have to watch it again but man, these lines from Connor went straight to my core:

Quote

Connor: The good thing about having a family that doesn't love you is you learn to live without it.

Shiv: What? Con—

Connor: You're all chasing after Dad, saying, "Love me, please love me. I need love. I need attention."

Shiv: I think that's the opposite of what just happened.

Connor: You're needy love sponges... and I'm a plant that grows on rocks and lives off insects that die inside of me.

Shiv: Jesus Christ, Con.

Connor: If Willa doesn't come back, that's fine because I don't need love. It's like a superpower. And if she comes back and doesn't love me, that's okay too 'cause I don't need it.

I've never related to anything in this show as much as this, especially over the past year of my life.

Also, does anyone have any idea what Logan was actually speaking about during his grand "speech" at ATN on the floor? It just sounded like a bunch of buzzwords thrown together with emotion but didn't make any actual logical sense, and I just figured that's how it was intended.

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6 hours ago, ET80 said:

I have to watch yesterday’s episode again, because there was so much to love in it all. The bar scene when the three realize they all have their own agenda, the karaoke scene where Logan walks in and they have their first face to face discussion since Italy, Willa finally admitting this whole wedding is a disaster waiting to happen, Logan’s impromptu speech in the middle of the newsroom - there was so much in terms of dialogue and acting, it was a tremendous episode from everyone involved.

A lot of people were speculating that Willa and Connor were working with Logan to make that entire scene up just to get the kids together so he could meet them, and that she's not actually mad.

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55 minutes ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

A lot of people were speculating that Willa and Connor were working with Logan to make that entire scene up just to get the kids together so he could meet them, and that she's not actually mad.

That’s an interesting premise - not sure if I buy it completely. Willa sort of said yes to Connor out of pity, and now that’s coming home to roost, so her completely melting down the night before the wedding would make sense. 

As far as the reconciliation between the two, I think Willa ultimately gets it; With Con, she’s arm candy for a rich guy who finds himself in important circles, someone who actually has the clout to *try* to run for president. Without Con, she’s a failed playwrite and a part time escort. She can’t go back to that life, and her only out is this delusional billionaire who she likes, but doesn’t like-like.

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2 hours ago, AFlaccoSeagulls said:

Also, does anyone have any idea what Logan was actually speaking about during his grand "speech" at ATN on the floor? It just sounded like a bunch of buzzwords thrown together with emotion but didn't make any actual logical sense, and I just figured that's how it was intended.

I interpreted it as a call to arms against Pierce - there’s a clear line between the two now, and ATN v Pierce is now the CNN v Fox of their world. He doesn’t want to beat the kids, he wants to humiliate them at his game, and it starts with ATN attacking via their media channels. 

Interesting side note - Logan standing on the Hammermill paper boxes is pretty much meant to be a reenactment of Rupert Murdoch standing on paper boxes and addressing the news team at The Wall Street Journal:

Between this and Congressional hearing with Gil Eavis hitting the exact same chords as when Murdoch and his family in front of congress, there’s a pretty direct correlation to see:

It was always speculated that Logan Roy = Rupert Murdoch; The speech on the boxes sort of made this concrete.

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•my most pressing question: why did Logan ever give the kids a seat at the table? He gave them the hand they need to undermine him. I don’t understand business but I’m guessing he thought he could always keep them under his thumb and use their votes to strengthen his own? He’s always calling them idiots, but this decision showed who they got it from  

•each kid is independently written so well and with so much depth and motivations. Shiv could very well be about to sink a couple multibillion dollar deals just because she has daddy issues. But she’d be more likely to back off if she knew Matsson threatened to back off if they took it back to the table, something scheming Kendall is keeping close to him. Kendall is the same snake he’s always been. Roman is a daddy’s girl and is who I’m ultimately pulling for in the end. Roman and Shiv act so remarkably similar in personality that it’s almost surprising they’re not actual siblings. 
•it’s funny the incompetence isn’t exclusive to the Roy kids. Logan’s entire company seems full of doofuses. But I do like the guy Logan went to dinner with. He’s a pimp. 
•speaking of doofuses, Greg’s conversation with Carrie was painful. Fun from a comedic standpoint but Greg wouldn’t even have a job anywhere in the company if not for nepotism lol. It could’ve been handled so much better, straight up by showing her her own video. 
•they’ve done a good job drumming up drama for the finale. Will the Roy kids **** everything up? Will a curveball happen that no one expected? Will it continue to mirror Silicon Valley in that every time something looks up, it crumbles all the way to the floor, especially the finale? 
•The winner of E2 was easily Connor. This was the most composed I’ve ever seen him. He totally put his siblings in their place 

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12 hours ago, Ty21 said:

•my most pressing question: why did Logan ever give the kids a seat at the table? He gave them the hand they need to undermine him. I don’t understand business but I’m guessing he thought he could always keep them under his thumb and use their votes to strengthen his own? He’s always calling them idiots, but this decision showed who they got it from  

Logan is smart as hell, he knew his kids could never beat him at his own game, and they've proven it over and over and over again. Even now they're about to shoot themselves all in the foot because Shiv thinks she's smarter than she is. Moreover, as much as they want to screw their father, they want him to love them even more.

12 hours ago, Ty21 said:

•each kid is independently written so well and with so much depth and motivations. Shiv could very well be about to sink a couple multibillion dollar deals just because she has daddy issues. But she’d be more likely to back off if she knew Matsson threatened to back off if they took it back to the table, something scheming Kendall is keeping close to him. Kendall is the same snake he’s always been. Roman is a daddy’s girl and is who I’m ultimately pulling for in the end. Roman and Shiv act so remarkably similar in personality that it’s almost surprising they’re not actual siblings. 

Roman is actually smart when he wants to be, he just doesn't GAF. Shiv thinks she's smart but in reality she's just a spoiled woman who's had everything handed to her and thinks that makes her a smart business person.

12 hours ago, Ty21 said:


•it’s funny the incompetence isn’t exclusive to the Roy kids. Logan’s entire company seems full of doofuses. But I do like the guy Logan went to dinner with. He’s a pimp. 

Well yeah ATN is a perfect encapsulation of a certain news organization IRL. It's filled with nepotism and the executives are all idiots.

12 hours ago, Ty21 said:


•speaking of doofuses, Greg’s conversation with Carrie was painful. Fun from a comedic standpoint but Greg wouldn’t even have a job anywhere in the company if not for nepotism lol. It could’ve been handled so much better, straight up by showing her her own video. 

I mean Greg has been in over his head since S1E1, that's kind of his whole thing. He keeps falling upwards because of nepotism.

12 hours ago, Ty21 said:


•they’ve done a good job drumming up drama for the finale. Will the Roy kids **** everything up? Will a curveball happen that no one expected? Will it continue to mirror Silicon Valley in that every time something looks up, it crumbles all the way to the floor, especially the finale? 
•The winner of E2 was easily Connor. This was the most composed I’ve ever seen him. He totally put his siblings in their place 

I think Connor put the siblings in their place, but I don't think any of them actually realized what Connor was saying to them and how much of a cry for help it was.

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