Thoughts on Ramsey trade?

[RaidersAreOne]

I personally like it a lot for the Jags but not so much the Rams.

[BStanRamFan]

Like any trade in any sport, it's too early to tell. If Ramsey signs long term and continues his elite level of play then he is certainly worth two 1sts and a 4th. The Jaguars need to turn around do something with those picks. If they are smart they will package them and/or Minshew for Tua, but who knows.

The way I view it is the Rams would likely be picking between 18-25 in the 2020 draft. If Jalen Ramsey was available in that draft would it be acceptable to offer the 2021 1st and 4th to jump into the Top 5 and select him? Yes.  He's under contract with the Rams for 2 more years minimum. The Rams have had alot of success in rounds 2-4 under the  current regime so they're betting on themselves to continue that trend. (Everett, Kupp, Reynolds, John Johnson, Sebastian Joseph-Day, Rapp). We will get to see more of David Long, David Edwards,  Darrel Henderoson, and Greg Gaines as the season goes on

[Nightmare]

It improves the Rams in the short-term, but over a few years I'm not sure this trade makes a lot of sense for them. As good as Jalen Ramsey is (possibly the best at his position in the league), an elite CB isn't a game-changer like a DE is, so the price paid is too high for me. And of course Ramsey is going to command $$$.

Jags win the trade on first viewing, but we'll only really know about 5 years down the line.

[stl4life07]

The way I see it, this trade benefits both teams.

From the Jags point of view, they get a haul like the Bears got for Mack, but I think its easier to move on from a corner than it is from a rusher. Yes elite corners like Ramsey are hard to find but there are ways to mask coverage. When it comes to elite pass rushers like Mack, it comes down to you either have one or you dont. No matter how great your secondary is, if you cant get to the QB then its useless. Thats why I think the Jags arent going to be crippled by losing Ramsey. They have the pass rush up front with guys like Campbell, Allen, Ngakou, etc... They also have a more than solid cornerback in Bouye so its not like they went from something to completely nothing. Plus they have the assets now to go get their franchise QB like Tua, Fromm, Herbert (2020 draft) or Lawrence in (2021 draft) while still getting help on the oline and getting cornerbacks to somewhat replenish what they loss in Ramsey. While they wont find a cornerback like Ramsey, its not to say they cant find a great cornerback still. So it certainly benefits them.

From the Rams point of view, it helps them have another difference maker on defense. I keep hearing people say well why trade for Ramsey when teams in the NFC West doesnt have an elite receiver? Or getting Ramsey dont help solve the Rams offensive problems? Well to answer the first question, the Rams still have to face teams in the NFC with elite receivers. They face Julio this Sunday. If they make it to the playoffs they will could cross paths with Adams (Packers), Diggs/Thielen (Vikings), or even go back to NO with a healthier and fresh Bress and lock up with Thomas. Plus what Ramsey can do is follow the teams best option whether it be out wide like a Thomas, in the slot like a Thielen (Vikings) or Lockett (Seahawks) or even matchup with a tight end like a Kittle (Niners). So he just isnt a one trick pony. To answer the second question, have people not realize the Rams offense is 10th in the NFL in scoring? I get it that people want to focus so much on McVay and Goff and the expectations are top 3 in offense. Top 10 is still good. The Rams are 12th in total offense. Thats still good. Before the Niners game the Rams was averaging 29ppg. Their average over the past two seasons is 31.1ppg in the regular season. So 29ppg is that far off so its not like the Rams have completely fallen off the map when it comes to their offense. I keep hearing offensive line issues well get in line because all across the league teams are struggling on the oline. Pats, Eagles, Cowboys, Chiefs, etc... but its about overcoming them and again in terms of scoring and total offense the Rams are till top 12. Plus the Rams are literally a made field goal in Seattle on a short week away from being (4-2). It had alot to do with their offense putting them in that position to win more than their defense. Getting Ramsey helps their 24th ranked defense when it comes to points allowed. Now the Rams can take away one side of the field with Rams and Wade can do more things knowing that Ramsey is going to lock up Julio or just the opposing teams best option in the passing game. That will make the game easier because it will give Donald and Fowler more time to rush the QB. Then Clay comes back and he leads the Rams in sacks so it will help him as well. Now all of a sudden the Rams defense will be better to help their 10th ranked scoring offense because at the end of the day you shouldnt score 40pts at home and lose to any team. Like as bad as the Rams struggled on defense last season, they only lost once when they scored 30+ points and that was Week 9 at New Orleans.

Then people talk about the long term ramifications, I think  the Rams are looking at it like they will be picking mid 20's at best in both drafts. If you can get a top 5 elite player like Ramsey by giving up 2 late 1st round picks you do so in a heart beat. Like just think about it like this. If Ramsey was in a draft and the Rams called a top 5 team up and said we will give you our late 1st this year and a 1st next year (assuming that will be late too), to move in the top 5 to get that elite player in Ramsey, because the Rams know both Peters and Talib contracts will be up this offseason and they will be losing both their starting cornerbacks. That team will reject them in a heartbeat. No way a team in the top 5 will pass on an elite talent like Ramsey to be picking towards the bottom of the draft. If they do then its what I called getting fleeced lol. Plus the Rams trust their scouts and development to draft players in rounds 2-7 along with undrafted players. Afterall the Rams did draft both Kupp and Johnson III in the 3rd round. The Rams also draft Rapp whom people love as a prospect along with Henderson and Long in rounds 2-4. So while losing a 1st round pick is not ideal, if you know what you are doing then its not the end of the world. Again Ill take Kupp for example. The Titans, Chargers, and Bengals that same draft took Davis, Williams, and Ross in the top 10. The Rams took Kupp in the 3rd round. Guess who is the best receiver in the draft class as we speak? Kupp. So you dont have to draft in the 1st round to find great players. The Rams know that and they would rather have a blue chip proven young elite player in Ramsey than have the 25th pick or later when the draft comes. 

Edited October 19, 2019 by stl4life07

[stl4life07]

Ill also add this, people keep doubting Les and the Rams FO. Ever since the Rams hired McVay people have doubt the Rams move. I remember when the Rams signed Woods and Whitworth, people bashed the Rams for those signings. People was skeptical with some of the Rams draft decisions. People was skeptical when the Rams traded for Cooks. People thought the Rams would implode when they got Peters, Talib, Suh, and Fowler Jr. People was saying, no way the Rams will go on a Superbowl run because they will ruin the locker room and destroy the chemistry. You can literally say if it wasnt for Peters, Talib, and Suh the Rams wouldnt have made the run in the playoffs because they help shutdown the Cowboys, Saints, and the Patriots offense. So keep on doubting Les and the Rams FO if you will. Not saying they havent made any mistakes or they wont ever make mistakes in the future, but you have to say for the most part so far so good. 

Edited October 19, 2019 by stl4life07

[rocky_rams]

I’m imagining it like Ramsey is the Rams 2020 draft pick. 

Imagine the rams moved up and traded a 1st and 4th to move up to get him 

[FinSting]

58 minutes ago, stl4life07 said:

Then people talk about the long term ramifications, 

You can't use the word 'ramifications' on a thread about the Rams. There's laws around here. 

[thebestever6]

49 minutes ago, stl4life07 said:

Rams signed Woods and Whitworth

I didn't get a sense of bashing idk where you got that idea I wanted whitworth over Bolles.

[thebestever6]

15 minutes ago, rocky_rams said:

I’m imagining it like Ramsey is the Rams 2020 draft pick. 

Imagine the rams moved up and traded a 1st and 4th to move up to get him 

That would be reasonable except the money factor isn't going to be that of 1 first rounder.

[KhanYouDigIt]

32 minutes ago, rocky_rams said:

I’m imagining it like Ramsey is the Rams 2020 draft pick. 

Imagine the rams moved up and traded a 1st and 4th to move up to get him 

$100M for a rookie. Rich.

[rocky_rams]

1 hour ago, thebestever6 said:

That would be reasonable except the money factor isn't going to be that of 1 first rounder.

I figured someone would bring up the money but I’ve framed that too.

im imagining it’s the old rookie contracts back when we drafted good ole Sam Bradford. 

Now I’d much rather pay that money to Ramsey than someone like Bradford. Hindsight 20/20 of course. 

[rocky_rams]

1 hour ago, KhanYouDigIt said:

$100M for a rookie. Rich.

See my above post 

[Forge]

1 hour ago, thebestever6 said:

I didn't get a sense of bashing idk where you got that idea I wanted whitworth over Bolles.

I don't remember anyone giving crap about whitworth at all when he was signed.

The woods deal was criticized pretty heavily though

[Bolts223]

I think it's a bad trade for the Rams for a number of reasons:

- It doesn't really fix the major problems The Rams have. Primarily O-line, Gurley not being what he once was and Goff not playing well. Ramsey helps solve zero of these problems.

- The NFL isn't the NBA. Yeah it's cool to have stars and big impact players, but ultimately 5 guys can't win you a SB. Assuming they give Ramsey the money he will demand, they will have around 110 mil in cape space going to 5 players. (Goff, Gurley, Donald, Cooks and Ramsey)

- To expand on my last point: They are going to have to pay guys like Brockers, Cupp, etc. That isn't to mention Whitworth and/or Talib could just retire at any point now. You really need to be able to replace these guys and the Rams will have a severely limited ability to do so based on cap space and future draft capital that they are projected to have.

- The Rams will go 5 straight years without a first round pick. The way you build a SB winner (unless you are the Patriots) is to get a bunch of talented players on rookie contracts. Going that long without a first round pick will catch up to you.

 

I'd also like to address the argument I've heard in favor if this trade which is, "The Bears gave up two firsts for Mack and it worked out for them."

1) Mack is a better player than Ramsey at a more important position. This is no disrespect to Ramsey, but Mack is an absolute animal.

2) The Bears gave up less to get him than the Rams did to get Ramsey. The Bears at least got a 2nd and a conditional 5th in return. The Rams got zero back.

3) The Bears did it before the season, not once they were 3-3, 3rd place in their division and 0-2 against the two teams ahead of them.

4) The Bears have a QB on a rookie deal and weren't already in cap trouble. 

 

 

Edited October 20, 2019 by Bolts223

[EagleBlueDon]

I don't think it benefits the Rams short term (won't suddenly sky rocket their team) or long term. Traded away very valuable assets for a shot at a wild card. They're not winning that division. Assuming he signs there long term doesn't change my opinion. Goff needs protected, should've made moves there instead, for pennies on this particular dollar. Love it for the Jags. I envy their draft capital.