BroncosFan2010 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 Ya, the issue w/ Josh is that he legitimately is addicted to weed. A majority of the Broncos players likely smoke pot, and dabble in even harder stuff in the offseason, but can do so recreationally. Bringing a legit addict, who continued to smoke knowing the repercussions were tremendous, around people that can handle their stuff can lead to really awkward situations. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 3 minutes ago, BroncosFan2010 said: Bringing a legit addict, who continued to smoke knowing the repercussions were tremendous, around people that can handle their stuff can lead to really awkward situations. 100% agree with you but 1 million is nothing to take a chance on him if he messes up goodbye you aren't getting paid. We spent 1 mill on a worn down Jamal Charles before, 3 million on ir theo. You could do a lot worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 16 minutes ago, thebestever6 said: 100% agree with you but 1 million is nothing to take a chance on him if he messes up goodbye you aren't getting paid. We spent 1 mill on a worn down Jamal Charles before, 3 million on ir theo. You could do a lot worse. Except you also waste snaps on a guy whose likelihood of being a difference maker in 2020+ is nil. And I mean nil. He's going to be 29 next year. He's a shell of his former self. His risk of relapse is nuclear. Sorry, this is an EASY pass IMO. It's not even the weed issue. It's just that he's not that good anymore. Time and the wear and tear on his body have already removed the elite talent he had 5-6 years ago. The fact that he's an addict is just the icing on the cake. The key part is that he's nowhere close to a difference-maker WR even when healthy. The risk just makes it unacceptable regardless of if he's cheap. Bringing up Charles is a great example - we've got to stop thinking about name value - because it's usually based on past performance, on players past their prime. This is exactly the same situation with Gordon. Josh Gordon's last great year was SIX years ago. That's no coincidence. I don't think he'll work out for anyone, let alone us. So an easy "no thanks". Edited October 24, 2019 by Broncofan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 15 minutes ago, Broncofan said: He's going to be 29 next year. He's a shell of his former self. His risk of relapse is nuclear. Sorry, this is an EASY pass IMO. It's not even the weed issue. It's just that he's not that good anymore. Time and the wear and tear on his body have already removed the elite talent he had 5-6 years ago. The fact that he's an addict is just the icing on the cake. The key part is that he's nowhere close to a difference-maker WR even when healthy. The risk just makes it unacceptable regardless of if he's cheap I'm not trying to argue but this is one of the few times your point isn't even fair. Sanu and his ypc is around 11. Josh Gordon's true impact at Wr is deep ball, and Brady has lost some on his deep ball imo. I'm not even making this an idea based on name recognition. This is strictly to grab a potential deep threat the rest of the year anything else is icing on the cake. If/when Lock does play he deserves the best chance at success our number 2 wr is going to be a committee anyway. You say the wrs on our roster are mostly jags outside of Sutton so what's it matter if we get a guy who actually has some experience performing in this league? It can still be a committee approach. This is a low risk high reward signing due to money alone. Edited October 24, 2019 by thebestever6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 9 minutes ago, thebestever6 said: I'm not trying to argue but this is one of the few times your point isn't even fair. Sanu and his ypc is around 11. Josh Gordon's true impact at Wr is deep ball, and Brady has lost some on his deep ball imo. I'm not even making this an idea based on name recognition. This is strictly to grab a potential deep threat the rest of the year anything else is icing on the cake. If/when Lock does play he deserves the best chance at success our number 2 wr is going to be a committee anyway. You say the wrs on our roster are mostly jags outside of Sutton so what's it matter if we get a guy who actually has some experience performing in this league? It can still be a committee approach. My point is Josh Gordon isn't good anymore. That's an entirely fair take that people are in love with the name value of Josh Gordon and ignoring the fact that he's just not guy anymore. Deep ball, short ball, whatever. He's just a risk to waste snaps we use on other guys. Like Winfree. Because Winfree would be cost-controlled and cheap. Our roster is mostly JAG's in the WR area in our vets - but we should give as much time to 2020+ players. Not stopgaps. If you want to argue use Gordon over Tim Patrick or DeSean Hamilton, sure - but the problem is Gordon isn't even a good short area guy (what Hamilton is supposed to take), and we'd be way better letting Winfree show what he has as the intermediate/deep guy. FWIW - Tom Brady is #2 in deep ball completion percentage this year. He's just not having to do it often. But it's no coincidence he's still successful with Philip Dorsett, Edelman & even the rookie UDFA Jakobi Myers. But NOT with Josh Gordon. Josh Gordon isn't that guy anymore. If you don't believe it on Brady - https://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/tom-brady/ Edited October 24, 2019 by Broncofan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Broncofan said: If you don't believe it on Brady - https://www.playerprofiler.com/nfl/tom-brady/ That's fair I don't really know how to read these charts it's just what I see maybe I'm just blind lol. Dorsett was facing lesser corners than Gordon no? Or am I just bsing a point? The number 2 role being split with Winfree is a perfect idea rest of the year imo. Winfree can still grab half the snaps, but not be overwhelmed and still have the ability to learn and process things. Maybe Gordon could be a good mentor ON THE FIELD. It's a rest of season rental to give Drew Lock more options and to get a new weapon engaged into the offense. It's a perfect scenario to help a young rookie have a half decent chance to succeed think Brandon Lloyd. Edited October 24, 2019 by thebestever6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 1 minute ago, thebestever6 said: That's fair I don't really know how to read these charts it's just what I see maybe I'm just blind lol. Dorsett was facing lesser corners than Gordon no? Or am I just bsing a point? The number 2 role being split with Winfree is a perfect idea rest of the year imo. Winfree can still grab half the snaps, but not be overwhelmed and still have the ability to learn and process things. Maybe Gordon could be a good mentor ON THE FIELD. It's a rest of season rental to give Drew Lock more options and to get a new weapon engaged into the offense. Believe me, Josh Gordon isn't drawing special coverage. He's just not that good anymore. More than anything else, that's why NE moved on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Broncofan said: Believe me, Josh Gordon isn't drawing special coverage. He's just not that good anymore. More than anything else, that's why NE moved on. I don't think he's a superbowl champion starting caliber wr if that's your point. I'm just saying I believe for 1 million dollars he adds value to this rebuilding offense. Edited October 24, 2019 by thebestever6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsthomp2007 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 Josh Gordon has missed a lot of football over the years for his drug habits and has gotten older. Could have been special. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, thebestever6 said: I don't think he's a superbowl champion starting caliber wr if that's your point. I'm just saying I believe for 1 million dollars he adds value to this rebuilding offense. I don't agree, because every snap you take from him, you're definitely pushing guys like Winfree & Benson down the ladder. They may only have a 10 percent chance of working out - but they have a 100 percent chance of being cheap for 3 more years if they do, and a 100 percent chance of getting better with more time (the Q is whether is whether it's enough to be a difference-maker). Gordon has a 0 percent chance of being better as time goes by, a really low chance of working out even for this year, and a 0 percent chance of being cheap for 3 more years and improving for those 3 years. You have to factor in the lost opportunity cost, and the lack of future gain in these decisions. The calculus for rebuilders has to factor in future gain. Gordon has none. Edited October 24, 2019 by Broncofan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Broncofan said: I don't agree, because every snap you take from him, you're definitely pushing guys like Winfree & Benson down the ladder. They may only have a 10 percent chance of working out - but they have a 100 percent chance of being cheap for 3 more years if they do, and a 100 percent chance of getting better with more time (the Q is whether is whether it's enough to be a difference-maker). The odds of both of them working out are 10% or one of them? Bc if it's the latter... I'm sorry but I'm not giving my rookie QB a 10 % chance to succeed lol . You saved over 5 million dollars closer to 6 million with the Sanders trade. 1million to Gordon isn't going to end all that can be. Think Brandon lloyd. Edited October 24, 2019 by thebestever6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted October 24, 2019 Author Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 19 minutes ago, thebestever6 said: The odds of both of them working out are 10% or one of them? Bc if it's the latter... I'm sorry but I'm not giving my rookie QB a 10 % chance to succeed lol . You saved over 5 million dollars closer to 6 million with the Sanders trade. 1million to Gordon isn't going to end all that can be. Think Brandon lloyd. Josh Gordon couldn't do it with TB12 but now he's a good bet to succeed this with a rookie QB in a new system. That's a rose-colored take if there ever was one. And let's be clear - we haven't even added the risk. The risk is nuclear. So let's take a WHOLE look here, if you are so stuck on this insane idea (and yes, it's insane - because the entire equation makes it easily so, read on): 1. Gordon wasn't able to be be a difference-maker with TB12. They chose to cut him. Tom Brady is #2 in deep ball completion percentage, but almost all of them weren't to Josh Gordon. His ADOT was 10.0 yards, and his catch rate was 55.6%. Everyone else on the Pats WR corps is much higher at catch rate & ADOT (except Edelman on target distance, for obv reasons). 2. He hasn't been able to stay healthy for several seasons. 3. His risk of relapse is nuclear. He's a self-admitted addict. 4. With weed being legal in COL, there's also no more drug testing for those DEN players who aren't in the NFLPA drug program (testing only happens from late April - early August, and players are in the clear after that if they have 0 strikes) . Every other player who is not in the drug program can smoke as much weed as they want, when they want, until next spring - with ZERO fear of being tested. Gordon is permanently in the program as a result of the Commisioner's reinstatement last year (and what happens when a player reaches the indefinite suspension stage). The likelihood of contact with weed in COL with that situation is as close to 100 percent as you can get. And we haven't even talked about other drugs (where Gordon's admitted problems with drinking and anxiety, too). So let's add up the entire equation as a whole - the 100 percent rational and sane take is that Josh Gordon doesn't belong on the team. There is literally no sane take that says it's a good signing for us. It's literally throwing $1M and all those snaps down the toilet. Moving on to rational discussion. Edited October 24, 2019 by Broncofan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Broncofan said: And let's be clear - we haven't even added the risk. The risk is nuclear. Does new England have a true number 1 that is better than sutton right now? Edelman is a slot guy. Why's the risk nuclear? If he ffs up see ya AB style I'm not saying extend the guy. I'm saying for the rest of 2019 he puts our offense in a better chance to succeed than without him. Winfree/Benson can split some reps with him idk what the coaches see in them. I'll be willing to go 50/50 with Winfree. What he did in new England and why they cut him isn't relevant. He wasn't a superbowl caliber WR/ and 3rd string qb lol I'm conceding to that point. All I'm saying is for the rest of 2019 for the upgrade of our current state minus Sanders, and if he has any juice left it's worth a look at. Edited October 24, 2019 by thebestever6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebestever6 Posted October 24, 2019 Share Posted October 24, 2019 (edited) 47 minutes ago, jsthomp2007 said: Josh Gordon has missed a lot of football over the years for his drug habits and has gotten older. Could have been special. All true he messed up a ton, he's gotten older , he could of been special. Listen, I'm not writing an epitaph on his career that's his job. Yes he's a drug addict, yes he makes bad impulse decisions, yes his skills aren't what they were 5 years ago. You know what I've never heard or read anywhere though? That Josh Gordon is a bad teammate. That's why this discussion for 1 million dollars will remain a logical one. Don't believe me Google search Josh Gordon Bad teammate and all you will find is good teammate. AB on the other hand well we all know. Edited October 24, 2019 by thebestever6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.