Ryan Pace's Future

[WindyCity]

25 minutes ago, beardown3231 said:

I doubt it. He would rather keep his job as HC of the Bears than to be a QB coach of another team for a fifth of the salary. 

He showed he's willing to adapt against the Chargers.

7 games into a season for 3 quarters of the game.

He is not admitting he sucks at calling plays and hiring someone, who interviewed for his job, to replace him.

[beardown3231]

23 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

7 games into a season for 3 quarters of the game.

He is not admitting he sucks at calling plays and hiring someone, who interviewed for his job, to replace him.

Well sure it took him awhile but we can't say he hasn't shown a willingness to change when he literally just did.

I don't think any of us are advocating Flip necessarily, rather just a true OC in general.

[playthrough2001]

Neither of them are getting fired.  Typical, hot take fan reaction...  

The Ravens really blew it by not firing Ozzie Newsome after picking Kyle Boller.  

The margin for error is extremely thin in the NFL between success and failure.  Things went the Bears way last year.  This year they’ve had a tougher ride.  If they win next week, they can still salvage the season.  Pace has built a pretty damn good roster but most likely missed on Trubisky.  Constantly firing coaches and GMs is not the way to build long term organizational success.  It just appeases meathead fans.  Nagy is obviously not a finished product but his team has only lost one game decisively in his tenure.  

Edited October 29, 2019 by playthrough2001

[WindyCity]

2 hours ago, playthrough2001 said:

Neither of them are getting fired.  Typical, hot take fan reaction...  

The Ravens really blew it by not firing Ozzie Newsome after picking Kyle Boller.  

The margin for error is extremely thin in the NFL between success and failure.  Things went the Bears way last year.  This year they’ve had a tougher ride.  If they win next week, they can still salvage the season.  Pace has built a pretty damn good roster but most likely missed on Trubisky.  Constantly firing coaches and GMs is not the way to build long term organizational success.  It just appeases meathead fans.  Nagy is obviously not a finished product but his team has only lost one game decisively in his tenure.  

Ozzie has a decade plus of drafting HOFers and a Super Bowl when he missed on Bowler who was a late teens pick.

Pace blew the biggest and most significant decision he had to make.

I am fine with letting him clean up the mess he made. He is going to get a chance to. With limited cap space, draft picks and not noticeable ability to evaluate QBs good luck to him.

[playthrough2001]

2 hours ago, WindyCity said:

Ozzie has a decade plus of drafting HOFers and a Super Bowl when he missed on Bowler who was a late teens pick.

Pace blew the biggest and most significant decision he had to make.

I am fine with letting him clean up the mess he made. He is going to get a chance to. With limited cap space, draft picks and not noticeable ability to evaluate QBs good luck to him.

Your history on Newsome isn’t quite accurate and Kyle’s name is Boller. 

George McCaskey and the Bears don’t care whether or not you’re “fine” with Pace “cleaning up his mess.”  He and Nagy aren’t going anywhere.

Look at a GM like Elway.  He lucked into Manning but has already missed on a myriad of young QBs.  The evaluation of the position is quite difficult and I’m not sure any drafted prospect that isn’t almost perfect from the beginning won’t be run out of this town in short order.   

[G08]

5 hours ago, playthrough2001 said:

Neither of them are getting fired.  Typical, hot take fan reaction...  

The Ravens really blew it by not firing Ozzie Newsome after picking Kyle Boller.  

The margin for error is extremely thin in the NFL between success and failure.  Things went the Bears way last year.  This year they’ve had a tougher ride.  If they win next week, they can still salvage the season.  Pace has built a pretty damn good roster but most likely missed on Trubisky.  Constantly firing coaches and GMs is not the way to build long term organizational success.  It just appeases meathead fans.  Nagy is obviously not a finished product but his team has only lost one game decisively in his tenure.  

Agreed. You need some semblance of stability within an organization. Pace has done more than enough for me to keep his job. Nagy is in year 2, has a 15-8 regular season record and some fans are calling of his head. It's ******* embarrassing.

[RJ_11]

5 hours ago, G08 said:

Agreed. You need some semblance of stability within an organization. Pace has done more than enough for me to keep his job. Nagy is in year 2, has a 15-8 regular season record and some fans are calling of his head. It's ******* embarrassing.

Yep, I'm pretty surprised at the hate Nagy is getting. Nagy's scheming guys wide open, and Mitch is missing them, this is on the QB. We can't judge Nagy's offense properly when he hasn't had a competent QB running it yet. Finding a QB is so damn hard, Pace has missed on his attempt, but he has built a good, young roster. Both will - deservedly so - be here in 2020. Whether that's the case for other coaches I don't know - Tabor I've never been impressed with, and need to take long looks at Hiestand and Ragone with the way their position groups have regressed.

[soulman]

On 10/28/2019 at 8:00 AM, topwop1 said:

You cannot fire Pace and keep Nagy.  They are pretty much a package deal since Pace will have 2 years remaining and Nagy 3 years remaining after this season with regards to their respective contracts.  You also have to ask the question who would be the GM in the unlikely scenario that Pace is let go and they keep Nagy?  No new GM will want to be tied to a lame duck head coach heading into next season and I don't think Nagy is a head coach you would give GM responsibilities to.

Regardless of what happens the rest of 2019 I believe they will be given another shot next season to right the ship.  2020 will be a make or break year for both.  Book it!

A well thought out and perfectly logical response which is pretty much how we need to view this.....mostly devoid of emotion.

For us the Bears are a sports team with whom we as fans have a strong identity.  For the McCasky's they are a business.  A very valuable business from which they derive their only real wealth and all of their income.  There are no Jerry Jones or Robert Krafts around Halas Hall.  Even in a losing season, or many losing seasons they do not lose money and the value of the franchise grows each year.

As businessmen the McCaskey's are no more likely to pay off Pace and Nagy to leave after only one failed season than they are to ever fire Ted Phillips.  So let's take that one off the table immediately.  Ain't gonna happen especially not when one was the NFL Coach of the Year in 2018 and the GM finished second only to Chris Ballard as the NFL Exec. of the Year.  They would look foolish and they know it.

Topwop1 makes another good point.  If you replace the GM he's stuck with the HC and staff of Pace and we went through this just recently didn't we?  How'd that work?  So firing one without the other is unworkable.  Pace and Nagy are now joined at the hip and very difficult to separate if not impossible.  Plus, who do you bring in in lieu of Pace?  How will you sure they're any better?

As it stands I think Jeff Hughes has reasoned this out quite well in DaBears Blog in the blog of his I posted.  The present problems are all very much QB based and unquestionably it will be up to Pace and Nagy to decide what to do about that AND to forward that plan to Teddy Bears and GMcC either verbally or in writing.  How they plan to recover from this deal is far more important than revisting how we managed to get here in the first place.  In NFL years IMHO that's all somewhat ancient history now.  Over and done.

So my suggestion is that we should also keep ourselves focused on the same thing.  It's like the patient (Bears offense) is very sick.  Maybe even critical.  So how do we make it well again?  Whether I owned the Bears myself (we can all dream can't we) or am just another lowly long time fan that is the only thing we should be interested in right now.  Sure, there are other issues as well but the single biggest issue is the lack of a competent QB and without one we cannot sustain this rebuild and expect to compete for a championship.

Edited October 30, 2019 by soulman

[WindyCity]

4 hours ago, RJ_11 said:

Yep, I'm pretty surprised at the hate Nagy is getting. Nagy's scheming guys wide open, and Mitch is missing them, this is on the QB. We can't judge Nagy's offense properly when he hasn't had a competent QB running it yet. Finding a QB is so damn hard, Pace has missed on his attempt, but he has built a good, young roster. Both will - deservedly so - be here in 2020. Whether that's the case for other coaches I don't know - Tabor I've never been impressed with, and need to take long looks at Hiestand and Ragone with the way their position groups have regressed.

People cannot admit that the QB is a bust so they look for scape goats.

Cutler was way better than Mitch, and we scape goated countless coaches because Cutler was never good enough.

[Nads786]

42 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

People cannot admit that the QB is a bust so they look for scape goats.

Cutler was way better than Mitch, and we scape goated countless coaches because Cutler was never good enough.

I remember last year everyone saying (including me) that Mitch was better than Cutler. His regression is something I haven't seen since Josh Freeman. Let's be real though, Cutler was the definition of an average QB. We really need someone who can be the face of this organization going forward. 

Let's start drafting a QB every year or every other year till we hit. 

[WindyCity]

24 minutes ago, Nads786 said:

I remember last year everyone saying (including me) that Mitch was better than Cutler. His regression is something I haven't seen since Josh Freeman. Let's be real though, Cutler was the definition of an average QB. We really need someone who can be the face of this organization going forward. 

Let's start drafting a QB every year or every other year till we hit. 

Imagine if we do that once we get a GM that knows what a good QB looks like.

[Nads786]

6 minutes ago, WindyCity said:

Imagine if we do that once we get a GM that knows what a good QB looks like.

Well Pace was around Brees for quite some time and he couldn't figure it out. I think it's definitely harder than anyone realizes, mixed with a bath of luck. The Niners had Steve  Young and Joe Montana and still chose Alex Smith over Rogers, a kid who played in their backyard!

[Heinz D.]

8 hours ago, WindyCity said:

Imagine if we do that once we get a GM that knows what a good QB looks like.

That's completely off-base. To conjure up a depiction of Trubisky as a complete reach (like, say, Tim Couch) is entirely wishful thinking on your part. 

Even assuming Trubisky is a complete bust--which you're keen to do, but I'm still hesitant to do--there is absolutely nothing about his overall makeup, skillset, or college tape that indicates Pace made a monumental error in judgement. There IS a difference, whether you'd like to admit it, or not. 

[beardown3231]

4 minutes ago, Heinz D. said:

That's completely off-base. To conjure up a depiction of Trubisky as a complete reach (like, say, Tim Couch) is entirely wishful thinking on your part. 

Even assuming Trubisky is a complete bust--which you're keen to do, but I'm still hesitant to do--there is absolutely nothing about his overall makeup, skillset, or college tape that indicates Pace made a monumental error in judgement. There IS a difference, whether you'd like to admit it, or not. 

Couch threw 36 TD's in 1998 in college. That's a lot for back then. That's like throwing 55 or something now.

Of course there is a difference, but it doesn't make me feel better. Does it make you feel better? Honestly if the Bears had Mahomes they surely win the NFC last year and probably win the entire thing. Same could probably be said for this year. That ******* sucks.

[Nads786]

31 minutes ago, beardown3231 said:

Couch threw 36 TD's in 1998 in college. That's a lot for back then. That's like throwing 55 or something now.

Of course there is a difference, but it doesn't make me feel better. Does it make you feel better? Honestly if the Bears had Mahomes they surely win the NFC last year and probably win the entire thing. Same could probably be said for this year. That ******* sucks.

Yeah that’s exactly how I feel too. It’s a bitter feeling for sure.