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(Poll) The Coaching Search that Wasn't: A Brief Review of Foolery


Mind Character

Is there a Record that Gets Freddie Fired after 1 year?  

24 members have voted

  1. 1. (In Reality) Is there a Record that Actually Gets Freddie Fired after 1 year?

    • Yes; 5-11 and Truckstop Jimmy time is Nigh
    • Yes; 6-10
    • Yes; 7-9 with the wrong losses and poor performances
    • Yes; 8-8 with the wrong losses and poor performances
      0
  2. 2. Is there a Record that Would Make You Personally Believe that We Have to Fire Freddie?

    • Yes; 5-11
    • Yes; 6-10
    • Yes; 7-9 with the wrong losses and poor performances
      0
    • Yes; 8-8 with the wrong losses and poor performances
    • No; we've been through firing 1st year head coaches before and look what that got us ;we should stay the course


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If we fire Freddie, IMO we should seriously look at one of the following:

*Riverboat Ron Rivera (I love him personally but I know many don't)

*Poaching Jim Harbaugh from UM. What would concern me about this is the Harbaugh/Baker personality conflict could be legitimately a problem.

*Josh McDaniels, just so we could fire him immediately.

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Considering that not one of the new hires is going to win a super bowl.

nobody on this board predicted the next new coach to win the super bowl.

Even the rams under the genius want to fire him and draft a new guarterback

I make it a point to not criticize something that I have no suggestion how to improve upon.

Andy Reid had problems in philly and he had problems with Dorsey do you want a head coach that is a proven problem to the front office.

 

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4 hours ago, Mind Character said:

Seriously.. what a joke .. what a F-in mockery.. with each passing day it gets more absurd. I can't believe we had an 8-week jump start on the coaching search and that was the candidate list.

John Dorsey is a good scout of talent (OLineman excluded) and knows how to build a roster, but  running a coaching search and hiring a HC is not one of his strength.

The Haslam's coaching search process and search firms has advised great coaches to hire in the past (i.e., Sean McDermott) the issue being that the Haslams ignored the recommendations.

8 Freakin weeks head start ... and that was the list.. lol.. the fix was in... Freddie presented Dorsey the perfect opportunity to grab power but it will likely to be at the detriment of the team's sustained success.

It was the most important hire in franchise history. We knew what it would cost to reset things. We had to get it right. And we decided to hire a first year HC that had only an 8 game sample size of success as an OC to control the fate of the program for 4 years.

na, mcdermott was the nerd's pick- the search firm picked hue

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Seriously. Tayne was fine with Freddie--wanted Lincoln Riley or Dabo--and skeptical but on board. So many Freddie zealots are abandoning ship. What gives? Yeah, this season has been a mess, but...come on. Like maybe wait until the end of the season to start considering wholesale changes.

We are not trading Beckham. We are going to figure things out.

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5 minutes ago, NudeTayne said:

Seriously. Tayne was fine with Freddie--wanted Lincoln Riley or Dabo--and skeptical but on board. So many Freddie zealots are abandoning ship. What gives? Yeah, this season has been a mess, but...come on. Like maybe wait until the end of the season to start considering wholesale changes.

We are not trading Beckham. We are going to figure things out.

The people who wanted Freddie, could live with his lack of HC exp. and his potential HC miscues as long as the offense was going to pick up where it left off in ‘18. Not only was Freddie looking a lot worst as a HC than truly expected ( IMO I didn’t think he be this bad) but his offense has been down right pathetic at times. You combine those two things, people will want his head. He got hire because of his relationship and what seemed like an idea of how to use him but it seems like he has really stunted Bakers development. Some of that is on Baker and some of that is on Freddie. Freddie could have been hell of a lot harder on him

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Just now, buno67 said:

The people who wanted Freddie, could live with his lack of HC exp. and his potential HC miscues as long as the offense was going to pick up where it left off in ‘18. Not only was Freddie looking a lot worst as a HC than truly expected ( IMO I didn’t think he be this bad) but his offense has been down right pathetic at times. You combine those two things, people will want his head. He got hire because of his relationship and what seemed like an idea of how to use him but it seems like he has really stunted Bakers development. Some of that is on Baker and some of that is on Freddie. Freddie could have been hell of a lot harder on him

Totally agree with this. All that said, we're not even done with one season. Not against canning him by the end of the season if that is the way of it, but the firing talk has been going since like week 6. Things take time. Sick of running the Shanahans and Belichicks our of town before we realize what we have. Freddie should get a year without constant attack about his job. He should be criticized, but it's just been a fitting convo for the most part--seems an overstep at this point, maybe becoming less so a bit, but yeah, way early. 

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41 minutes ago, DaWg_LB. said:

IMO any rookie....HC, GM, Player, ect....should get at least 2 years.

Rookies are young and dont even really understand the nuances and some of the finer points of there new "Position".

That only comes with time and experience.

I agree that rookies need time to grow to their full potential, but look at what other rookie coaches are doing around the league with less than we have. Zac Taylor has his talent-devoid Bengals team buying in and they just stomped the Jets. Brian Flores has the actively-tanking Dolphins playing hard, disciplined football and winning games. Even Kliff Kingsbury has Kyler Murray playing very well for a rookie, despite terrible OL play.

What is Freddie doing? Our offense with 3 elite skill players (OBJ, Chubb, Hunt) and 1 great skill player (Jarvis) with a QB who BROKE THE ROOKIE PASSING TD RECORD last year looks abysmal in over half their games. The team is completely undisciplined and soft. Freddie comes off completely clueless and in over his head. Freddie needs to go after the season.

Not saying he can never be a good head coach, because I think he can one day. He's still very young (early or mid 40s I think). I think he needs a situation where he can be an associate head coach and learn under someone (I could see him going to Tampa Bay and being Arians' understudy again)

With the personalities on this team, we need a strong leader who stresses discipline. I know he's the hot name right now because he just got fired but Ron Rivera would actually be pretty perfect for this team. And the defensive side of the ball would basically be untouched (same scheme, same coordinator, most of the same assistants, etc) Then give the offense over to Monken.

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2 hours ago, NudeTayne said:

Seriously. Tayne was fine with Freddie--wanted Lincoln Riley or Dabo--and skeptical but on board. So many Freddie zealots are abandoning ship. What gives? Yeah, this season has been a mess, but...come on. Like maybe wait until the end of the season to start considering wholesale changes.

I agree.

If you were a Freddie zealot before given all the information given at the time, then don't abandon ship now.

I for one was never that and advocated strongly for a Head Coach with a track record of successful winning culture building.

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You have to wonder (if the rumor is true that Randall wouldn't practice because it was cold outside) if he would have pulled the same garbage on a Mike McCarthy.  It's obviously quite cold in Wisconsin, and there hasn't been any rumors of this before.  I have to agree with Mind that we needed (need) a strong leader for this group of players.  The big worry before the season was if Freddie could handle all the personalities.  I am not so sure that he has done that.

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2 hours ago, DaWg_LB. said:

Give Freddie a Chance.....we all loved him...we felt he was the "Right man for the Job"......and we get mad that he looks like a rookie HC?

"we felt he was the right man for the job." Speak for yourself and your brethren. 

There were those of us that preferred an experienced coach with credentials and experience building a winning culture to lead the organization. Our particular "We" was worried about handing over the keys to the franchise to a life-long position coach with a successful 8 game sample size run as an Offensive Coordinator against some mostly bad defenses when the primary skills of a successful Head Coach have little to do with play-calling prowess.

It's not about looking like a rookie HC as many rookie HCs from day 1 show and prove that they can implement a culture and skills development program at a high-level. They have the "it" factor. Frank Reich, Sean McDermott, Kyle Shannahan, are "it" factor HCs that even through the ups and downs and learning curve mistakes still had "it." Nothing is ever certain it's hard to see Freddie with and of the longterm winning "it" factors either as HC or OC right now. 

I hope like heck I'm wrong.

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7 hours ago, buno67 said:

I really don’t think that is that bad of a list tho. Flores is looking good in Miami even tho the FO isn’t trying to win. He might have been a great hire. 
 

To me it just seemed like Dorsey wanted a younger coach that could grow with Baker and that’s what the list kinda looks like. 

For the first time in Eons, the Browns had the most coveted job on the NFL market. 

You had the likes of Josh Daniels, Bruce Arians, and Mike McCarthy publicly advertising/advocating through the media their desire to coach Baker and this team. They weren't the only ones to do so publicly and they sure as heck weren't the only one's to do so privately.

Flores looks okay ... we'll know in time, but objectively that list was bad man. And that's the opinion of people in and around the NFL when they saw that our list did not include successful culture builders in their eye. 

More than the "Dorsey wanted a younger coach that could grow with Baker" it looks more like "Dorsey wanted a young coach that would submit to his assistant coach hire desires and give Dorsey the power in the organization so he couldn't be fired by a coach with power like Andy Reid"

1.) Gregg Williams, 2.) Brian Flores, 3.) Matt Eberflus, 4.) Jim Caldwell, 5.) Kevin Stefanski, 6.) Dan Campbell, 7.) Freddie Kitchens, 8.) Requested to interview but did not formally interview Nick Sirianni

There are plenty of young coaches out there that could "grow with Baker" that have a winning track record of being a Head Coach.

I'll always just have a hard time believing that those 7 men (really just 6 because Gregg was a lame duck) were truly the most qualified and best candidates for the biggest hire in franchise history.

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On 12/4/2019 at 2:58 PM, Mind Character said:

"we felt he was the right man for the job." Speak for yourself and your brethren. 

There were those of us that preferred an experienced coach with credentials and experience building a winning culture to lead the organization. Our particular "We" was worried about handing over the keys to the franchise to a life-long position coach with a successful 8 game sample size run as an Offensive Coordinator against some mostly bad defenses when the primary skills of a successful Head Coach have little to do with play-calling prowess.

It's not about looking like a rookie HC as many rookie HCs from day 1 show and prove that they can implement a culture and skills development program at a high-level. They have the "it" factor. Frank Reich, Sean McDermott, Kyle Shannahan, are "it" factor HCs that even through the ups and downs and learning curve mistakes still had "it." Nothing is ever certain it's hard to see Freddie with and of the longterm winning "it" factors either as HC or OC right now. 

I hope like heck I'm wrong.

I understand where your coming from and as we all know, the Brothers in here are never united 100% on anything...that is what makes this a beautiful thing, and facilitates the exchange of idea's and points of view. The only thing I saw this room get 100% on was getting Joe Thomas to visit Crackburn in the Hospital before he passed away. 

The "We" I speak of is to my knowledge...and correct me if I am wrong....was the VAST majority of the Brothers in here. I personally did not see one person say, I hate Freddie Kitchens, I think he's incompetent and there is no way he should be the head coach....different folks like him for different reasons, but even those that didnt like him, would say something more along the lines of, "Having a young coach worries me, and I think there could be a better person for the job"....which is a lot different than my previously  mentioned statement.

I understand some of the venom and frustration coming out, from some.....but for a person to go from the saying the second statement to now saying, they were ALWAY's saying the first statement (about not liking Freddie and thinking there is on way he could be successful) is a bit disingenuous.

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