(Poll) The Coaching Search that Wasn't: A Brief Review of Foolery

[Rod Johnson]

2 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

Yes and no.

He’s Dorsey’s hire at the end of the day and if he shts the bed that inevitably reflects on Dorsey.

He's going to buffer Dorsey though, especially since he's so aggressive and the perception will be he's created a talent loaded team.  First Kitchens will be fired, then we will hire somebody else, then possibly Dorsey's job will be in jeopardy.

I mean not many in the media are questioning any of the moves he made this season after showering him with praise all off-season.  There is this idea that our offense will take off just because we added OBJ like LeBron adding AD was always a bit of a hyperbole.  He's playing well, not good by his standards though, and it's a totally different sport.  WRs can be taken out of the game by good defenses, meanwhile our guard is getting pushed into Baker's lap and we didn't upgrade anywhere up front.  Freddie isn't performing well by any means, but there's more to it.

 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

36 minutes ago, Rod Johnson said:

He's going to buffer Dorsey though, especially since he's so aggressive and the perception will be he's created a talent loaded team.  First Kitchens will be fired, then we will hire somebody else, then possibly Dorsey's job will be in jeopardy.

I mean not many in the media are questioning any of the moves he made this season after showering him with praise all off-season.  There is this idea that our offense will take off just because we added OBJ like LeBron adding AD was always a bit of a hyperbole.  He's playing well, not good by his standards though, and it's a totally different sport.  WRs can be taken out of the game by good defenses, meanwhile our guard is getting pushed into Baker's lap and we didn't upgrade anywhere up front.  Freddie isn't performing well by any means, but there's more to it.

 

I completely agree.

[roger murdock]

1 hour ago, candyman93 said:

This is a fair question to ask: What have you seen from Freddie Kitchens that leads you to believe he deserves to be a HC?
 

 

We are on pace to break a NFL record for penalties committed. This roster is better than last years roster and are worse in every offensive category than we were by this point last year.

I wouldn't have even interviewed him last offseason. He didn't deserve it and the only logical reason for hiring him as Head Coach was 'what if hes so good as an offensive coordinator the new few years that he gets hired somewhere else?' ------ ummmmmm doesn't the mean we won big?

 

Instead we lost a good OC and gained the worst head coach I've ever seen. It was laughable to hire him. He'll be a running backs coach for some crap team next year and will never get a HC interview again.

[NateDawg]

I’m going to be so pissed if we fire Dorsey and the coaching staff and start all over again. Despite the record, we have the talent to start putting something together finally. No complete overhaul is needed. At least not at this point in my mind. Just quit trading our upcoming 5th round products and we’re good Dors.

[matt27j]

 

I believe he was the right hire but if there is a veteran option this offseason...

Kitchens is a good oc, but that is nullified by the penalties and to's. Eliminate those and we'll finish season strong.

Don't and we can find someone who will. Maybe they'll have a vanilla offense but with obj and Chubb out may not matter all that much.

 

[MWil23]

2019 Baker Mayfield is 41 year old Brett Favre without the TD passes to go with it. 

[NateDawg]

9 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

2019 Baker Mayfield is 41 year old Brett Favre without the TD passes to go with it. 

*crunches #s*

6 TDs and 12 Ints 

It checks out. 

This is so depressing. There are many reasons for the decline, but with such a steep drop from last year and watching him play this season, a chunk of that is clearly on him and seemingly his off-season prep. He just hasn’t had the edge he seemed to last year. 

[MWil23]

13 minutes ago, NateDawg said:

*crunches #s*

6 TDs and 12 Ints 

It checks out. 

This is so depressing. There are many reasons for the decline, but with such a steep drop from last year and watching him play this season, a chunk of that is clearly on him and seemingly his off-season prep. He just hasn’t had the edge he seemed to last year. 

As good of a rookie season as he had, he was still good for right at a turnover + a game last year, so a lot of the issues we are seeing this year were masked by a lot of TD passes as a rookie. Some of the signs were there, albeit not this kind of regression on a completion % and TD ratio standpoint. He looks like he's bored/unmotivated/disinterested on the field. Hopefully this year is a wake up call for him down the stretch and especially in the offseason. He needs to take extra time and reps for timing with his WR in the offseason, digest the playbook, and care less about "his brand".

Here's the reality:

He's not an underdog anymore. He was the #1 pick in the draft and expectations are high. This "nobody believes in me/me against the world" campaign isn't a reality. Expectations are rightfully lofty. It's put up or shut up time.

[dawgdish]

On 10/28/2019 at 12:59 PM, pnies20 said:

The shovel pass was a dumbfounding play call given the circumstances.

Raining, already fumbled twice.... why run a high risk play like that.

I don't blame the play call here, I blame Baker not recognizing what was happening literally 3 feet in front of him and releasing the ball. 2nd year guy, and obviously the game is still moving too fast for him in many cases, as a lot of the turnovers (the ones that haven't bounced off receivers hands, of which there are many) look like him making up his mind pre-snap and forcing things.

[MarkPrice25]

https://zonecoverage.com/2019/vikings/why-kevin-stefanski-might-be-the-nfls-next-great-offensive-coach/

In the great Browns tradition (Wimbley vs Ngata, Coleman vs Thomas, Manziel vs anyone else) did we end up picking the wrong guy?

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

3 hours ago, dawgdish said:

I don't blame the play call here, I blame Baker not recognizing what was happening literally 3 feet in front of him and releasing the ball. 2nd year guy, and obviously the game is still moving too fast for him in many cases, as a lot of the turnovers (the ones that haven't bounced off receivers hands, of which there are many) look like him making up his mind pre-snap and forcing things.

I hear ya, but that’s a timing play that doesn’t allow for much wiggle room.

The issue is a DL managed to get into the backfield and have his hands free in the same amount of time it took for Baker to catch the snap and toss it forward.  How the hell does that happen??  The OL didn’t even bother to get in his way.

I don’t blame Baker or the play call tbh, I blame whoever the OL was who got curbstomped.

[Thomas5737]

7 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I hear ya, but that’s a timing play that doesn’t allow for much wiggle room.

The issue is a DL managed to get into the backfield and have his hands free in the same amount of time it took for Baker to catch the snap and toss it forward.  How the hell does that happen??  The OL didn’t even bother to get in his way.

I don’t blame Baker or the play call tbh, I blame whoever the OL was who got curbstomped.

Yeah, that was Bitonio. He didn't get curb stomped he stepped forward for some reason and by the time he recovered he pushed Guy right into Landry which obviously busted up the play and gave him position. If that wouldn't have happened and Landry cut inside of McCray's attempted block after catching the shovel pass it is probably at least an 8 yard gain and potentially a really big play. Bitonio just made a misstep and there was no time to recover,

[Mind Character]

3 hours ago, MarkPrice25 said:

https://zonecoverage.com/2019/vikings/why-kevin-stefanski-might-be-the-nfls-next-great-offensive-coach/

In the great Browns tradition (Wimbley vs Ngata, Coleman vs Thomas, Manziel vs anyone else) did we end up picking the wrong guy?

I don't think Kevin Stefanski should've been our HC b/c his offensive play-calling or scheme is better than Freddie's but I think that based on all information available out there he has more depth and true program leader qualities to have served as a better HC than Freddie imo.

To be clear though, Stefanski wouldn't have been a home-run hire either, and it makes sense that the Browns were willing to bet on a 1st year head coach coordinator they know they know versus one they don't.

We should've looked beyond both Freddie and Kevin though imo.

[Mind Character]

On 10/28/2019 at 12:38 PM, Mind Character said:

1.) Gregg Williams, 2.) Brian Flores, 3.) Matt Eberflus, 4.) Jim Caldwell, 5.) Kevin Stefanski, 6.) Dan Campbell, 7.) Freddie Kitchens, 8.) Requested to interview but did not formally interview Nick Sirianni

Seriously.. what a joke .. what a F-in mockery.. with each passing day it gets more absurd. I can't believe we had an 8-week jump start on the coaching search and that was the candidate list.

John Dorsey is a good scout of talent (OLineman excluded) and knows how to build a roster, but  running a coaching search and hiring a HC is not one of his strength.

The Haslam's coaching search process and search firms has advised great coaches to hire in the past (i.e., Sean McDermott) the issue being that the Haslams ignored the recommendations.

8 Freakin weeks head start ... and that was the list.. lol.. the fix was in... Freddie presented Dorsey the perfect opportunity to grab power but it will likely to be at the detriment of the team's sustained success.

It was the most important hire in franchise history. We knew what it would cost to reset things. We had to get it right. And we decided to hire a first year HC that had only an 8 game sample size of success as an OC to control the fate of the program for 4 years.

Edited December 4, 2019 by Mind Character

[buno67]

35 minutes ago, Mind Character said:

Seriously.. what a joke .. what a F-in mockery.. with each passing day it gets more absurd. I can't believe we had an 8-week jump start on the coaching search and that was the candidate list.

John Dorsey is a good scout of talent (OLineman excluded) and knows how to build a roster, but  running a coaching search and hiring a HC is not one of his strength.

The Haslam's coaching search process and search firms has advised great coaches to hire in the past (i.e., Sean McDermott) the issue being that the Haslams ignored the recommendations.

8 Freakin weeks head start ... and that was the list.. lol.. the fix was in... Freddie presented Dorsey the perfect opportunity to grab power but it will likely to be at the detriment of the team's sustained success.

It was the most important hire in franchise history. We knew what it would cost to reset things. We had to get it right. And we decided to hire a first year HC that had only an 8 game sample size of success as an OC to control the fate of the program for 4 years.

I really don’t think that is that bad of a list tho. Flores is looking good in Miami even tho the FO isn’t trying to win. He might have been a great hire. 
 

To me it just seemed like Dorsey wanted a younger coach that could grow with Baker and that’s what the list kinda looks like.