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Jimmy Garoppolo Appreciation Thread


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5 minutes ago, TecmoSuperJoe said:

I took the initiative elsewhere. Now I'm curious. :)

Your poll was umm....disingenuous given the biggest component was left out (that salaries are not equal) 

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3 minutes ago, Forge said:

Your poll was umm....disingenuous given the biggest component was left out (that salaries are not equal) 

I was just talking about ability personally. But ok, we'll roll with your take on the thread. I don't really care :) 

Edited by TecmoSuperJoe
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Just now, TecmoSuperJoe said:

I was just talking about ability personally. But ok, we'll roll with your take on the thread. I don't really care :) 

Well nobody is in here advocating for Jameis  >  Jimmy if the price tag is the same lol. Whats the point of that? The whole point is to make the position more cost effective lol. 

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4 minutes ago, Forge said:

Well nobody is in here advocating for Jameis  >  Jimmy if the price tag is the same lol. Whats the point of that? The whole point is to make the position more cost effective lol. 

Well Forge, I'd certainly hope not. But I wanted to be sure. And not just restricted to this corner of the forum. 

James has a good arm. He's just a doofus. People for some reason, financials be damned, might want to see what Shanahan could do with him even if the price tags were closer in gap just for the chance to get a better starter at the position. 

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6 hours ago, John232 said:

I was making an edit.

 

Why would he do that? Why would we do that? I don't see the incentive to ask him to take a  serious paycut. I mean, this is a negotiation thing, so who knows what gets said at the table. But if I'm Jimmy, with my injury history..there is no effin way I take a paycut. I'd rather be cut. 

I like to take credit for coming up with the idea of the pay cut. I suggested it on the podcast what feels like months ago at this point. 

Basically, is there another team out there who will pay Jimmy 25m?? Does a guy who got paid 85 million over the last three seasons prefer to stay with one of the best coaches in the NFL, with a top 2 TE, with two good young wrs, with the run game/defense we have, in a place it doesn't snow? Or does he want to go make an extra couple million with some other team somewhere else? 

There can be a legitimate argument to be made that we paid him 41,000,000 to go on IR in 2018 and another 25,000,000 this year for him to miss a bunch of games and then to play like garbage when he did play, so therefore he needs to take less money for one season to keep the team together considering the salary cap went down.

Pretty simple to me "we didn't expect the salary cap to dip so we need you to take a pay cut. We like you but you need to play better and what you showed us in 2020 is not who we think you are, but we need to take care of your LT, Fred Warner, and need to spend some money on a corner" 

If he isn't on board with that, then we take our lumps with a toolsy rookie 

Edited by N4L
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22 minutes ago, N4L said:

I like to take credit for coming up with the idea of the pay cut. I suggested it on the podcast what feels like months ago at this point. 

Basically, is there another team out there who will pay Jimmy 25m?? Does a guy who got paid 85 million over the last three seasons prefer to stay with one of the best coaches in the NFL, with a top 2 TE, with two good young wrs, with the run game/defense we have, in a place it doesn't snow? Or does he want to go make an extra couple million with some other team somewhere else? 

There can be a legitimate argument to be made that we paid him 41,000,000 to go on IR in 2018 and another 25,000,000 this year for him to miss a bunch of games and then to play like garbage when he did play, so therefore he needs to take less money for one season to keep the team together considering the salary cap went down.

Pretty simple to me "we didn't expect the salary cap to dip so we need you to take a pay cut. We like you but you need to play better and what you showed us in 2020 is not who we think you are, but we need to take care of your LT, Fred Warner, and need to spend some money on a corner" 

If he isn't on board with that, then we take our lumps with a toolsy rookie 

Barrows addressed that in a mailbag not to long ago, I wondered if you sent in the question lol

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1 hour ago, N4L said:

If he isn't on board with that, then we take our lumps with a toolsy rookie 

As long as we are drafting a guy, I don't care much either way. Seriously. Jet could be our qb next year. The qb we need to win the super bowl isn't on the roster, isn't likely someone we can acquire in free agency. I'm not even sure it's a guy we can trade for. Have to get that friendly cap hit

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9 hours ago, TecmoSuperJoe said:

Well Forge, I'd certainly hope not. But I wanted to be sure. And not just restricted to this corner of the forum. 

James has a good arm. He's just a doofus. People for some reason, financials be damned, might want to see what Shanahan could do with him even if the price tags were closer in gap just for the chance to get a better starter at the position. 

Well he didn't fare off too well under Arians unless you look at the 30/30 club as progress. He also isn't starting in NO so shouldn't that tell us something too?

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3 hours ago, NcFinest9erFan said:

Well he didn't fare off too well under Arians unless you look at the 30/30 club as progress. He also isn't starting in NO so shouldn't that tell us something too?

Its subjective, and really depends on how much emphasis you want to place on these ideas I'm about to spout on about in  your evaluation, but I've actually addressed these both. One, Shanny and Arians' system are some pretty far off extemes in their current incarnation. Arians' history has always been hard on QBs and their INT totals. Luck and Palmer both were among the league leaders ints with Arians in their first years and set career highs they never broke, just like Winston. Palmer threw 22, Luck 18. Not as bad as Winston, but i don't think anyone thinks that Winston is the better QB, so that makes sense. The question is more or less what happens when he goes from one extreme under Arians having him chuck the ball down field 10+ yards down the field each throw to a far more QB friendly scheme that makes him throw the ball 3+ yards shorter to schemed open guys. We think Shanny is great, but for whatever reason aren't crediting him with an ability to improve Winston in that regard and I find that weird. I posted it in the GDT before, but Jimmy has a 10% INT rate when throwing the ball 15 yards down field, how many INTs is he putting up in Arians system that forces him to consistently make those throws? I think these nuances certainly matter. Before Arians, Winston's INT rate was 3%. Jimmy's is 2.9% under Shanny right now. Before Winston collapsed into himself last year, that difference is pretty negligible. I do dislike that Winston struggled in back to back years...that's probably the biggest thing for me. His season before Arians wasn't good either. But its not like we have Jimmy out here progressing either, and Winston is better about staying healthy. 

With regards to the Saints...it's a damning look unless you realize their contract situation and the fact that it almost has to be Hill starting next year because they're way beyond capped out and have already dedicated a weirdly high amount of money to him for next season, so it makes sense that they would give him the start. I have no idea if that is true or not, but could 100% be a reason for making that move. He had 0 starts in his career and is likely going to be the starter next year, so they may want to prep him. Again, I have no idea if that is true or was a factor in their decision making, it just makes a ton of sense if it would

For me, there is enough there to make me willing to take a chance on Winston at a much lower salary than having Jimmy back for another year, but it's not really about Winston. Different people have different guys. You may not want to take a shot at Winston, but may want to take a shot on Darnold or Wentz or whomever. Don't get too hung up on the Winston thing too much...he's just the whipping boy in this particular instance. 

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1 hour ago, Forge said:

Its subjective, and really depends on how much emphasis you want to place on these ideas I'm about to spout on about in  your evaluation, but I've actually addressed these both. One, Shanny and Arians' system are some pretty far off extemes in their current incarnation. Arians' history has always been hard on QBs and their INT totals. Luck and Palmer both were among the league leaders ints with Arians in their first years and set career highs they never broke, just like Winston. Palmer threw 22, Luck 18. Not as bad as Winston, but i don't think anyone thinks that Winston is the better QB, so that makes sense. The question is more or less what happens when he goes from one extreme under Arians having him chuck the ball down field 10+ yards down the field each throw to a far more QB friendly scheme that makes him throw the ball 3+ yards shorter to schemed open guys. We think Shanny is great, but for whatever reason aren't crediting him with an ability to improve Winston in that regard and I find that weird. I posted it in the GDT before, but Jimmy has a 10% INT rate when throwing the ball 15 yards down field, how many INTs is he putting up in Arians system that forces him to consistently make those throws? I think these nuances certainly matter. Before Arians, Winston's INT rate was 3%. Jimmy's is 2.9% under Shanny right now. Before Winston collapsed into himself last year, that difference is pretty negligible. I do dislike that Winston struggled in back to back years...that's probably the biggest thing for me. His season before Arians wasn't good either. But its not like we have Jimmy out here progressing either, and Winston is better about staying healthy. 

With regards to the Saints...it's a damning look unless you realize their contract situation and the fact that it almost has to be Hill starting next year because they're way beyond capped out and have already dedicated a weirdly high amount of money to him for next season, so it makes sense that they would give him the start. I have no idea if that is true or not, but could 100% be a reason for making that move. He had 0 starts in his career and is likely going to be the starter next year, so they may want to prep him. Again, I have no idea if that is true or was a factor in their decision making, it just makes a ton of sense if it would

For me, there is enough there to make me willing to take a chance on Winston at a much lower salary than having Jimmy back for another year, but it's not really about Winston. Different people have different guys. You may not want to take a shot at Winston, but may want to take a shot on Darnold or Wentz or whomever. Don't get too hung up on the Winston thing too much...he's just the whipping boy in this particular instance. 

You don't see giving my standing ovation....but I am

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8 hours ago, NcFinest9erFan said:

Well he didn't fare off too well under Arians unless you look at the 30/30 club as progress. He also isn't starting in NO so shouldn't that tell us something too?

True. And he didn't fare well under Koetter who had success with Ryan, and Payton has immediately demoted him to third string. In Tampa, he also had maybe the best group of receivers for a while. 

Edited by TecmoSuperJoe
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  • 2 weeks later...

Lots of Jimmy talk today. Don't like the bolded here though. If we keep him, we are going to restructure him, I think.

“Jimmy’s one of the middle quarterbacks in the league right now in terms of salary,” he said. “That’s just how much they cost. So it’s not like it’s something ridiculous or anything like that. So we can work all that out. And, not to mention, look at Jimmy’s record when he’s been here. Jimmy, you can win with. He’s proven that. And he’s proven he’s a starting quarterback in this league.”

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Also....LOL....

When asked about Garoppolo’s long injury history and the need to bolster the backup spot, Shanahan noted that even starter-quality backups are expensive. He seemed to indicate he’d be fine with C.J. Beathard or Nick Mullens in that position for another season.

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6 hours ago, Forge said:

Also....LOL....

When asked about Garoppolo’s long injury history and the need to bolster the backup spot, Shanahan noted that even starter-quality backups are expensive. He seemed to indicate he’d be fine with C.J. Beathard or Nick Mullens in that position for another season.

 

There is no way I'm going to believe that until it happens. If it's ONE takeaway from this season that should be very clear to Kyle is the need to upgrade the talent@back-up QB.

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